MK11 SHANG TSUNG Discussion

[Marinjuana]

Been interested in Shang for a bit, but I'm still confused about his game plan. Is he just meant to zone people out with ground skulls and corpse drop?

I saw Foxy Grandpa play Shang last night and all I saw was him doing that except when he hit confirmed ground skulls into an ender that left the opponent back at full screen. Is that all there is to the character? Can he play a little less lame or play footsies at mid-range?

Sorry if I missed a character guide on the site. I looked around and couldn't find one. Thanks!

Sounds like you don't like the zoning style, try Spellmaster(aka Soultaker) instead. You still will zone, but he's better at closer ranges. You really want to work that Soul Steal range with Soultaker where he has a lot of good options. I wouldn't really say he's a footsies character, more like a mid range space control character, and when they respect your neutral then you start to use your normals that bring you closer and start doing dash up offense. Compared to Warlock, he's got more safety and variety up close with the different specials and BF1 cancel.

 

[Koin-Operated]

@Agilaz @Marinjuana thank you both for getting back to me. I will check out Spellmaster tonight and see if I can wrap my head around it.

Don't get me wrong, I don't actively dislike zoning, its just that I'm already learning Skarlet and I feel like they have a similar plan. Skarlet has those big buttons to contest at the mid-range.

 

[Marinjuana]

My anti airs are too clean

 

[SaSSolino]

My anti airs are too clean

This game is such a mess.

 

[PreNerf_]

I am so fucking upset. I don't care what anyone says. Shang tsung is fucking worthless for competitive play now. They nerfed his d3 and I'm not talking about the fact that it was -2 on block, they needed to nerf that. It used to be +11 on hit and now it's +10 on hit and way harder to jail. Online it's almost impossible and it used to be one of the number 1 ways that I opened people up with him. Not only do you have to way outplay your opponent and get two more touches with him which is huge. You CANNOT use his d3 to jail anymore online or your just asking to be wrecked. Why the fuck would they make it harder for him to poke jail?!?!? I'm about fucking done with this game. I payed for a dlc character just for them to turn around and ruin him. And don't even write if your going to tell me how you can beat people online with him! Anyone that is half way decent can wreck scrubs online with the worst characters in the game. But people I have always went at least fifty fifty with, now wreck my shang tsung. He's fucking garbage now. I would be playing nightwolf but I'm at my son's house and he doesn't have nightwolf and if they fuck nightwolf up then I'm going to smash my Xbox and send it to netherrealm with a thank you note for wasting my fucking time.

 

[Agilaz]

I am so fucking upset. I don't care what anyone says. Shang tsung is fucking worthless for competitive play now. They nerfed his d3 and I'm not talking about the fact that it was -2 on block, they needed to nerf that. It used to be +11 on hit and now it's +10 on hit and way harder to jail. Online it's almost impossible and it used to be one of the number 1 ways that I opened people up with him. Not only do you have to way outplay your opponent and get two more touches with him which is huge. You CANNOT use his d3 to jail anymore online or your just asking to be wrecked. Why the fuck would they make it harder for him to poke jail?!?!? I'm about fucking done with this game. I payed for a dlc character just for them to turn around and ruin him. And don't even write if your going to tell me how you can beat people online with him! Anyone that is half way decent can wreck scrubs online with the worst characters in the game. But people I have always went at least fifty fifty with, now wreck my shang tsung. He's fucking garbage now. I would be playing nightwolf but I'm at my son's house and he doesn't have nightwolf and if they fuck nightwolf up then I'm going to smash my Xbox and send it to netherrealm with a thank you note for wasting my fucking time.

I still don't think Shang deserved the damage nerf, but he's far from worthless. If you can jail from +11 you can do so from +10. His S1 is 7f so it's really no big deal.

Calm down dude, he's still okay despite the damage nerf.

 

[haketh]

This game is such a mess.

Welcome to Fighting games goofy shit happens

 

[PreNerf_]

I still don't think Shang deserved the damage nerf, but he's far from worthless. If you can jail from +11 you can do so from +10. His S1 is 7f so it's really no big deal.

Calm down dude, he's still okay despite the damage nerf.

I don't know why but it doesn't jail online at all anymore. When I picked shang tsung up, I practice it for a week straight. It's the number one way that I opened people up with him. And I feel that at a high competitive level of play he isn't good enough anymore. I just got offline and was wrecking people with him. But when I'm playing competitive level players that i used to go at least fifty fifty with or beat hands down. I literally can only win like one out of five matches or less!!! Honestly the only reason he works online is because most players online suck and don't lab anything up at all. What pisses me off more than anything is watching people win with a five percent lifeless Everytime knowing that if they hadn't have nerfed his damage I would have won hands down. Now it feels like i can outplay people and still lose with him. What's sad is i was playing sets with someone last night and couldn't win with him at all... Picked up d'vorah and stated winning. And I suck with d'vorah!!!

 

[SHAOLIN]

@PreNerf_

Do you have an offline scene in your area? I know from experience that playing online vs offline is basically night and day when it comes to how you might approach a fighting game.

I assure you if you have a offline scene you can play with it will alleviate some of the concern you have with this character and leave you less stress out too.

 

[Agilaz]

I don't know why but it doesn't jail online at all anymore. When I picked shang tsung up, I practice it for a week straight. It's the number one way that I opened people up with him. And I feel that at a high competitive level of play he isn't good enough anymore. I just got offline and was wrecking people with him. But when I'm playing competitive level players that i used to go at least fifty fifty with or beat hands down. I literally can only win like one out of five matches or less!!! Honestly the only reason he works online is because most players online suck and don't lab anything up at all. What pisses me off more than anything is watching people win with a five percent lifeless Everytime knowing that if they hadn't have nerfed his damage I would have won hands down. Now it feels like i can outplay people and still lose with him. What's sad is i was playing sets with someone last night and couldn't win with him at all... Picked up d'vorah and stated winning. And I suck with d'vorah!!!

Honestly, I felt the same way at first. While I do think he's probably in the lower half of thr tier list, he is by no means powerless. You not being able to jail is likely you tilting.

For me, taking a step back and re-evaluating my playstyle definitely helped. You might also be auto-piloting a bit and that will get you killed really quick.

Just try and calm down. He still has good space control and good normals. Use d1 more over d3, see if that helps. Switch things up a bit.

 

[deathstroke187]

im very currious of what they will be doing with Shang 3rd variation when he doesnt even have a second one..

 

[Marinjuana]

Spellmaster is way better then most of you give credit for. It's also really fun

 

[cR WoundCowboy]

@Marinjuana i would love to know what you think is good about it, genuinely.

 

[PreNerf_]

im very currious of what they will be doing with Shang 3rd variation when he doesnt even have a second one..

Yea, maybe when they come out with his 3rd var, maybe then I'll pick him back up. Honestly if they made his fire tornado come out a bit quicker, then that would help make a good var., Shake, lift and tornado would be cool.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

@Marinjuana i would love to know what you think is good about it, genuinely.

HeY wound. Can I get your opinion on Shang for a friend?
My brother believes Shang took a hard hit from the patch. He also feels the 4-6% damage reduction makes him unviable in competitive play. You being one of if not the best Shang Tsung main in the world I'd like to know how he compares to the cast. Does he have good buttons? Is he tournament viable? What are his MU's compared to before and is his zoning effective?

I think he just needs to convert/land an additional Amped Corpse Drop to make up the damage difference but I'm more interested in your opinion than what I think. I used to use Shang mainly but I use a ton of characters now.

 

[Marinjuana]

@Marinjuana i would love to know what you think is good about it, genuinely.

I like his tools in the mid range.

BF1 is a good projectile that trades well, it can help him get into more preferred ranges and to milk life leads. The amplify is effective for going under certain projectiles on read and catching jumps. If you play smart with the amp, you can outzone some characters that you might not expect too. Matches where this move is good tend to be matches where you can actually use Soul Jar and while can be tough to implement, impossible in some matchups, any healing is good. His midscreen BNBs grant you a safe jar/heal most of the time for those matches. BF1 cancels have some utility for baiting and safety, they might be harder to react to as well as opposed to normal staggers instances but IDK that might not be a thing.

DB1 is a polarizing move, in many matchups it's his best tool and in others it sucks outside of hit confirms, assuming the opponent knows their options. Some characters punish it in most situations from strings, some really can't do much about it. But most of the time, it's an effective keep out tool, coming at awkward angles and being very tough to punish at range. It keeps you safe at the end of different strings with spacing while being a mid damage check. It can leave Shang at ranges where he can actually check with Soul Steal to create little mind games around it.

Speaking of Soul Steal, it's a good move. Covers a lot of range and compliments his other forward advancing offense. I understand some players don't like morph because of the risks but I use it in neutral when I think it's going to hit. I view the morphing as a consequence and try to play safe, it depends on the matchup too. I think Soul Steal is more important in this variation to condition the opponent in neutral and to check the opponent.

Soul Scatter is a move he has. More seriously, it actually can be useful sometimes as a safer block string ender.

I have some matchups concerns with the character because of some characters ability to easily counter DB1 with flawless block and other options, as that's his most appealing tool. But I feel comfortable enough in most matchups. I think he's got a pretty good neutral, has a nice base kit with Shang and he controls the mid range well. Cool variation with a unique playstyle.

 

[PreNerf_]

Been interested in Shang for a bit, but I'm still confused about his game plan. Is he just meant to zone people out with ground skulls and corpse drop?

I saw Foxy Grandpa play Shang last night and all I saw was him doing that except when he hit confirmed ground skulls into an ender that left the opponent back at full screen. Is that all there is to the character? Can he play a little less lame or play footsies at mid-range?

Sorry if I missed a character guide on the site. I looked around and couldn't find one. Thanks!

No, he is a zoner, but you can't effectively keep people out with him. The ground skulls at high level play is just to keep pressure and control the pace. If they feel like they are frozen and have to inch their way in then you can use his other tools effectively. He has a great auto shimmy and some good staggers. His f2 is great for mixing up between f2 throw, f2 stagger b3u4, or f2 stagger b1d2. His f242 is a good plus on block string but it's flawless blockable and better players will flawless it Everytime. But when you get them to respect f243 then you can use it sparingly and when you do you can either d4 to make them respect the plus frames and then go into things like b3u4 groundskulls, b3d4, 3u2 groundskulls, and if they keep jumping forward you can use close GS for an anti air. The trick with him is to condition them with GS and keep backdashing and throwing GS at the front of their feet and then you have to make reads, if they jump in you do close GS to anti air them. If they try to inch their way in you micro backdash into far GS again and once they are conditioned to creep in. That's when you use his other tools. They will try to get in as quick as they can once they are close. D4 sets you up for f2 stagger or f24GS or f242 plus frames or f243 krushing blow string which is safe. If they try to poke back after your d4 then you can d4 GS to catch them. But don't just throw it out cause good players will punish you for it. Once you get them to respect f242 then you can either microdash in and use 114 and hit confirm into GS or you can use 112 which is plus, has pushback and jails into soul steal and far GS, back in the mix again. These shenanigans only work with players that don't have extensive MU against shang. And if your interested in learning him I would suggest learning how to win without GS cause you can't keep people out with them. Just frustrated them into making mistakes or become over zealous and hasty. Some people will try to jump in alot so get good at AA, A2G and back 11 wiff punishing. His standing 1 into 3 GS is a good AA so is slightly backing up and standing 3. And some of his less popular strings are 21u2d2, b112, 214 and 3u2d2 which some are ok enders and some are good for conditioning.

 

[kcd117]

Hoping for Enhanced Corpse/Shake/Slide for his third variation, but I know we are probably getting Slide/Lift/Roundhouse and staying low tier.

 

[deathstroke187]

Hoping for Enhanced Corpse/Shake/Slide for his third variation, but I know we are probably getting Slide/Lift/Roundhouse and staying low tier.

there is no way they giving us either shake or teleport , shang would be too good

 

[SaSSolino]

there is no way they giving us either shake or teleport , shang would be too good

Erron has Scud Shot, which is even better than Shake, so I don't see why not.

Soul Swap is pretty stupid though, although completely useless in some match ups.

 

[Marinjuana]

Inferno Barrier is by far the most interesting move he has in kustoms that's not in tournament mode, they definitely should look to have it for a third variation.

 

[PreNerf_]

@PreNerf_

Do you have an offline scene in your area? I know from experience that playing online vs offline is basically night and day when it comes to how you might approach a fighting game.

I assure you if you have a offline scene you can play with it will alleviate some of the concern you have with this character and leave you less stress out too.

Not anywhere close, i play with @LawAbidingCitizen every other day local. We live in a small town and the only tournaments I play are here on tym and online. We would have to drive for four or more hours to find a local.

 

[PreNerf_]

Inferno Barrier is by far the most interesting move he has in kustoms that's not in tournament mode, they definitely should look to have it for a third variation.

Yea but they need to make it just a little faster on startup. Would be amazing I think in a variation. The ninjas are almost better than his other variation now. And I like the idea of spellcaster but it's really hard to get anything out cause they are so slow on startup. Hope they throw in a hotfix for his fire wall/tornado whatever it's called. But yea the Ninja moves need a little more damage in combo but they aren't horrible.

 

[PreNerf_]

Erron has Scud Shot, which is even better than Shake, so I don't see why not.

Soul Swap is pretty stupid though, although completely useless in some match ups.

Shake is a good move but not over powered by any means. Would like to see the ninjas in one variation. Shake, lift and slide.

 

[cR WoundCowboy]

HeY wound. Can I get your opinion on Shang for a friend?
My brother believes Shang took a hard hit from the patch. He also feels the 4-6% damage reduction makes him unviable in competitive play. You being one of if not the best Shang Tsung main in the world I'd like to know how he compares to the cast. Does he have good buttons? Is he tournament viable? What are his MU's compared to before and is his zoning effective?

I think he just needs to convert/land an additional Amped Corpse Drop to make up the damage difference but I'm more interested in your opinion than what I think. I used to use Shang mainly but I use a ton of characters now.

The damage nerf hit him hard. His difficult matchups became worse. I’m still using him, but I have an alt.

I like his tools in the mid range.

BF1 is a good projectile that trades well, it can help him get into more preferred ranges and to milk life leads. The amplify is effective for going under certain projectiles on read and catching jumps. If you play smart with the amp, you can outzone some characters that you might not expect too. Matches where this move is good tend to be matches where you can actually use Soul Jar and while can be tough to implement, impossible in some matchups, any healing is good. His midscreen BNBs grant you a safe jar/heal most of the time for those matches. BF1 cancels have some utility for baiting and safety, they might be harder to react to as well as opposed to normal staggers instances but IDK that might not be a thing.

DB1 is a polarizing move, in many matchups it's his best tool and in others it sucks outside of hit confirms, assuming the opponent knows their options. Some characters punish it in most situations from strings, some really can't do much about it. But most of the time, it's an effective keep out tool, coming at awkward angles and being very tough to punish at range. It keeps you safe at the end of different strings with spacing while being a mid damage check. It can leave Shang at ranges where he can actually check with Soul Steal to create little mind games around it.

Speaking of Soul Steal, it's a good move. Covers a lot of range and compliments his other forward advancing offense. I understand some players don't like morph because of the risks but I use it in neutral when I think it's going to hit. I view the morphing as a consequence and try to play safe, it depends on the matchup too. I think Soul Steal is more important in this variation to condition the opponent in neutral and to check the opponent.

Soul Scatter is a move he has. More seriously, it actually can be useful sometimes as a safer block string ender.

I have some matchups concerns with the character because of some characters ability to easily counter DB1 with flawless block and other options, as that's his most appealing tool. But I feel comfortable enough in most matchups. I think he's got a pretty good neutral, has a nice base kit with Shang and he controls the mid range well. Cool variation with a unique playstyle.

I just don’t see how any of this is better than warlock. His combo potential stinks and the projectile is slow as hell. The meteors are okay but are almost as unsafe as sparks without the benefits of launching.