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Wonder Woman General Discussion Thread

Ww vs characters

Atrocitus: 4-6
Aquaman: 5-5 or 4-6
Batman: 5-5
Bane: 6-4
Black Adam: 5-5
Black Canary: 6-4
Brainiac: 6-4
Captain Cold: 6-4
Catwoman: 6-4
Cheetah: 6-4
Darkseid: 5-5
Deadshot: 4-6
Doctor Fate: 6-4 or 5-5
Flash: 6-4
Grodd: 6-4
Green Lantern: 4-6
Harley: 5-5
Robin: 6-4
Supergirl: 5-5
Superman: 6-4
Swamp Thing: 6-4
Wonder woman: 5-5

@Akromaniac27 how do you deal against atro ? His trait is really strong. Have a good neutral.
It seems everyone is leaving out scarecrow. I'd say it's a 5-5 if not slightly in his favor.
 

Thingy

Retired account
Why must everything be overly normalized with WoWo??? F2s start up makes me salty AF.

If NRS wants to salvage this character, she needs a non random trait. And if that is out of the question, increase the odds of getting air dash. This character needs serious help.
 

TheGabStandard

The anticipation is killing me
A curious question since most people are asking for it. Would the ability to choose trait significantly change MUs that much? Obviously every little helps but I wonder if it is that big of a dealbreaker.
 

xWEBSx

Too old for this Shit
Dear Wonder Woman Community,

First let me start by saying, I am sorry for this sad excuse of a character they gave you. I appreciate your tenacity, and your thirst to break her open and tech the hades out of her. Let me warn you, unless some MAJOR, and I mean MAJOR tech surfaces, or NRS guts her, or at least buffs the hades out of her- it looks like everyone's favorite Amazon Princess is destined for mid to low tier.
Second, let me say that mid to low tier does not mean shit tier by any means, it just means you have to WORK for your wins, and not play with one hand while eating a bag of cheetos with the other and negate 60% health with a 12 hit combos (I'm looking at you Adam and Arthur).
Lastly let me end with a potential warning of things that could come.. as a long time fighting enthusiast and long time mid tier hero- expect a lot of dissension in your ranks- a lot of really good players to try really hard with her, only to get SOOOO frustrated they say fuck it and end up jumping ship completely. It basically comes down to- why do I have to try so damn hard to work this win, when I can just X with Y and go ezmode pro? The frustration does build in this type of atmosphere- so please try to work together and not tear each other apart.

All is not lost. That is the true test of the community.

I feel she has her niche, but I feel she has to work WAYYYYYYY too hard to fulfill that role. I will miss playing against a truely wonderful advisary (previously) and hope there is something NRS can do in the future to help her out.

In all honesty and sincerity guys/gals.. I'm sorry.
 

LordXav1er

Hero Of Rhode Island
I wouldn't mind random trait as long as Air Dash was available to us at all times as that one doesn't make sense for her to call upon a god for a buff.

I'm more frustrated that bracelets don't REFLECT this would be huge for WW and actually make sense. Even if the first one didn't but during the buff it was a reflect too I'd be ok with that.

Our whip is pretty much our best tool no real complaint there. Maybe possible to add in air DF1. Considering we have no more air dash.

Sheild moves are next in line fairly solid.

Her strings are ok too but maybe need one more feels like we have the least.
 

portent

Noob
As a WW player myself, I think she needs a few things:

1. Give her back her air dash as a normal move
2. Reduce startup of F2 to create F2(low) or B2(oh) 50/50 scenario
3. If no F2 startup reduction, give her a dash cancel out of F2 similar to Jax MK9 ground pound cancel
 
She feels like Balanced Kenshi and thats not a good thing lmao

I like the concept of a character not relient on plus frames and 50/50s, but a character like that should have good reward. Currently I can play Robin and whiff punish with b2 for 30~% with meter.

I whiff punish with WW b2 and I get like 15%. Kay
 

Gooberking

FGC Cannon Fodder
For everyone that keeps asking for projectile reflection, is the expectation that parry would change to reflect or are people asking for a parry + reflect move?
 
Personally I don't need them to reflect back at the opponent. She could reflect them in the air or to the ground or behind her for all I care. Just reflect it. I never liked that it looked like she ABSORBS the projectiles.
 

xWEBSx

Too old for this Shit
Personally I don't need them to reflect back at the opponent. She could reflect them in the air or to the ground or behind her for all I care. Just reflect it. I never liked that it looked like she ABSORBS the projectiles.
Her bracelets should only have a recovery if she misses the projectile or bracelets air, if she absorbs a projectile, it should be instantly ready to go again- which would make user a true threat to Zoners, "I DARE YOU TO SHOOT"..while playing the- an I or am I not going to shoot? While trying to get in. The fact that she has to recover EACH and every time - hell, the move may as well NOT even exsist. You can pluck ONE Deadshot bullet in a hale of 20 straight.... see where I'm going here?
 

Gooberking

FGC Cannon Fodder
Personally I don't need them to reflect back at the opponent. She could reflect them in the air or to the ground or behind her for all I care. Just reflect it. I never liked that it looked like she ABSORBS the projectiles.
Yeah, but this is a game and one where if you have something it should do something or meet some need. People keep wanting them to reflect because it's more harmonious with the character lore, but I personally would think that would be a functional downgrade by losing the parry.

Asking for parry + reflection mean we have something I think would be new and kinda of questionable power.

If there could be a visual deflection effect on projectiles, that could be fine but some body is still going to think it's weird you can't Kitana their ass. I'm trying to get people to fully verbalize what they are actually asking for, because I feel like it's a lot of make it like the comics talk without much thought about what that means for the character in the game. Things have to be fully reconciled and I don't think the request is thought out by a lot of the people asking for it.

Maybe I'm wrong. Just me being curious.
 

Stanlos

Noob
For everyone that keeps asking for projectile reflection, is the expectation that parry would change to reflect or are people asking for a parry + reflect move?
The latter. Her parry should return projectiles--it is a famous and basic WW move. If they want to return her shield parry for melees I am okay with that as it fits their purported desire to give her access to all her weapons but they could achieve the same thing with her bracelets.

My perspective is that of a DC Comics fan entering into this NRS video game based on the DC license. So my expectations are driven by my familiarity with the lore. WW's powers are superspeed (A2), superstrength, (A1), invulnerability (A1), and flight (A2) and she has these powers all the time; they are inborn. She also has a host of weapons and skills most notably her lasso, bracelets and tiara. She sometimes visits her arsenal and wields some of the stuff in there (shields, axes, swords, spears, etc) from various pantheons and affiliations.

If I pick up a game with a character called Wonder Woman in it, I expect to see her fly, I expect that her damage output would be among the two highest in the game since in the verse she and Superman are rated A1 in that area and are the strongest and most powerful. I expect her moves to demonstrate her superspeed (her, Supes, and Flash are the fastest heroes in the verse), and I expect that whoever designs the game would visit the comics to get an idea of their typical attacks similar to the way that Snowblind did when they created JUSTICE LEAGUE HEROES. Every hero in that game played differently and played in a manner reminiscent of their comics and cartoon iterations. This has not happened with Wonder Woman with any of the NRS titles (though it very much has happened with Batman and Superman).

It is a big mystery to me that Wonder Woman has no ground stomp into pop-up combo type move though she routinely heel taps the ground to send mobs into the air after which she tiaras or lassos them together with sufficient force to KO them. Also bizarre is that she no lasso containment move (but Batman does even though that is not what he does with his grappel--his crowd control device is the Batswarm and it has appeared in the movies and the JL cartoons). She also has no low hitting lasso move though she routinely lasso's opponents feet and sling them around. Her thow does not use her lasso or her flight or leverage any of her BDSM tones.

Of the cast WW is the only character who has literally thrown something into the sun from earth. Yet she is the one who no full screen projectile (and no trick projectile though she was always ricocheting it Pre-Crisis and in the Gail Simone run she use that element a ton--so how do they miss it?).

NRS has armoured moves and yet WW does not have an armoured charge move where she charges forward with bracelets crossed ignoring incoming attacks despite doing this all the time in her books. When her bracelets are crossed she takes no damage and there literally is NOTHING they don't deflect.

But none of this basic beginner WW stuff is in her design by NRS.

It makes no sense and is endlessly frustrating.

Credit where it is due: NRS has improved with her from the first NRS game MK vs DC Universe. In that one they put the most minimum effort into the character.

But she deserves far better treatment than what she has been given and the only reason I have a PS4 is to play her. Imagine the extent of my disappointment? And mine is mild. My sister is BEYOND p!ssed off. She may not ever play again.
 
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Stanlos

Noob
Personally I don't need them to reflect back at the opponent. She could reflect them in the air or to the ground or behind her for all I care. Just reflect it. I never liked that it looked like she ABSORBS the projectiles.
I think you should be able to put a directional input to send the deflected energy or projectile to high, low, or mid. WW uses her superspeed in connection with her skill to aim each and every deflection.
 

Stanlos

Noob
Yeah, but this is a game and one where if you have something it should do something or meet some need. People keep wanting them to reflect because it's more harmonious with the character lore, but I personally would think that would be a functional downgrade by losing the parry.

Asking for parry + reflection mean we have something I think would be new and kinda of questionable power.

.
I thought it (as well as tricking with the tiara) would fit right into NRS wheelhouse given Nightwolf's glow shield reflect and Jade's trick projectiles from Ultimate MK3. But boy was I wrong!
 

Stanlos

Noob
Her bracelets should only have a recovery if she misses the projectile or bracelets air, if she absorbs a projectile, it should be instantly ready to go again- which would make user a true threat to Zoners, "I DARE YOU TO SHOOT"..while playing the- an I or am I not going to shoot? While trying to get in. The fact that she has to recover EACH and every time - hell, the move may as well NOT even exsist. You can pluck ONE Deadshot bullet in a hale of 20 straight.... see where I'm going here?
There is a scene JUST LIKE THAT in an episode of JUSTICE LEAGUE called To Another Shore. The military dude threatens that they will answer her mother's retaliation with a lot of firepower and she reveals her bracelets, points and smirks
 

Gooberking

FGC Cannon Fodder
The latter. Her parry should return projectiles--it is a famous and basic WW move. If they want to return her shield parry for melees I am okay with that as it fits their purported desire to give her access to all her weapons but they could achieve the same thing with her bracelets.

My perspective is that of a DC Comics fan entering into this NRS video game based on the DC license. So my expectations are driven by my familiarity with the lore. WW's powers are superspeed (A2), superstrength, (A1), invulnerability (A1), and flight (A2) and she has these powers all the time; they are inborn. She also has a host of weapons and skills most notably her lasso, bracelets and tiara. She sometimes visits her arsenal and wields some of the stuff in there (shields, axes, swords, spears, etc) from various pantheons and affiliations.

If I pick up a game with a character called Wonder Woman in it, I expect to see her fly, I expect that her damage output would be among the two highest in the game since in the verse she and Superman are rated A1 in that area and are the strongest and most powerful. I expect her moves to demonstrate her superspeed (her, Supes, and Flash are the fastest heroes in the verse), and I expect that whoever designs the game would visit the comics to get an idea of their typical attacks similar to the way that Snowblind did when they created JUSTICE LEAGUE HEROES. Every hero in that game played differently and played in a manner reminiscent of their comics and cartoon iterations. This has not happened with Wonder Woman with any of the NRS titles (though it very much has happened with Batman and Superman).

It is a big mystery to me that Wonder Woman has no ground stomp into pop-up combo type move though she routinely heel taps the ground to send mobs into the air after which she tiaras or lassos them together with sufficient force to KO them. Also bizarre is that she no lasso containment move (but Batman does even though that is not what he does with his grappel--his crowd control device is the Batswarm and it has appeared in the movies and the JL cartoons). She also has no low hitting lasso move though she routinely lasso's opponents feet and sling them around. Her thow does not use her lasso or her flight or leverage any of her BDSM tones.

Of the cast WW is the only character who has literally thrown something into the sun from earth. Yet she is the one who no full screen projectile (and no trick projectile though she was always ricocheting it Pre-Crisis and in the Gail Simone run she use that element a ton--so how do they miss it?).

NRS has armoured moves and yet WW does not have an armoured charge move where she charges forward with bracelets crossed ignoring incoming attacks despite doing this all the time in her books. When her bracelets are crossed she takes no damage and there literally is NOTHING they don't deflect.

But none of this basic beginner WW stuff is in her design by NRS.

It makes no sense and is endlessly frustrating.

Credit where it is due: NRS has improved with her from the first NRS game MK vs DC Universe. In that one they put the most minimum effort into the character.

But she deserves far better treatment than what she has been given and the only reason I have a PS4 is to play her. Imagine the extent of my disappointment? And mine is mild. My sister is BEYOND p!ssed off. She may not ever play again.
You clearly know and love the character, and I couldn't possibly refute anything as a WW ignoramus. With that said, this is all fine in the "she's wrong at foundational level and should have had a fundamentally different design" sense. You probably have some great conceptual ideas in there, but that isn't really my question; it's more of a technical ramifications question.

Regardless of how she got this way, this is what we actually have. This is the context people are often speaking up in to address as to how to get her "what she needs." And as a character, with a basic design, and given that IJ2 has extra dependencies on gear (that should make it even harder to make changes people are asking for), from that perspective, what does it mean to request her parry change instead reflect projectiles?

Does that impact her shield blessing that is serving deal with projectiles in its own way? Does it help or hurt the character? Is it a fan service request or does it improve this WW'ish character's place as a viable character, or can it be both? It's literally not possible to make changes without answering all of these questions. Changes often touch things the people asking for then don't consider. Changes cannot happen in a bottle. For example everyone thinks trait should not be random. That will never happen. They made that functionality and gave it to gear. Gear people in the real world people are using and can't just take away.

I will say it probably helps me a lot to both not have played her in IJ1 or know much about her in general, because without any preconceived notions of what I want from her, I really enjoy playing with her. Like bunches.
 

Stanlos

Noob
You clearly know and love the character, and I couldn't possibly refute anything as a WW ignoramus. With that said, this is all fine in the "she's wrong at foundational level and should have had a fundamentally different design" sense. You probably have some great conceptual ideas in there, but that isn't really my question; it's more of a technical ramifications question.

Regardless of how she got this way, this is what we actually have. This is the context people are often speaking up in to address as to how to get her "what she needs." And as a character, with a basic design, and given that IJ2 has extra dependencies on gear (that should make it even harder to make changes people are asking for), from that perspective, what does it mean to request her parry change instead reflect projectiles?

Does that impact her shield blessing that is serving deal with projectiles in its own way? Does it help or hurt the character? Is it a fan service request or does it improve this WW'ish character's place as a viable character, or can it be both? It's literally not possible to make changes without answering all of these questions. Changes often touch things the people asking for then don't consider. Changes cannot happen in a bottle. For example everyone thinks trait should not be random. That will never happen. They made that functionality and gave it to gear. Gear people in the real world people are using and can't just take away.

I will say it probably helps me a lot to both not have played her in IJ1 or know much about her in general, because without any preconceived notions of what I want from her, I really enjoy playing with her. Like bunches.
I definitely think me and my sibilings would be more pleased if we too had no knowledge of the character. It frustrated me in MKvDCU, IGAU and it is annoying in I2. But I would think that in instances where a pre-existing IP is leveraged those familiar with the source material should have enhanced enjoyment not less. Indeed if their approach with realizing her was the same as their approach with Supes, Bats, or Black Adam it would be enhanced because they would have leveraged her design from the books (as with Superman) or added bunch of stuff to celebrate her or make her awesome (as with Aquaman, Batman or Black Adam--none of them should have a full screen presence based on their comic book interpretation but they do).

As to the technical question part, no I do not think it will hurt the character or that the gear system inhibits alterations. I think that the buff to the shield can still exist if the parry reflects as it does more than erase projectiles. It also buffs the damage on all shield related attacks (the bashes and the toss).
 
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Saboteur-6

Filthy Casual
I only voted for one change but an advancing mid string would be nice but I'd like her bracelets to parry melee and reflect projectiles.