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Match-Up Discussion - Mileena MKX Mileena MU Chart v2

Akromaniac27

Akromaniac27

Ready to lose your head?
JustPressingButtons said:
More important question, who's your MU exp for pulling these numbers out of your ass? Beating bad players on ranked and player match doesn't give you the right to claim these outrageous numbers.

Plz explain Lao, Jax, Quan, Goro, Liu Kang.
Click to expand...
Better question. Why are still on my dick and lurking through EVERY single post I make? Is there really that much time on your hands?

As for the MU experience, Goro, I already said I didn't have any solid experience in so I left it neutral. Lao, BrobaChett, though like a month or so ago. Jax, the little I did get was a few matches with Jupiter and the rest from anyone else competent with the character, King Meech is one as such. Quan, just about any and everyone that uses him online and some with King, but any specific ones doesn't ring a bell. Kang, Kajukenbo, shdw, and Devone1200 were the only ones that knew what they were doing.

No, these players aren't YOMI or CR, but if I could, I'd gladly play them to grind it out further. On top of that too, you can't expect a conclusion just from playing one player, despite how good they are. Yes, their play is significantly better than the average player, but it isn't the ONLY way to play the character.

But hey, my time zone is eastern and I wake up around 9am, sleep around midnight to 1 in case you wanted to know. Would you like to know my eating habits and how many times I take a shit too? Just let me know so it doesn't consume all your time lurking around.
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JustPressingButtons said:
More important question, who's your MU exp for pulling these numbers out of your ass? Beating bad players on ranked and player match doesn't give you the right to claim these outrageous numbers.

Plz explain Lao, Jax, Quan, Goro, Liu Kang.
Click to expand...
Are you a top player?
Are you even a good player?
Actually, as a fair question, who the fuck even are you?

I don't recognize you as a top Lao, Jax, Quan, Goro, or Liu Kang player. So maybe sit down, shut up, and let the grown-ups talk, eh? If you can't actually provide any reliable input (i.e. you can't because you're nobody), then you don't really belong in the discussion. I legit have no clue who you are, all I know is its annoying to look at your text. It reeks of ineptitude.

Now then, just as a note to the list maker, piercing actually does a pretty good job against Vicious F/T because of our lack of answers to multi-hit pressure. Suffers a bit against Lackey imo though since Piercing strings actually feed in a decent chunk of bar because of their hit numbers, and Lackey doesn't have the same defensive issues, actually probably being one of the better specs for it. Against Ruthless its kinda in the air, I'm not sure how Mileena does against pressure but Ruthless doesn't really have the advantage of Lackey's fast and long limbs. Input?
 
Akromaniac27

Akromaniac27

Ready to lose your head?
Doombawkz said:
Are you a top player?
Are you even a good player?
Actually, as a fair question, who the fuck even are you?

I don't recognize you as a top Lao, Jax, Quan, Goro, or Liu Kang player. So maybe sit down, shut up, and let the grown-ups talk, eh? If you can't actually provide any reliable input (i.e. you can't because you're nobody), then you don't really belong in the discussion. I legit have no clue who you are, all I know is its annoying to look at your text. It reeks of ineptitude.

Now then, just as a note to the list maker, piercing actually does a pretty good job against Vicious F/T because of our lack of answers to multi-hit pressure. Suffers a bit against Lackey imo though since Piercing strings actually feed in a decent chunk of bar because of their hit numbers, and Lackey doesn't have the same defensive issues, actually probably being one of the better specs for it. Against Ruthless its kinda in the air, I'm not sure how Mileena does against pressure but Ruthless doesn't really have the advantage of Lackey's fast and long limbs. Input?
Click to expand...
I have like literally no solid F/T experience, so I have no genuine input to add to that
 
JustPressingButtons

JustPressingButtons

Clown
Doombawkz said:
Are you a top player?
Are you even a good player?
Actually, as a fair question, who the fuck even are you?

I don't recognize you as a top Lao, Jax, Quan, Goro, or Liu Kang player. So maybe sit down, shut up, and let the grown-ups talk, eh? If you can't actually provide any reliable input (i.e. you can't because you're nobody), then you don't really belong in the discussion. I legit have no clue who you are, all I know is its annoying to look at your text. It reeks of ineptitude.

Now then, just as a note to the list maker, piercing actually does a pretty good job against Vicious F/T because of our lack of answers to multi-hit pressure. Suffers a bit against Lackey imo though since Piercing strings actually feed in a decent chunk of bar because of their hit numbers, and Lackey doesn't have the same defensive issues, actually probably being one of the better specs for it. Against Ruthless its kinda in the air, I'm not sure how Mileena does against pressure but Ruthless doesn't really have the advantage of Lackey's fast and long limbs. Input?
Click to expand...
Who am I? Ask @rev0lver if you want, he's played me in person before :).

Better yet, who are you outside of being a lab monster? I don't see you making placements offline either. So stfu with that nonsense.

Who's this guy to make Mileena MU numbers while he's just a streamer playing ranked matches all day everyday? Who's his legitimate MU exp to shoot out numbers for every character?

Now besides that failed attempt to discredit me, I'll use Jax for an example. Granted I've played this one online and in the lab because there isn't any offline Mileena's anywhere near me, Jax bullies Mileena anywhere on the screen, and takes minimal risks getting in. Jax will walk Mileena down to the corner. Then when Jax is in, it's only one combo to pretty much get you from corner to corner. In Piercing, Jax can damn near do whatever he wants on knockdown, as he can always check with a D3 to stuff wake ups, then block in time if an EX Ball Roll comes out. The only way to safely wake up is with ethereal, but that is giving up Mileena's strong B12, and more meter dependent. The wake up problem is amplified when Jax is in heavy weapons when you can D3, 123~rocket cancel for hit confirm. Also, can we stop forgetting that Mileena has to commit to a -31 special or throw to get out of pressure? Essentially this is one of those MU's were Mileena runs away and throw sais and Jax gives chase, then when Jax is in Mileena realistically has a really hard time getting out of pressure. When Mileena is cornered, she's stays on the ground in piercing, or gains evasiveness in ethereal but gives up her most valuable tools in that MU for a wake up.
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JustPressingButtons said:
Who am I? Ask @rev0lver if you want, he's played me in person before :).

Better yet, who are you outside of being a lab monster? I don't see you making placements offline either. So stfu with that nonsense.

Who's this guy to make Mileena MU numbers while he's just a streamer playing ranked matches all day everyday? Who's his legitimate MU exp to shoot out numbers for every character?

Now besides that failed attempt to discredit me, I'll use Jax for an example. Granted I've played this one online and in the lab because there isn't any offline Mileena's anywhere near me, Jax bullies Mileena anywhere on the screen, and takes minimal risks getting in. Jax will walk Mileena down to the corner. Then when Jax is in, it's only one combo to pretty much get you from corner to corner. In Piercing, Jax can damn near do whatever he wants on knockdown, as he can always check with a D3 to stuff wake ups, then block in time if an EX Ball Roll comes out. The only way to safely wake up is with ethereal, but that is giving up Mileena's strong B12, and more meter dependent. The wake up problem is amplified when Jax is in heavy weapons when you can D3, 123~rocket cancel for hit confirm. Also, can we stop forgetting that Mileena has to commit to a -31 special or throw to get out of pressure? Essentially this is one of those MU's were Mileena runs away and throw sais and Jax gives chase, then when Jax is in Mileena realistically has a really hard time getting out of pressure. When Mileena is cornered, she's stays on the ground in piercing, or gains evasiveness in ethereal but gives up her most valuable tools in that MU for a wake up.
Click to expand...
For the sake of the discussion not being derailed, I'll put my rebuttal in a spoiler. Read it if you really feel like, but this will take up less space.
So thats a very simplified stance on the whole MU. Whats the numbers then?


I don't care much for your sources, or your hurt feelings.
And yeah, I don't travel. Unfortunately for you, I make my reputation solid through my work in the lab, and I don't claim to have more experience than I do.

Discredit you? You've already discredited yourself. But your online Jax experience, its so juicy. Mmm, so tasty. I love your idea of how one-sided the entire ordeal is. So is it a 7-3 in Jax's favor then?
I'm only assuming so since your description is nothing short of a best-case scenario in an online setting. Maybe an 8-2 Jax's favor? You must be pretty amazing, its a surprise I've never heard of you before.
Even more surprising you need Revolver to validate your existence, since you're such the authority. Maybe even a 9-1, as I can only assume you've got that top level experience.
Maybe its even a 10-0, since by what you say she has basically no option and its just a matter of time until Jax catches up and wins. You're the top level now. Soak it in.

God help you if you ever come into a F/T discussion with that kind of a description, I'll take personal pleasure in being one of many F/T players reminding you of how low on the totem pole you are.

I mean Revolver, wowza. Now THERE'S a household name. I remember all those times I've heard about how hype it was when Revolver did something. Like inching across the screen that one time in Injustice.
And uh.... Smoking weed? I think he made a cucumber bong once. That was pretty cool. I mean I went for a dig and it was a rather deep one, and I don't want to be catty but...
Rev0lver's biggest recent achievement was maybe making top 64 at a tourney, I think. I don't know, the bracket didn't go further than top 32. He's a good guy and a good player, but I don't think his name validates your point.
Like is Rev0lver a good player? He might be the best, I wouldn't know, but I mean I could tag a player to back my argument and mine is probably the better source.
But I don't need to. If I did, I would, but frankly I don't need anyone else to show that I know something.

Now @Yoaks is someone I'd maybe trust with my opinion, but not you. Not as far as I could throw you, and I have bad shoulders.
 
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JustPressingButtons

JustPressingButtons

Clown
Doombawkz said:
For the sake of the discussion not being derailed, I'll put my rebuttal in a spoiler. Read it if you really feel like, but this will take up less space.
So thats a very simplified stance on the whole MU. Whats the numbers then?


I don't care much for your sources, or your hurt feelings.
And yeah, I don't travel. Unfortunately for you, I make my reputation solid through my work in the lab, and I don't claim to have more experience than I do.

Discredit you? You've already discredited yourself. But your online Jax experience, its so juicy. Mmm, so tasty. I love your idea of how one-sided the entire ordeal is. So is it a 7-3 in Jax's favor then?
I'm only assuming so since your description is nothing short of a best-case scenario in an online setting. Maybe an 8-2 Jax's favor? You must be pretty amazing, its a surprise I've never heard of you before.
Even more surprising you need Revolver to validate your existence, since you're such the authority. Maybe even a 9-1, as I can only assume you've got that top level experience.
Maybe its even a 10-0, since by what you say she has basically no option and its just a matter of time until Jax catches up and wins. You're the top level now. Soak it in.

God help you if you ever come into a F/T discussion with that kind of a description, I'll take personal pleasure in being one of many F/T players reminding you of how low on the totem pole you are.

I mean Revolver, wowza. Now THERE'S a household name. I remember all those times I've heard about how hype it was when Revolver did something. Like inching across the screen that one time in Injustice.
And uh.... Smoking weed? I think he made a cucumber bong once. That was pretty cool. I mean I went for a dig and it was a rather deep one, and I don't want to be catty but...
Rev0lver's biggest recent achievement was maybe making top 64 at a tourney, I think. I don't know, the bracket didn't go further than top 32. He's a good guy and a good player, but I don't think his name validates your point.
Like is Rev0lver a good player? He might be the best, I wouldn't know, but I mean I could tag a player to back my argument and mine is probably the better source.
But I don't need to. If I did, I would, but frankly I don't need anyone else to show that I know something.

Now @Yoaks is someone I'd maybe trust with my opinion, but not you. Not as far as I could throw you, and I have bad shoulders.
Click to expand...
So you yourself have nothing productive to say even tho I countered every one of your claims, and not only you discredited me saying I'm a nobody, you go on to discredit another player who you know plays offline too and didn't say anything? Fuck out of here with that shit and fuck you too, I don't care what you have to think of me when I'm out there training to compete at a high level.

What have you done besides create weak tech no one gives a shit about? Or post random pictures of Pugs? Want a pat in the back for being a "lab monster"? Congratulations you've attained some non existent reputation for your great achievements. Bet you can't wait to hear the day someone says "I've won using the Doombawkz tech". Guess what? It's never going to happen btw, so take that rep and shove it up your pretentious ass.

Guess I have to say the barebones for you to understand. Better yet I'll have it in bullet points.

-Jax takes less risks and controls the pace of the match with advancing normals approaching Mileena.
-Mileena plays keep away with sais majority of the match, and B12 if using Piercing
-One touch with Jax = extreme corner carry and damage, and if cornered Mileena's options to get out are blown up by D3 and block.
-Mileena can Ball Roll out of pressure, this option is - death on block, or avoided with Jax D3, Mileena's pokes are lacking range and can't follow up with one back
-Oki game is present with both characters
-On knockdown in the corner, piercing's only viable wake up is EX Ball Roll, again, loses to Jax D3 into block. Switch to Ethereal if you want the ability to wake up out of the corner. With Ethereal, you then lose your B12 which is very valuable.
-Mileena in order to open up opponents with a 50/50 has both options - death on block. Jax then full combo punishes into corner carry. Jax shares same problem, but has various ways to open her up without a 50/50.
-Mileena F44 is full combo punishable vs Jax with 123.

Summary : Mileena has to take more risks and more reads to open up Jax and cash in damage. Jax takes minimal risks to open up Mileena while controlling the pace of the match cashing in more damage. The game is too young to put in MU numbers just yet, but saying it isn't a bad MU right now is insane.

And go ahead and ask @Yoaks , I run the MU with him and discuss and look for different ways to explore it all the time. He'd agree with me 100%.

So please do yourself the favor and fuck off next time.
 
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Cosmos

Cosmos

Noob
JustPressingButtons said:
So you yourself have nothing productive to say even tho I countered every one of your claims, and not only you discredited me saying I'm a nobody, you go on to discredit another player who you know plays offline too and didn't say anything? Fuck out of here with that shit and fuck you too, I don't care what you have to think of me when I'm out there training to compete at a high level.

What have you done besides create weak tech no one gives a shit about? Or post random pictures of Pugs? Want a pat in the back for being a "lab monster"? Congratulations you've attained some non existent reputation for your great achievements. Bet you can't wait to hear the day someone says "I've won using the Doombawkz tech". Guess what? It's never going to happen btw, so take that rep and shove it up your pretentious ass.

Guess I have to say the barebones for you to understand. Better yet I'll have it in bullet points.

-Jax takes less risks and controls the pace of the match with advancing normals approaching Mileena.
-Mileena plays keep away with sais majority of the match, and B12 if using Piercing
-One touch with Jax = extreme corner carry and damage, and if cornered Mileena's options to get out are blown up by D3 and block.
-Mileena can Ball Roll out of pressure, this option is - death on block, or avoided with Jax D3, Mileena's pokes are lacking range and can't follow up with one back
-Oki game is present with both characters
-On knockdown in the corner, piercing's only viable wake up is EX Ball Roll, again, loses to Jax D3 into block. Switch to Ethereal if you want the ability to wake up out of the corner. With Ethereal, you then lose your B12 which is very valuable.
-Mileena in order to open up opponents with a 50/50 has both options - death on block. Jax then full combo punishes into corner carry. Jax shares same problem, but has various ways to open her up without a 50/50.
-Mileena F44 is full combo punishable vs Jax with 123.

Summary : Mileena has to take more risks and more reads to open up Jax and cash in damage. Jax takes minimal risks to open up Mileena while controlling the pace of the match cashing in more damage. The game is too young to put in MU numbers just yet, but saying it isn't a bad MU right now is insane.

And go ahead and ask @Yoaks , I run the MU with him and discuss and look for different ways to explore it all the time. He'd agree with me 100%.

So please do yourself the favor and fuck off next time.
Click to expand...
Before this thread gets further derailed can we try and keep it civil please. Matchup discussion is more than welcome though so I appreciate the Jax points.

Just a few questions and answers though

You say Jax takes less risk with advancing normals but so does piercing with b12. I feel like neutral is fairly even in that matchup.

While yes Jax does have pretty strong corner carry bear in mind that if Mileena opens you up, her combos almost always swap position and on the unlikely chance it didn't she always has the option to, with b22 1+3.

Mileena has really good range on her d4, while it's not the fastest, due to Jax's short range on his low pokes I feel like it's enough to still contest with his pokes.

Just wondering you talk about d3 beating ball roll/ex roll followed up by 123 but what happens if the d3 is just blocked? Wouldn't a follow up ball roll low profile the start of 123?

That's the thing though, while the 50/50 is a strong part of her game it isn't always necessary to fall back on.

Last thing I wanna add is that yes losing b12 in ethereal obviously hurts her footsies but she still has a strong footsie tool in f24. Not to mention ethereal lets her use her unsafer footsie tools (f4) more sparingly as she can make herself safe with fade's.

I honestly don't think this is a losing matchup for Mileena.
 
Akromaniac27

Akromaniac27

Ready to lose your head?
JustPressingButtons said:
Who am I? Ask @rev0lver if you want, he's played me in person before :).

Better yet, who are you outside of being a lab monster? I don't see you making placements offline either. So stfu with that nonsense.

Who's this guy to make Mileena MU numbers while he's just a streamer playing ranked matches all day everyday? Who's his legitimate MU exp to shoot out numbers for every character?

Now besides that failed attempt to discredit me, I'll use Jax for an example. Granted I've played this one online and in the lab because there isn't any offline Mileena's anywhere near me, Jax bullies Mileena anywhere on the screen, and takes minimal risks getting in. Jax will walk Mileena down to the corner. Then when Jax is in, it's only one combo to pretty much get you from corner to corner. In Piercing, Jax can damn near do whatever he wants on knockdown, as he can always check with a D3 to stuff wake ups, then block in time if an EX Ball Roll comes out. The only way to safely wake up is with ethereal, but that is giving up Mileena's strong B12, and more meter dependent. The wake up problem is amplified when Jax is in heavy weapons when you can D3, 123~rocket cancel for hit confirm. Also, can we stop forgetting that Mileena has to commit to a -31 special or throw to get out of pressure? Essentially this is one of those MU's were Mileena runs away and throw sais and Jax gives chase, then when Jax is in Mileena realistically has a really hard time getting out of pressure. When Mileena is cornered, she's stays on the ground in piercing, or gains evasiveness in ethereal but gives up her most valuable tools in that MU for a wake up.
Click to expand...
So you yourself are going to duck the question of your lurking? Even better, duck the set I challenged you to? You talk real big for JUST an online player, much like many of us. If you play competitively as often as you say, that's a different story from our previous debuckle, not to mention, where are your results. You see here, trying to be a sourpuss will land you in hot water where if you're going to point fingers and ATTEMPT an argument, you're expected to back your claims then as well as have your own hands clean. You paint a pretty picture in a half passed description for just your character without even exploring what the other one has. If you ACTUALLY believe ANY characters only option on knockdown is to wakeup, its pretty damn hard to give credit to anything else since it clearly shows your lack of basic ass FG meta.

But please do us all a favor and leave the thread if you're not going to contribute anything but your butthurt feelings. Come back AFTER our set and then give your feedback, or else spend your time more productively. All I ever hear/see from you is a whole load of talk and absolutely nothing to back it up or EVER rise to the challenge, and yet you STILL talk.
 
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Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JustPressingButtons said:
So you yourself have nothing productive to say even tho I countered every one of your claims, and not only you discredited me saying I'm a nobody, you go on to discredit another player who you know plays offline too and didn't say anything? Fuck out of here with that shit and fuck you too, I don't care what you have to think of me when I'm out there training to compete at a high level.

What have you done besides create weak tech no one gives a shit about? Or post random pictures of Pugs? Want a pat in the back for being a "lab monster"? Congratulations you've attained some non existent reputation for your great achievements. Bet you can't wait to hear the day someone says "I've won using the Doombawkz tech". Guess what? It's never going to happen btw, so take that rep and shove it up your pretentious ass.

Guess I have to say the barebones for you to understand. Better yet I'll have it in bullet points.

-Jax takes less risks and controls the pace of the match with advancing normals approaching Mileena.
-Mileena plays keep away with sais majority of the match, and B12 if using Piercing
-One touch with Jax = extreme corner carry and damage, and if cornered Mileena's options to get out are blown up by D3 and block.
-Mileena can Ball Roll out of pressure, this option is - death on block, or avoided with Jax D3, Mileena's pokes are lacking range and can't follow up with one back
-Oki game is present with both characters
-On knockdown in the corner, piercing's only viable wake up is EX Ball Roll, again, loses to Jax D3 into block. Switch to Ethereal if you want the ability to wake up out of the corner. With Ethereal, you then lose your B12 which is very valuable.
-Mileena in order to open up opponents with a 50/50 has both options - death on block. Jax then full combo punishes into corner carry. Jax shares same problem, but has various ways to open her up without a 50/50.
-Mileena F44 is full combo punishable vs Jax with 123.

Summary : Mileena has to take more risks and more reads to open up Jax and cash in damage. Jax takes minimal risks to open up Mileena while controlling the pace of the match cashing in more damage. The game is too young to put in MU numbers just yet, but saying it isn't a bad MU right now is insane.

And go ahead and ask @Yoaks , I run the MU with him and discuss and look for different ways to explore it all the time. He'd agree with me 100%.

So please do yourself the favor and fuck off next time.
Click to expand...
For convenience of the topic, I'll again spoiler my rebuttal since outside of you I don't think anyone else really cares about you being wrong. Its kinda obvious, though I do always appreciate a masochist. Take more of a beating, come back for another.
Oof, so bitter. So delicious. Countered every one of what claim? Your post literally went as followed:

I'm a good player, just ask (insert player name here, literally could've been anybody). > Didn't counter anything due to lack of credibility of source, also fell further when actually attempting to describe the MU.

You're a lab monster. > Didn't counter anything as it was a self-admitted fact, doesn't actually affect the discussion at all.

Here is what I think of the Jax v Mileena MU > Countered nothing, not only was it online exclusive but no footage or evidence was shown to actually back your claim. Referenced Yoaks, a semi-reputable source, whom has yet to come in and say anything. Match-up description shows a very shallow, almost surface-only level of knowledge of even the most basic things such as match-flow, availability of options of the other side, and so on.

And that was it... Now to dismantle your new post, since you were so gracious to provide me with such a meal...

I provided my input on the MU of my expertise, and simply went further on to state that you instigating in the first place is in poor taste on account of you being about as reliable in a serious discussion as Ra Helios was. And discredit both players? I think not, I put you down for the non-existence whereas I admitted that Revolver is both a great player and guy, but has not made major achievements that would make him a valid source in your discussion, and that his only readily-known achievements were his misfortune of fighting Zod that one time and his usual antics. In "barebones" as you might say, I discredited you and discredit Revolver as a means of backing your argument, but not revolver himself.

Its already happened (in regards to the entire tech discussion), but I can only assume you are new here and don't know it. You've been a member since... I don't really care when. Obviously you haven't lurked enough. People know who I am to the point where I can show to up a random tourney unannounced and be recognized. You can't even post in the forum and have that happen. People tag me for a reason, and there isn't a single person on this forum who doesn't associate my name with Bane tech, or tech in general. So I'll keep my pretentious pug pictures on deck, they aren't going anywhere. Much like yourself and your "competitive" dreams.

Lets see your bullet points...
- Wow, so descriptive. I almost expected "Jax punches her, which does damage", but you've outdone yourself. He approaches her, thats great. I'm sure no other character does that. So good. Lets pretend she doesn't have means to punish your approaching normals, such as her lower hitbox moves and generally faster/longer pokes, or her very decent air game which can abuse Jax's lack of vertical reach outside of his b.2 stuff.

- Oh? Every Match? Sounds like some top Mileena play there, its a wonder how anyone manages to lose to her. I mean Jax gets in every time for basically free, right? According to you, I mean. Very impressive. Only sais. Yeah. Wow. Great. So good.

- One touch blah blah something, yes corner carry exists. Thank god this is a one way street, otherwise this point would fall flat on its face if Jax and Mileena tended to be pretty even in the neutral. Oh wait...

- Naked ball roll? Its a wonder why anyone even plays Mileena. The ones that do must all have such struggles. Having to ball roll naked all the time. Yep...

- Only thing you've said so far that isn't shit on a plate. Two claps for you, good sir. Two claps. Hip hip. *clap clap*

- So if your only option to blow those up are d.3, block, and d.3 into block, then what stops mileena from just blocking? But hey, I'm no expert. I'm sure Mileena players have had their block buttons forcibly removed and aren't able to read the simple pattern of d.3 into block. Wake-up every time. No exceptions. Top level play.

- Correct me if I'm... Actually, don't, because I'm not. Mileena doesn't need to put herself into - frames to kill you, you do know that right? She has pressure options outside of the full commitment.

- So a vastly negative string is punishable. Cool, bonus points for you. I never would've guessed. So amazing. Wow. You sure know your stuff. Tell me, if she takes too much damage, does she lose? You know such in-depth stuff about the MU that I can only wonder what other arcane secrets you have.

Summary: Yeah, so what numbers do you put on it? Even with the game being "too young" or whatever you wanna say about it, if you can't confidently say you think its a 6-4/7-3/8-2 then you can't confidently say that your information is accurate. If you are going to make a case, make it with conviction.

Sure why not since you've taken it upon yourself to respond to the entire rant which I put into spoilers to keep the topic from being derailed, @Yoaks please provide your entire account of exactly how the MU is played offline at a top level.
I can only assume you to be the actual voice of guidance, and hopefully not the Mileena he is describing to be so free on wake-up and so crippled in the neutral.
 
Akromaniac27

Akromaniac27

Ready to lose your head?
YoloRoll1stHit said:
I actually don't agree with a lot of these numbers. Some of you guys overestimate her B12, it doesn't reach very far and it can be low profiled easily by a lot of characters
Click to expand...
Yep, I agree, and I was "generous" on some 6-4 since I feel they're more 5.5-4.5 or just 5-5s but hard ones for the opponent since she'd still have the upper hand.

For these, aside from running the MUs, it was based on the neutral, options in b12 range, meter dependency on both sides, full screen presence, on knockdown, damage, and then how safe the other character was including the gaps they had.

That's why I felt like someone like Kitana for example doesn't lose badly, but definitely struggles despite her variation, because she NEEDS to utilize meter and needs to be up close or else she will lose the game. B12 outclasses Kitana is RS, in Assassin, opens her up to parry in which she'll get punished for it, and I'm Mournful, HAS to use meter to stop it, all the while losing her momentum. From full screen, all three still pose no threat since every option she has can be reacted upon such as her reflect and air glaives, and so on.

But overall, I do understand what you're saying. I still think the only person she MIGHT have a 4-6 or 4.5-5.5, because its not horrible but not easy, is against Liu Kang.
 
rev0lver

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
Doombawkz said:
I mean Revolver, wowza. Now THERE'S a household name. I remember all those times I've heard about how hype it was when Revolver did something. Like inching across the screen that one time in Injustice.
And uh.... Smoking weed? I think he made a cucumber bong once. That was pretty cool. I mean I went for a dig and it was a rather deep one, and I don't want to be catty but...
Rev0lver's biggest recent achievement was maybe making top 64 at a tourney, I think. I don't know, the bracket didn't go further than top 32. He's a good guy and a good player, but I don't think his name validates your point.
Like is Rev0lver a good player? He might be the best, I wouldn't know, but I mean I could tag a player to back my argument and mine is probably the better source.
But I don't need to. If I did, I would, but frankly I don't need anyone else to show that I know something.
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damn i forgot about the household name of doombawkz.

i mean it's not like i've placed at majors before or anything. sorry i haven't met your standards in mkx so far because i haven't been playing much. but i guess that deserves you blowing me up for my name merely getting mentioned (you're both free btw)
 
Jolt

Jolt

Uprise
Hey Akro, thanks for posting your opinions on the matchups. Definitely appreciate your contributions, I haven't gone too in depth with the numbers just yet but if I have any feedback I'll send it your way. While I agree that one man's online experience isn't the best indicator of MUs (no offense, as I obviously respect you), I would also argue that having this as a baseline to work with is better than nothing. I certainly won't look a gift horse in the mouth. Thanks for not giving up the character, game, or community

 
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