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Street Fighter V General Discussion

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
Yeah you were impatient with Rashid at the start. It helps me that Rashid doesn't have ridiculous fast normals to lock me down when you get in.

Ryu almost completely negates Guile zoning. If i have meter its a little better but both characters with no meter is in Ryu's favor (to me at least). I dont know which it worse to fight Ryu oer Nash at this point.

Its gonna take a long time to learn the loop lol. I can barely do HP, SB, cr.mp, SB in practice.
Honestly, I don't know how rashid is supposed to deal with booms. I would have to lab it more but the only thing that seems to work is walking in and making a read on a jump.

@B. Shazzy could probably give advice on the HP~SB cr. MP~SB combo. I've rarely seen him drop it. I think you have to do the SB cancel really late to build the second charge.
 

Aramonde

Noob
I didn't tell you guys about the Zangief match i had yesterday. This dude had 500ish LP so he was probably new but im zoning him out in the first game and i win. In the second game he sitting full screen most of the time. With the clock almost down to zero i taunt not to be disrespectful but because i wanted to tell him just what Guile says in his taunt "You wont win just standing there". The next round he rage quit. Kinda of a weird match.

Edit: Just had a Guile mirror and i don't know how that guy got above ultra bronze playing like that. He used cr.HK & jumped way to much. As a Guile player he should know NEVER JUMP IN ON A CROUCHING GUILE!
 
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Usually you have to get in before you can get those plus frames. Cammy and Ken can jump from quite a distance and ex divekick and they are in. Combined with their footsies and walk speed/run, it's a bit overboard. I think it's a big factor as to why they are considered really good characters.
list of characters that can get plus frames from range with/without bar.

Cammy (divekicks)
Ken (divekicks)
Vega (wall dive)
Bison (ex scissors, slide x v trigger, air hand)
Alex (ex stampede)
Dhalsim (ex fireball into teleport mixup)
Guile (follow in the slow boom)
Nash (moonsaults)
Mika (cr hp spaced well or just v trigger)
Balrog (ex dash straight)
Chun Li (v skill or jump into air legs)
FANG (ex balls and follow them in)
Ibuki (ex air kunai)

That's just off the top of my head. There's probably more and I'm tempted to include Necalli since his dive kick makes it very dangerous to try and ai to air his jump from certain ranges.
 

Aramonde

Noob
Can that stupid rasanka or whatever move Karin has go through fireballs or not?! Sometimes she goes through them other times she gets hit. God move properties in this fucking game change all the damn time!

Also how the fuck do you block juri's v skill? Do i have to block it twice?
 

buyacushun

Normalize grab immunity.
Character win percentage. Just look at those filthy Bison players. Makes me sick!
Teleport shenanigans is S-tier online. Been that way since fighters got netplay. The moment we get a teleport character that's not dhalsim I'm hopping on that train first.

Can that stupid rasanka or whatever move Karin has go through fireballs or not?! Sometimes she goes through them other times she gets hit. God move properties in this fucking game change all the damn time!

Also how the fuck do you block juri's v skill? Do i have to block it twice?
If you're talking about the leaping overhead Karin has, if she gets it then she just mistimed her move. She can definitely use it to get around projectiles. If you have the FAT app. It says it gets airborne a bit into the move. So it's not completely projectile invincible so it has to be timed right.

Juri V-skill is a cross up. But if they charged it then there is a hit as she's rushing at you then her crossup.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
list of characters that can get plus frames from range with/without bar.

Cammy (divekicks)
Ken (divekicks)
Vega (wall dive)
Bison (ex scissors, slide x v trigger, air hand)
Alex (ex stampede)
Dhalsim (ex fireball into teleport mixup)
Guile (follow in the slow boom)
Nash (moonsaults)
Mika (cr hp spaced well or just v trigger)
Balrog (ex dash straight)
Chun Li (v skill or jump into air legs)
FANG (ex balls and follow them in)
Ibuki (ex air kunai)

That's just off the top of my head. There's probably more and I'm tempted to include Necalli since his dive kick makes it very dangerous to try and ai to air his jump from certain ranges.
I understand that plus frames exist, but none of those are quite as easy to abuse as Cammy and Ken's ex divekicks. For example, Moonsaults and ia legs are pretty easy to anti air from a hitbox/hurtbox standpoint. Also, a lot of these require a knockdown first in order to really set them up. Ex kunai can just be deflected. Fireballs can be dealt with in numerous ways. Balrogs ex dash straight has pushback and is only +1. Bison ex scissors is only +1 with no 3 frame normal.

Anything into v-trigger activation isn't a huge deal because that's basically on a long timer.

I don't have Alex but I assume you can aa ex stomp.

FANG's ex balls are pretty good, can't deny that.

I'm not against plus frames, just constant barrage of plus frame divekicks with no real downside.
 
I understand that plus frames exist, but none of those are quite as easy to abuse as Cammy and Ken's ex divekicks. For example, Moonsaults and ia legs are pretty easy to anti air from a hitbox/hurtbox standpoint. Also, a lot of these require a knockdown first in order to really set them up. Ex kunai can just be deflected. Fireballs can be dealt with in numerous ways. Balrogs ex dash straight has pushback and is only +1. Bison ex scissors is only +1 with no 3 frame normal.

Anything into v-trigger activation isn't a huge deal because that's basically on a long timer.

I don't have Alex but I assume you can aa ex stomp.

FANG's ex balls are pretty good, can't deny that.

I'm not against plus frames, just constant barrage of plus frame divekicks with no real downside.
they don't have a constant barrage of plus frame divekicks. They've got them as long as they have bar cammys regular divekicks aren't hard to stop and Ken literally needs bar to do it. Honestly seems like you're just upset that their divekicks are plus and rashidos isn't.

Also if you're saying ia legs are easy to anti air but Ken/cammy divekicks aren't then I don't know what's going on anymore. They're pretty much the same difficulty to aa in that you've gotta make the read to do it.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
they don't have a constant barrage of plus frame divekicks. They've got them as long as they have bar cammys regular divekicks aren't hard to stop and Ken literally needs bar to do it. Honestly seems like you're just upset that their divekicks are plus and rashidos isn't.

Also if you're saying ia legs are easy to anti air but Ken/cammy divekicks aren't then I don't know what's going on anymore. They're pretty much the same difficulty to aa in that you've gotta make the read to do it.
You can actually anti air ia legs if you read it and push just about any button for a decent window of time. The problem with Ken and Cammy is the hurtbox rate of speed at which they travel and the angle make difficult to anti air at all even when you know its coming. It's pretty much the same as moonsaults. The hurtbox is way below the hitbox so you can always aa it.


green line is hurtbox
red is hitbox
 

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
Ryu almost completely negates Guile zoning. If i have meter its a little better but both characters with no meter is in Ryu's favor (to me at least). I dont know which it worse to fight Ryu oer Nash at this point.
Guile wins the fireball war against Nash and Ryu imo. V-Skill works wonders in these MU's.
 
You can actually anti air ia legs if you read it and push just about any button for a decent window of time. The problem with Ken and Cammy is the hurtbox rate of speed at which they travel and the angle make difficult to anti air at all even when you know its coming. It's pretty much the same as moonsaults. The hurtbox is way below the hitbox so you can always aa it.


green line is hurtbox
red is hitbox
you can also always aa kens divekick with an invincible move. The hurtbox isn't why chuns ia is good or bad it's irrelevant. It's that you've got maybe 15-20 frames to react to it with 8 frames of input lag so you're gonna either have to read it or have a sick jab. Just going from anecdotal experience I find it far easier to anti air kens ex dive kick than chuns ia legs. Specifically because you know when ken can/can't use it and it's useful from very specific ranges. It's usually pretty obvious when they're looking for it.

Edit: they're definitely not difficult to anti air if you KNOW they're coming. The anti airs are 100% consistent for most characters. And the ones that are kinda wonky like karins ex dp will most likely trade if they don't beat it outright.
 
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Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
you can also always aa kens divekick with an invincible move. The hurtbox isn't why chuns ia is good or bad it's irrelevant. It's that you've got maybe 15-20 frames to react to it with 8 frames of input lag so you're gonna either have to read it or have a sick jab. Just going from anecdotal experience I find it far easier to anti air kens ex dive kick than chuns ia legs. Specifically because you know when ken can/can't use it and it's useful from very specific ranges. It's usually pretty obvious when they're looking for it.
When I know Chun is about to do ia legs, I can aa it pretty reasonably. When she does it unexpectedly, I cannot react. Ken can do his ex dive kick pretty low. Not as low as chun, but he travels so fast while chun just floats there. I'd say they are equally hard to react to while chun's hurtbox is more extended and easier to hit.
 
I didn't tell you guys about the Zangief match i had yesterday. This dude had 500ish LP so he was probably new but im zoning him out in the first game and i win. In the second game he sitting full screen most of the time. With the clock almost down to zero i taunt not to be disrespectful but because i wanted to tell him just what Guile says in his taunt "You wont win just standing there". The next round he rage quit. Kinda of a weird match.

Edit: Just had a Guile mirror and i don't know how that guy got above ultra bronze playing like that. He used cr.HK & jumped way to much. As a Guile player he should know NEVER JUMP IN ON A CROUCHING GUILE!
He gave up plus you taunted, he probably saw it as disrespect so he rage quit.
 

@MylesWright_

I'll be back 3ing
Time with Juri has made me realize just how good Ibuki really is. I'll have to use Ibuki to cover all 20 of Juris bad match-ups
 

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
Nash can throw a boom then absorb the second. Ryu can parry both of them. My friend can do it and hes not even that good. Or throw two fireballs himself.
Then you throw the slow fireball and walk in then if jumps you cr.hp, if he parries you punish with f.hp and if he blocks then you're charging to throw another fireball or whatever.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
You can actually anti air ia legs if you read it and push just about any button for a decent window of time. The problem with Ken and Cammy is the hurtbox rate of speed at which they travel and the angle make difficult to anti air at all even when you know its coming. It's pretty much the same as moonsaults. The hurtbox is way below the hitbox so you can always aa it.


green line is hurtbox
red is hitbox
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