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Match-up Discussion Doomsday Matchup Discussion

TimTim

Don't Hate
DD can win against Shazam if you play the MU carefully. Everything DD has out ranges Shazam pretty much. Even Shazam's gap closing B2 can be down poked by DD. Up close Shazam has a slight advantage. Imo its either 5 - 5 or 6 - 4 slightly on DD's favor. Even if he wakes up with tp he isnt really in any advantage.
Lol I usually try to outfootsie people in this game because of all the SF I play but it's usually in shoulder charge range or d1 range didn't think to move out even farther great advice thank you.
 

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
Lol I usually try to outfootsie people in this game because of all the SF I play but it's usually in shoulder charge range or d1 range didn't think to move out even farther great advice thank you.
No worries.When you are at max range of d3 and d1 you pretty much dominate Shazam. The only thing he has in the distance is his torpedo which if blocked gives you a free d1xES. At some times you can punish it with 123 venom, but it depends on the range IIRC. When in full screen you can use MB Nova to punish any thrown lighting bolts since they have a crappy recovery or just duck and then dash to go near him.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
DD can win against Shazam if you play the MU carefully. Everything DD has out ranges Shazam pretty much. Even Shazam's gap closing B2 can be down poked by DD. Up close Shazam has a slight advantage. Imo its either 5 - 5 or 6 - 4 slightly on DD's favor. Even if he wakes up with tp he isnt really in any advantage.
why not 7 3? shazam is such a gimmicky character, psycho crusher is punished, teleport is punished, he has no zoning and if you have the lifelead and turtle its game over.
 
On a side note I got bodied by Wonder Chef's GL at WNF today, any tips on approaching that match up or should I just find a secondary? That match up seems impossible.
Watched the latest WNF archives and I think you played really well, but you gotta stop dashing in on jump back Oa Rockets...

Wait for him to jump back then MB Supernova.
 

SonicBoomBrad

Best Doomsday in the world
Watched the latest WNF archives and I think you played really well, but you gotta stop dashing in on jump back Oa Rockets...

Wait for him to jump back then MB Supernova.
That was a different WNF. I played DJT last night and to be completely honest he just got inside my head. I fell into a loop because that dude's defense is nearly impenetrable. I've already been working some very good mix ups off d1. I'll be sure to post them as soon as I find the most optimal ones. And you're right, I should be jumping the air rockets. MB supernova is also a good option. Against lanterns that can't space you're free to dash in, but DJT did tk every time.

I actually carried that negative momentum into the first half of the Krayzie match, and that's why I was getting hit by pretty much every single mix up. Thankfully I snapped out of it in the 3rd match after barely clutching the second thanks to a lucky wake up supernova.
 

warui_ne

Noob
Shazam gets raped by dd easily.

Shazam and dd both try to run oki trains on people. Dd does this safer and better.
Dd has good wake ups in ex venom and up venom

On top of that dd just plays footsies flat out better. Longer range normals and ex venom and trait just sayin "fuck yo footsies"
 

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
how do you fight green lantern ? his mb machine gun stops dd very well , also random lifts upclose are problem too
 

SonicBoomBrad

Best Doomsday in the world
how do you fight green lantern ? his mb machine gun stops dd very well , also random lifts upclose are problem too
You have to be very patient and stay just out of b1 range. You can also interrupt b13 xx overhead rockets with d1 xx ES. If he decides to do b13 mini gun you're kind of screwed. You just have to hold dat and go back to full screen. The best option is to get in and do a combo into mb venom to push him to the corner, and use the reversal tech on him until he gets out, then repeat the process. Don't let his zoning get to you either, remember to stay patient and dash in. Top level GLs will mb their fireball to stop your MB venom if you get too crazy with you're rushdown. That being said it's still a bad match up, and it's going to take out playing. But it's definitely very winnable if you gain momentum. Also don't do anything I did in my match against DJT if you've seen it. I had no idea how to approach that match up then.

EDIT: If you can get a read on the b13 mini gun you can probably jump forward and cross him up into a combo. The problem is he can easily start lifting to counter that, though that is counterable as well. It's basically a mix up for both players. Sort of like Superman's f23. But the rockets are for sure interruptable.
 

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
You have to be very patient and stay just out of b1 range. You can also interrupt b13 xx overhead rockets with d1 xx ES. If he decides to do b13 mini gun you're kind of screwed. You just have to hold dat and go back to full screen. The best option is to get in and do a combo into mb venom to push him to the corner, and use the reversal tech on him until he gets out, then repeat the process. Don't let his zoning get to you either, remember to stay patient and dash in. Top level GLs will mb their fireball to stop your MB venom if you get too crazy with you're rushdown. That being said it's still a bad match up, and it's going to take out playing. But it's definitely very winnable if you gain momentum. Also don't do anything I did in my match against DJT if you've seen it. I had no idea how to approach that match up then.

EDIT: If you can get a read on the b13 mini gun you can probably jump forward and cross him up into a combo. The problem is he can easily start lifting to counter that, though that is counterable as well. It's basically a mix up for both players. Sort of like Superman's f23. But the rockets are for sure interruptable.
thx man , that will help a lot for sure :) any links to a video of that match vs djt ?
 

SonicBoomBrad

Best Doomsday in the world
thx man , that will help a lot for sure :) any links to a video of that match vs djt ?
Hahaha, I got absolutely bodied. He got inside my head by blocking every d1 ES. I never really had to deal with that until then. Thankfully it pushed me to learn the match up and a lot more mix ups. It's on the WNF stream archive from a couple weeks ago. I'll look for it and edit it in here.

EDIT: Here you go. It's around 3:05:00 http://www.twitch.tv/leveluplive/b/435516497
Keep in mind this is a bad way to approach this match up. You need to be a lot more patient than I was. I should have done a lot more reaction mb venoms to his jump rockets. And mixed it up more once I had him in the corner.
 

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
Hahaha, I got absolutely bodied. He got inside my head by blocking every d1 ES. I never really had to deal with that until then. Thankfully it pushed me to learn the match up and a lot more mix ups. It's on the WNF stream archive from a couple weeks ago. I'll look for it and edit it in here.

EDIT: Here you go. It's around 3:05:00 http://www.twitch.tv/leveluplive/b/435516497
Keep in mind this is a bad way to approach this match up. You need to be a lot more patient than I was. I should have done a lot more reaction mb venoms to his jump rockets. And mixed it up more once I had him in the corner.
well , first match there was almost no zoning , he just got you with all these mix ups which I think are worst than his zoning , it looked totally like one of my matches today online lol Second one looked a lot better and it was winnable for sure . Just like u said , more patience.It looks like DD is some matches cant just rushdown like crazy but need to be patient :p
 

SonicBoomBrad

Best Doomsday in the world
well , first match there was almost no zoning , he just got you with all these mix ups which I think are worst than his zoning , it looked totally like one of my matches today online lol Second one looked a lot better and it was winnable for sure . Just like u said , more patience.It looks like DD is some matches cant just rushdown like crazy but need to be patient :p
His strength is actually his defense. His oki is okay but he's more reliant on gaining momentum to make you panic so he can get damage. Once a Doomsday gets in your head the match is pretty much over.
 
His strength is actually his defense. His oki is okay but he's more reliant on gaining momentum to make you panic so he can get damage. Once a Doomsday gets in your head the match is pretty much over.
Yeah, DD has some of the best defense in the game, which is why good movement is the key to the character. If you move in right, he's a moving wall who just pushes the opponent in the corner.

The closer he gets, the more the opponent is pressured to do something like jump (in or over) or dash in, and that's when there's forced to confront the absolute defence of d1 (buffered ES), air snatch, and vertical jump down 3. Being able to watch for the turn around, while maintaining the corner push is the essence of stable DD play, imo.
 

SonicBoomBrad

Best Doomsday in the world
Fucking Hawkgirl. Every move she has seems safe. That retarded mace dive is ridiculous. Tips please.
Patience, good use of venom, and proper spacing on neutral jumps during their wake up to punish mace charge. You should be fine if you do all these things. If she's flying away just trait up and dash to meet her.
 

GoodLifeGodLike

Apprentice
Patience, good use of venom, and proper spacing on neutral jumps during their wake up to punish mace charge. You should be fine if you do all these things. If she's flying away just trait up and dash to meet her.
Yes sir...I realized proper spacing on neutral jumps during mace charge wake ups is key as well...thanks.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Hahaha, I got absolutely bodied. He got inside my head by blocking every d1 ES. I never really had to deal with that until then. Thankfully it pushed me to learn the match up and a lot more mix ups.
THIS is mandatory, you can never rely on your opp not knowing the matchup, the whole earth shake business is surprising them with it, if they expect it then it is definitely easily blockable, its just that most people don't really put the effort of actually learning to block vs top 10 chars and I'm surprised by that stupidity.