General/Other - Johnny Cage Johnny Cage General Discussion Thread

[IrishMantis]

Pros: good footsies, good projectile, decent pressure

Cons: no mixups, below average damage, really bad risk/reward on armor, bad anti airs

Yeah idk he's not a terrible character at all I'm just confused on what he is supposed to do

He gets 37% off a 113 mid screen into a rest and then like 4+ chip guarantee

His D2 is ALOT better since the buff and S2 can work well as an anti cross up

 

[SmokingWarrior]

His D2 is ALOT better since the buff and S2 can work well as an anti cross up

If it's done correctly, you can even convert into a a F3, Nutpunch, wich is pretty epic

 

[Asodimazze]

He really needs a mid wake up imho...that wake up skrc idea is so crazy that it might work once in a while, but nothing one can seriously consider as a decent wake up option lol.

Better recovery on his d3 and armor on ex flipkick are necessary buffs

 

[Zionix]

He isn't perfect.

But he says #yousuck

Which is nice

 

[IrishMantis]

He's not the only character who doesn't have a mid hitting armour attack

Plus SD has it armour so it works well for the variation system

I'm still wrecking fools with him now as I did before

But if they did make his Ex Flickixk have armour , not combo of be punishable that's not a big deal it wouldn't break the character

 

[Wigy]

He's not the only character who doesn't have a mid hitting armour attack

Plus SD has it armour so it works well for the variation system

I'm still wrecking fools with him now as I did before

But if they did make his Ex Flickixk have armour , not combo of be punishable that's not a big deal it wouldn't break the character

Flipkick is really whiff punishable on knockdown so i mean safe armoured and non launching it would be fine as i see it.

Would be the same deal as prepatch without threat of being launched by ballpunch.

Johnnys wakeups have always been iffy if the person knows how to space on knockdown.

 

[Disasterpiese]

I never really had fun with A-List, he wasn't flashy enough for me. I can't find a reason to play SD which was who I used to play pre patch. Kinda sad.

I think stamina management is a bitch for A-List and if he gets in, he gets one cancel maybe, into either a throw sending them half screen which is trash or a 23% combo which is kinda ass. Maybe I'm missing something, I don't want to jump to conclusions, but am I missing something?

You don't miss anything, or we both missing something xD

 

[SpecOps2013]

Is stunt double even worth playing now? His 114 into mimicry's shadow kick and into forward 3 does not jail anymore, which means the player does not have to respect his mimicry's shadow kick and armour out of it. Back when it was a true blockstring, opponents had to respect that, which opens up more mixups and pressure. I think I should start learning A list cancels instead.

 

[Johnny Based Cage]

Did the changes help Fisticuffs at all or is he still just hot garbage?

 

[jaylee777]

Did the changes help Fisticuffs at all or is he still just hot garbage?

Yeah the ex buff is really good and the universal changes helped fisticuffs. I think it's his best variation right now.

 

[IrishMantis]

Is stunt double even worth playing now? His 114 into mimicry's shadow kick and into forward 3 does not jail anymore, which means the player does not have to respect his mimicry's shadow kick and armour out of it. Back when it was a true blockstring, opponents had to respect that, which opens up more mixups and pressure. I think I should start learning A list cancels instead.

SD is not worth playing over Alist and Fisti unless SZ but not for the reason you said

 

[Zionix]

SD is not worth playing over Alist and Fisti unless SZ but not for the reason you said

Really liked SD for SZ-GM matchup.

Would recommend any cage player to have knowledge of SD for this alone.

 

[SaSSolino]

Is fisticuff the go to variation now?

 

[Saltea Mike]

I haven't properly tested but F3SDC is -7

And 12(1) dash cancel is -8

So they can work when conditioned but still relatively punishable

But in anyway since the block timing got changed I have now found we have an OS

Really easy to do and it's gapless and leaves 0 in perfect F3 range as opposed to -8
Just dash as early as possible

Oh and about Trying to remove SDs HTBs

Nice try Pualo
Better luck next time

Shouldn't then F3 OS aswell? F3,4 is safe on block (isn't it?) and from what I recall F3 DC on hit is + enough for S1 to land?

Is fisticuff the go to variation now?

IMHO no. I think the safe on block activation and EX activation is good. But I think whiffing issues of b12~~ is a big, big deal. It breaks armor of slow-startup armors but still check out @ismael4790 's video on whiffing issues. I personally don't quite enjoy playing fisticuffs. I'm gonna be probably sticking to A-list and situational SD.

 

[SaSSolino]

IMHO no. I think the safe on block activation and EX activation is good. But I think whiffing issues of b12~~ is a big, big deal. It breaks armor of slow-startup armors but still check out @ismael4790 's video on whiffing issues. I personally don't quite enjoy playing fisticuffs. I'm gonna be probably sticking to A-list and situational SD.

I played some fisticuffs in the past (not much though) and in my opinion he never was about that b121212, his zoning wasn't bad though.

 

[IrishMantis]

Shouldn't then F3 OS aswell? F3,4 is safe on block (isn't it?) and from what I recall F3 DC on hit is + enough for S1 to land?



IMHO no. I think the safe on block activation and EX activation is good. But I think whiffing issues of b12~~ is a big, big deal. It breaks armor of slow-startup armors but still check out @ismael4790 's video on whiffing issues. I personally don't quite enjoy playing fisticuffs. I'm gonna be probably sticking to A-list and situational SD.

It technically is an OS but F34 is -14

 

[SpecOps2013]

SD is not worth playing over Alist and Fisti unless SZ but not for the reason you said

what is the reason then?

 

[Saltea Mike]

It technically is an OS but F34 is -14

But it pushes back a lot. Lots of blockstun aswell and creating this space. Wouldn't call it exactly hard to punish but it's not easy aswell.

 

[IrishMantis]

But it pushes back a lot. Lots of blockstun aswell and creating this space. Wouldn't call it exactly hard to punish but it's not easy aswell.

I can punish it pretty consistently but if you wanted to use you could why not

But yes it technically can be OS'd I guess

 

[Wigy]

Think the only reason people dont punish f34 is cause a list never ever ever used it until this patch

 

[Saltea Mike]

Think the only reason people dont punish f34 is cause a list never ever ever used it until this patch

This.

 

[kelevra]

The weird thing is that it's still unsafe at all. F34 doesn't lead to anything but can net your opponent a full combo. Kind of confusing that that didn't get changed.

 

[Tweedy]

What's the deal with dash cancelling flip kick? The few johnny's I still play do it. Is it an omega gimmick or decent? I can't decide so i'm asking for opinions basically.

 

[llabslb]

What's the deal with dash cancelling flip kick? The few johnny's I still play do it. Is it an omega gimmick or decent? I can't decide so i'm asking for opinions basically.

It's pretty gimmicky because there's a lot of recovery present on it but you can still do it here and there assuming you spaced yourself right. Other than that punish it with B1 or something. Just in case, record it so you get a feel of it.

 

[Wigy]

What's the deal with dash cancelling flip kick? The few johnny's I still play do it. Is it an omega gimmick or decent? I can't decide so i'm asking for opinions basically.

Dash cancelling flip kick?

When do they do this?