THE GREAT DEBATE! MARVEL VS DC! WHO WILL WIN?!?!

[Doombawkz]

Doesn't matter he can't just be removed He is the strongest dc char and besides TOAA and Presence only can beat him his power in relative to other chars is way more he pulls out his colts and bang bang

Its funny you say that, because he can. But then, I don't expect anything out of you so I'll let you have your delusions.
What does a blind man care of painting, or so they say.

 

[EGGXI]

You like to argue. Cool story bro.

Not really, I mean yeah I'm arguing with Doombawkz kinda, but on the thing I replied you on I was more curious as to why you thought that. I think DC is more mainstream just because... well.. Batman and Superman are more iconic than anything Marvel has, and they kinda build a lot of their stuff around it. I'd say Marvel takes more risks and sometimes pulls out some incredible books about lesser known characters, but then they get some duds as well.

I've been reading both forever and definitely can't pick between the two.

 

[MidTierHarley]

Its funny you say that, because he can. But then, I don't expect anything out of you so I'll let you have your delusions.
What does a blind man care of painting, or so they say.

Let me ask you this who beats him besides TOAA presence? And why are you attacking me lol

 

[Doombawkz]

Let me ask you this who beats him besides TOAA presence? And why are you attacking me lol

Pretty much anyone who is a decently mid to high tier cosmic. These guys rewrite the universe when necessary, no matter how powerful your fellow is he has no resistance to being aborted from existence itself before it begins. Anyone with enough power to do a forced reboot (which is pretty much anyone mid-tier cosmic and above) will beat him.

I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking your lack of knowledge on the subject. Its an easy target, and one that makes itself apparent the more you try and use it.

 

[AeroGrunt]

This thread is awesome. Keep it going @EGGXI @Doombawkz

 

[Doombawkz]

Not really, I mean yeah I'm arguing with Doombawkz kinda, but on the thing I replied you on I was more curious as to why you thought that. I think DC is more mainstream just because... well.. Batman and Superman are more iconic than anything Marvel has, and they kinda build a lot of their stuff around it. I'd say Marvel takes more risks and sometimes pulls out some incredible books about lesser known characters, but then they get some duds as well.

I've been reading both forever and definitely can't pick between the two.

I'll be flat, I'm more a fan of Juggernaut and Collosus than I am of Superman and Batman. Flash is the only DC hero I care much of anything about, and thats because he is a hero who has power beyond most, but settles his problems without having to resort to them most of the time. Its very humbling.

 

[MidTierHarley]

Pretty much anyone who is a decently mid to high tier cosmic. These guys rewrite the universe when necessary, no matter how powerful your fellow is he has no resistance to being aborted from existence itself before it begins. Anyone with enough power to do a forced reboot (which is pretty much anyone mid-tier cosmic and above) will beat him.

I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking your lack of knowledge on the subject. Its an easy target, and one that makes itself apparent the more you try and use it.

Umn he can't just be erased he's more powerful than that smh the only one that gives him problems is classic beyonder but whatever just get all your info from wikis and try to insult me when you know nothing of Saint. The amount of misinformation in this thread is atrocius and might give me cancer.

 

[Doombawkz]

Umn he can't just be erased he's more powerful than that smh the only one that gives him problems is classic beyonder but whatever just get all your info from wikis and try to insult me when you know nothing of Saint. The amount of misinformation in this thread is atrocius and might give me cancer.

Except he can, because people can alter the concept of existence. I don't think you understand how things work, so I'll put it in a way thats easier to understand.
If I'm writing a book, and I make a character in it, if I erase that character he is gone. Regardless of how powerful he was, if I erase him, he is gone.
He could be able to kill whatever fake god he wants, but at the end of the day his existence is based on if I choose for him to exist or not.

For anything mid-cosmic and above, they are the writer and he is the character. No matter how strong he may be, he still requires himself to exist.
Those mid-cosmic+ characters? They don't actually need to exist because their existence spans beyond the one plane of existence they inhabit.
He does not. Thus, anyone in that general power level reboots the current universe, only Saint is not in it. Namely, because he never existed in the first place.

As far as catching cancer, I mean whatever floats your boat.

 

[EGGXI]

snip

A) I can concede to a lot of what you are saying, but how can you not admit that Scarlet Witch actually had godlike power too? She actually has the powers to warp reality, but apparently isn't godlike, whereas Flash has to time travel to create Flashpoint and can go insanely fast, yet he has godlike power? You seem to be downplaying the Scarlet Witch and refuse to rank her by the same criteria you do The Flash.
B) What makes you thing she can only alter Earth? She can alter the fabric of the Universe, shown by the fact that under her power she manipulates reality so the Kree are at peace. Also again, beating the Anti-Monitor doesn't mean he bodies everyone..
C)Who says she has to activate it? You are just making up random stuff?
D) Arrow to the head didn't stop her, why would remvoing her head? And it takes place on Earth, it's the same earth that everything else happened on and she changed everyone's lives through will alone.
E) Except that the death they out run is an entity, not a concept. Flash caused Flashpoint by taking a jog? Scarlet Witch caused House of M... without doing anything!

Again The Flash is hella OP, this cannot be denied, but you seem to use to separate criteria for judging the power of the two.

I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking your lack of knowledge on the subject. Its an easy target, and one that makes itself apparent the more you try and use it.

And I'm done. I'm sure you have many good arguments left that will counter every one of the points I have made, but this is among the most asinine things I've read.

 

[kivatt]

Umn he can't just be erased he's more powerful than that smh the only one that gives him problems is classic beyonder but whatever just get all your info from wikis and try to insult me when you know nothing of Saint. The amount of misinformation in this thread is atrocius and might give me cancer.

So basically you putting a DC character against another DC character. What's the point in that. And the pre nerf be yonder would be a problem for him, same with the marquis of death.


Also saying people don't know about comics, when you're talking about an obscure Vertigo character is kind of stupid. Just because they don't read one comic, doesn't mean they don't have comic knowledge. It means they are more interested in other characters, or other stories written by different publishers.

 

[Doombawkz]

And I'm done. I'm sure you have many good arguments left that will counter every one of the points I have made, but this is among the most asinine things I've read.

I do, but I'm bored with it.

 

[MidTierHarley]

Except he can, because people can alter the concept of existence. I don't think you understand how things work, so I'll put it in a way thats easier to understand.
If I'm writing a book, and I make a character in it, if I erase that character he is gone. Regardless of how powerful he was, if I erase him, he is gone.
He could be able to kill whatever fake god he wants, but at the end of the day his existence is based on if I choose for him to exist or not.

For anything mid-cosmic and above, they are the writer and he is the character. No matter how strong he may be, he still requires himself to exist.
Those mid-cosmic+ characters? They don't actually need to exist because their existence spans beyond the one plane of existence they inhabit.
He does not. Thus, anyone in that general power level reboots the current universe, only Saint is not in it. Namely, because he never existed in the first place.

As far as catching cancer, I mean whatever floats your boat.

Ok who do you think is DCs strongest GEB, Lucifer?

 

[Doombawkz]

Ok who do you think is DCs strongest GEB, Lucifer?

Nah, probably not Lucifer although he is strong.

 

[AeroGrunt]

I'm curious, how would The Darkness (I know he's not DC or Marvel) match up against characters like Wonder Woman or Hulk? Didn't he fight Superman at one point? I've never read the comics but as a character I think he is really cool.

 

[MidTierHarley]

Nah, probably not Lucifer although he is strong.

Then who! GEB? Primal Monitor?

 

[Doombawkz]

Then who! GEB? Primal Monitor?

Unless I'm misunderstanding your acronyms...
LT?

 

[Awkward Sloth]

My 2 cents Marvel has sexier male characters but DC has more interesting/fun female characters.

So both?

 

[MidTierHarley]

Unless I'm misunderstanding your acronyms...
LT?

Not LT lol Great Evil Beast I know he's stronger than Lucifer. I don't know much about Prinal monitor ughh DC is so confusing lol their higher beings ie presence GEB are so weird

 

[legion666]

Except no, those abilities are both replicated and within the characters scope of power as shown through several instances against other characters who promote those feats for the sake of their own tanking or powers. Superpowers are feats, random acts of godliness by humans that never would be possible outside of storylines (Capitan Boomerang being even a relative threat to the flash) are outliers.

Also as far as Thanos vs Darkseid, Thanos wins with infinity Gauntlet. Also Hulk can't fly. If you have your doubts towards it all, feel free to check out a place called the OBD. Its where people do this kind of thing on a level beyond that of regular TYM members. They even have a wiki with character profiles, and within it outlines their abilities, and even past matches with victors and losses.

I know OBD and it's fool of no-lifer's who are trying to prove that they are good at least at something in their lifes so bad that they end up looking stupid to a mature mind.
Look - no comic book fantasies and shit - pure logic. You are trying to imply that some of the fictional stuff is more believable than the other. And stuff that you consider believable you take into account while deciding if character A beats character B. But you fail to realize that while doing so outside of an actual story you apply real life logic and laws of reality to this fictional facts. Which can not be applied to something that is physically impossible in our reality, outside of the actual story again. That is what we basicly do when we start this discussions ok. And you can't tell people that character A wins because it makes sense according to the logic of our real world. You can only have a fucking opinion. If you say that is what will happen if this characters meet I can say I agree or disagree, but when you are trying to prove me wrong ( again according to your opinion) you use real world logic as a proof for that. Then I can just say well according to real world logic people traveling at the speed of light and warping reality can't exist at all. And there you go - this is empirically improvable.

 

[Doombawkz]

I know OBD and it's fool of no-lifer's who are trying to prove that they are good at least at something in their lifes so bad that they end up looking stupid to a mature mind.
Look - no comic book fantasies and shit - pure logic. You are trying to imply that some of the fictional stuff is more believable than the other. And stuff that you consider believable you take into account while deciding if character A beats character B. But you fail to realize that while doing so outside of an actual story you apply real life logic and laws of reality to this fictional facts. Which can not be applied to something that is physically impossible in our reality, outside of the actual story again. That is what we basicly do when we start this discussions ok. And you can't tell people that character A wins because it makes sense according to the logic of our real world. You can only have a fucking opinion. If you say that is what will happen if this characters meet I can say I agree or disagree, but when you are trying to prove me wrong ( again according to your opinion) you use real world logic as a proof for that. Then I can just say well according to real world logic people traveling at the speed of light and warping reality can't exist at all. And there you go - this is empirically improvable.

And then you basically have an opinion with no basis in fact. If you're going to debate something against someone, you can't debate an opinion. You can have one, you can't debate one. You need some basis to hold ground on, otherwise you'll just be spitting words. As far as OBD goes, yes a majority of them aren't good just like anything, however there is no denying their database is the most complete storage of calcs and feats.

 

[TheBoyBlunder]

But he's not the best and gets shitted on by a lot. He's barely top 10

Show me 10 guys in DC with bigger feats than Bruce. You sound bias, when you post actual showings and which book you're getting your info from then you'll look like you know what you're talking about. Right now you sound like the typical "Batman is just a human he's not powerful enough" critic.


quote="Doombawkz, post: 1314910, member: 12411"]He did, but Deathstroke is a human in most editions, just an incredibly well-trained mercenary unless you count the backstory where he is a medical flop. He fought Darksied in JLA, don't get that confused with an actual comic. Clayface is a human at his core, and what he gains in strength he loses in speed so its not a hard fight. Killer Croc isn't that impressive either, and those last 2 are the few non-humans he doesn't fight. Him fighting Cap was a cross-over and he is a human too. Those next 6 are heavily plot induced, unless you're trying to say a human who has been shot can beat out superman who can clock a few thousand over the lightspeed, in which case I have to assume you've never actually done any form of math of physics. Robot drones are disposable, demons he usually had the help of someone (sometimes a demon of his own), and vampires he got bodied by except for a last second plot window he happened to jump through.

Batman "mostly" fights humans, if you didn't see, and humans are the only ones he can beat without the author stepping in and saying "ok batman has shark repellant". You seem to confuse plot for the sake of relevance for actual feats.

Batman's reactions are less than a bullet, and plenty of villains have been stated by the author to have been able to kill Batman 50 times over if not for their own faults like Riddler's necessity for riddles, two-faces desire for chance, and so on.[/quote]

I'm typing this from my girls iPad on a rush so don't mind any spelling errors.

Deathstroke is a meta. This isn't even debatable. Go read teen Titan comics or never talk about Slade again. Stroke lost his humanity a long time ago.

Lol....you didn't know Bruce fought Darkseid in the comics? You're really confused then. Do you even know what the hell Final Crisis is? Are you some casual who watches Saturday cartoons and thinks he knows everything about DC? You're too funny man.

Clayface is a meta, you downplaying Clayface isn't going to help you in saying that Batman mostly fight humans. You were wrong, just man up to it.

same thing with KC....downplaying the character doesn't help your cause here. You watch too much cartoons and forgot about Batmans overall feats against non humans.

Captain America is the same as Deathstroke just more stable. He isn't just human, he's clearly an enhanced meta human, he possesses legit super powers....that's what makes him Captain America....are you serious? I guess a lot of the x-men are regular ole humans to you.

If you got a problem with plots, then don't bother following DC or Marvel because you sound sour over a lot of plots, so you disregard them and make up your own theories that lack info. You'll get no where with that. Read some comics, they'll open your eyes to some things and help you understand deeper into the character.

Math of physics? What are you talking about...did you even finish college? You're struggle to write a sentence, worry less about the physics and check out English 101.

I got to go but I'm not done with you, you're going to have an education later tonight so prep yourself, Batman style.

 

[Doombawkz]

I'm typing this from my girls iPad on a rush so don't mind any spelling errors.

Deathstroke is a meta. This isn't even debatable. Go read teen Titan comics or never talk about Slade again. Stroke lost his humanity a long time ago.

I've read it. I've also read quite a few that have him as a basic well-trained mercenary. But you seem to have trouble with reading so thats fine too.

Lol....you didn't know Bruce fought Darkseid in the comics? You're really confused then. Do you even know what the hell Final Crisis is? Are you some casual who watches Saturday cartoons and thinks he knows everything about DC? You're too funny man.

Yeah, no. You can read my exposition on what an "outlier" is, and maybe reevaluate your stance on a guy who was crippled for 10 years by a masked wrestler being capable of fighting someone who ends the idea of life with math.

Clayface is a meta, you downplaying Clayface isn't going to help you in saying that Batman mostly fight humans. You were wrong, just man up to it.

Someone being a metahuman doesn't instantly make them any harder to fight if they have an obvious exploitable weakness. For all of his speed, he falls deep into the "might as well be a human" category.

same thing with KC....downplaying the character doesn't help your cause here. You watch too much cartoons and forgot about Batmans overall feats against non humans.

You named 2, potentially 3 "meta"humans he fights. I can match it with 3 humans, being Scarecrow, Cobblepot, Joker... I can keep going if you'd like to see whose list is longer.

Captain America is the same as Deathstroke just more stable. He isn't just human, he's clearly an enhanced meta human, he possesses legit super powers....that's what makes him Captain America....are you serious? I guess a lot of the x-men are regular ole humans to you.

Dies to a sniper bullet, gets crippled and broken down, pretty much he is a very strong human capable of throwing one of the strongest minerals in the form of a shield. So he is basically an olymic athlete with a shield. Don't compare Captain A. to the likes to Storm or Wolverine, because even as far as Marvel goes he is pretty low tier.

If you got a problem with plots, then don't bother following DC or Marvel because you sound sour over a lot of plots, so you disregard them and make up your own theories that lack info. You'll get no where with that. Read some comics, they'll open your eyes to some things and help you understand deeper into the character.

I have no problem with plots, I simply have a problem with people taking plots and hailing them as factual. They are used to tell a story, and they can be stretched to fit any scenario, even drastically unrealistic ones that lie far beyond the character they are fleshing out. If you want to include plot, then yeah by the plot Batman would maybe win against Superman if the story called for it. Unless you're telling a story, however, plot shouldn't be used as evidence to help your stance. If you want to debate me, then show me something consistent or remain silent, because I've no time for one-offs.

Math of physics? What are you talking about...did you even finish college? You're struggle to write a sentence, worry less about the physics and check out English 101.

It was a one-letter typo, but what am I bothering to explain myself for? "You're struggle to write a sentence", yeah keep lecturing me on grammar.

I got to go but I'm not done with you, you're going to have an education later tonight so prep yourself, Batman style.

Mhmm... Save your time, I don't need lectures from idiots.

 

[kivatt]

Show me 10 guys in DC with bigger feats than Bruce. You sound bias, when you post actual showings and which book you're getting your info from then you'll look like you know what you're talking about. Right now you sound like the typical "Batman is just a human he's not powerful enough" critic.

Wait so how is be saying that Batman get's shitted on bias? Do you even know what the word means? Just because I said he isn't the best, means that I have a bias against Batman now? What're you talking about exactly? And like I said he barely makes top 10. I didn't say he wasn't on it. And Batman is a human, he isn't powerful as the other heroes. That's why he needs his gadgets, prep-time, and intellect. He doesn't need to be as powerful as the other heroes, to get the job done. That's what makes him, him. He's a human, "normal", person going up against people that would bop him easily.

You sound like one of those Batman fans that get offended whenever someone disagrees with your opinion of him, and you automatically call them a Batman hater, or bias for some reason. What's the point in that?

In no order.

Karate Kid
Richard Dragon
Lady Shiva
Sensei(Better at hand to hand but has no endurance)
Constantine Drakon
Batman One Million(*Since he's strong as fuck he's an ehh)
Cassandra Cain
Deathstroke

 

[REDRUM]

NOBODY > THE MIGHTY THOR!!!

He-Man beats him 8-2 with the MUCH better weapon and He-Man is the strongest man in the Universe.

 

[kivatt]

I always see people making these arguments about what The Flash could theoretically do, yet there is literally zero evidence for it in the comics.

People try and bleed random bits of science into their arguments for why The Flash beats everyone, yet the freakin' rogues give the guy trouble.

A guy who is literally made of random bits of metal and another guy made of tar give The Flash trouble.

You're acting like the Rogues are jokes? Are you really trying to say that.

They are easily one of the most dangerous group of DC villains.
And his name is Tarpit, you touch him, and you get stuck to his body, and sucked in. Anyone would have a problem with a villain like that.

The Rouge's are the most slept on group, but they can easily one shot people.
Especially Captain Cold.