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MK11 SHANG TSUNG Discussion

legion666

legion666

Champion
There is a KB listed for the Explosive Corpses ability now, on it’s very far version it is listed as a second amplify and said to work if the move hits max range, can’t understand how to get it to work !!
 
WhooFlungPoo

WhooFlungPoo

Apprentice
Why is noone talking about how slide jumps over opponents regularly on the meter burn , whiffs due to hitbox shenanigans and throws your controller automatically as your healthbar drains?
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
WhooFlungPoo said:
Why is noone talking about how slide jumps over opponents regularly on the meter burn , whiffs due to hitbox shenanigans and throws your controller automatically as your healthbar drains?
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I've been labbing and playing through all 5 character stages in the last two days and I've only seen that once.
 
legion666

legion666

Champion
WhooFlungPoo said:
Why is noone talking about how slide jumps over opponents regularly on the meter burn , whiffs due to hitbox shenanigans and throws your controller automatically as your healthbar drains?
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You can delay the timing of the mb, I know that I usually whiff the amplify on Sub-Zero from max range Slide, but if I delay the amplify a bit it works every time.
 
ABACABB

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
What do you do vs characters with fast projectiles like baraka when they walk back and forward and zone making it harder to aim corpse drop and trade ?
 
MagicMan357

MagicMan357

"130 ms is more legit than Labbing" - TYM
I like all characters and so far he seems top notch, i just come and laugh at all the whining while i pick up the real tech.

When i get him dont worry ill actually lab him up.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
His V3 is the most fun I've had since release. I wish they would add his soul steal move to it since that's what is all about and even named. But more importantly, make the Rain kick better. Now it can be poked off of almost every attack so you don't have many options to use it as a mix up tool. And if you do get a hit, the damage is awful. Even 2 bar combo is meh. Not to mention it's KB which is the worst in the game, requirement and damage wise and you even have to amplify to get a follow up. Ridiculous.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
I can't believe I just got the Rain KB in a real match lol. And even got the Reptile KB in the same kombo to win the match. So satisfying. I got one question though if anyone knows. Where on PC are the replays saved? I'd really want to save that replay somehow. Or it's not an actual file but the game just simulates a match with the buttons we pressed?
 
Agilaz

Agilaz

It has begun
Zviko said:
His V3 is the most fun I've had since release. I wish they would add his soul steal move to it since that's what is all about and even named. But more importantly, make the Rain kick better. Now it can be poked off of almost every attack so you don't have many options to use it as a mix up tool. And if you do get a hit, the damage is awful. Even 2 bar combo is meh. Not to mention it's KB which is the worst in the game, requirement and damage wise and you even have to amplify to get a follow up. Ridiculous.
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Careful, mentioning any of that gets you branded "a scrub" and that you should "LaB MoRe"

That said, I feel Rain Kick functions pretty how much it has to. It's safe-ish on block (-8 or -9 I think, but with good pushback), leads to his big 2-bar combos and the cancels are good to have if you use them sparringly.

Two things I'd like to see improved in this variation are increased base damage on lift, and the Rain Kick KB should give a free follow up at no meter cost. Seriously, it's rare enough to hit, the damage is ass, but you ALSO have to spend meter for a follow up? The lift KB also has meh damage but at least it gives you a free bounce.
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
Agilaz said:
Careful, mentioning any of that gets you branded "a scrub" and that you should "LaB MoRe"

That said, I feel Rain Kick functions pretty how much it has to. It's safe-ish on block (-8 or -9 I think, but with good pushback), leads to his big 2-bar combos and the cancels are good to have if you use them sparringly.

Two things I'd like to see improved in this variation are increased base damage on lift, and the Rain Kick KB should give a free follow up at no meter cost. Seriously, it's rare enough to hit, the damage is ass, but you ALSO have to spend meter for a follow up? The lift KB also has meh damage but at least it gives you a free bounce.
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When in fact it's because I labbed too much or else I couldn't possibly know any of that. ;)

Yes the kick is good on block and it's great for cancelling into off of F2 and especially B1. I just wish it had a bit faster startup so it could be gapless in some other strings, not just 21 which is not good at all. I guess that would make it very strong though since it's pretty much safe on block. But it is supposed to be the main tool to open people up in this variation. So using it in strings is not about guessing if you will cancel the kick but only if you will cancel the string into Rain. And if they guess, they get full combo punish. If they guess wrong, big deal, they eat 5-7%. 24% for F243 KB which is not a big deal either, once per match anyway.

I agree with the damage though. Many characters can get that damage (some even more) with 1 bar. Also, the lift KB is not free. You have to amplify it to even get the KB. So it's barely any more damage. Not even 5%. Not only that, the bounce after KB is not as big as without it so your follow up is even tighter.
 
K

kcd117

Kombatant
Agilaz said:
Careful, mentioning any of that gets you branded "a scrub" and that you should "LaB MoRe"

That said, I feel Rain Kick functions pretty how much it has to. It's safe-ish on block (-8 or -9 I think, but with good pushback), leads to his big 2-bar combos and the cancels are good to have if you use them sparringly.

Two things I'd like to see improved in this variation are increased base damage on lift, and the Rain Kick KB should give a free follow up at no meter cost. Seriously, it's rare enough to hit, the damage is ass, but you ALSO have to spend meter for a follow up? The lift KB also has meh damage but at least it gives you a free bounce.
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Ninja Shang is really bad imo. What bothers me the most is that it is only a few reasonable changes away from being good.

- Change de super kick KB to counter hit, give it a lot of pushback on block and make the cancel recover faster.

- Better dmg scaling on both lift and super kick so he hits for 32% in a 1 bar BnB.

- Going into any ninja form counts as a morph and the back throw KB requirement gives you 4 seconds to connect it.

With those he’d be fine and have an actual gameplan, bc if I had to describe ninja Shang current archetype I’d say his archetype is “shitty”. Shitty dmg, shitty KBs, shitty frame data, shitty gimmicks, shitty fillscreen presence... everything this variation adds to him is shitty.
 
Agilaz

Agilaz

It has begun
kcd117 said:
Ninja Shang is really bad imo. What bothers me the most is that it is only a few reasonable changes away from being good.

- Change de super kick KB to counter hit, give it a lot of pushback on block and make the cancel recover faster.

- Better dmg scaling on both lift and super kick so he hits for 32% in a 1 bar BnB.

- Going into any ninja form counts as a morph and the back throw KB requirement gives you 4 seconds to connect it.

With those he’d be fine and have an actual gameplan, bc if I had to describe ninja Shang current archetype I’d say his archetype is “shitty”. Shitty dmg, shitty KBs, shitty frame data, shitty gimmicks, shitty fillscreen presence... everything this variation adds to him is shitty.
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I would love to see this happen, but realistically, I'm not counting on it. NRS has already established that they want the character to be low damage for whatever reason, and since they FIRST major change he got was a damage nerf, I don't ever see them going back on it. Same with his frames. You have two choices: give up your turn on block or risk the plus frames and get flawless blocked launched.

They're not gonna buff him. Only way I see it happening is if we take a page from the Kitana players' book and just constantly act like he's the absolute worst character in the game, just beyond redemption, and then MAYBE we'll get something going.
 
Morgan the pilgrim

Morgan the pilgrim

Noob
if one of ur best finishers is d2 , then u know that ur character does rly low dmg . All of his ninja moves need to have REAL KBs, with real kb dmg on top of doing more dmg in general . He should be able to do around 280-320 from one bar considering he has more or less no zoning . I strongly agree for back throw kb part of the past comments, dmg buffs and so on , but i would also cut some frames from his slide , its 20 frames ffs .
 
Zviko

Zviko

Warrior
Morgan the pilgrim said:
if one of ur best finishers is d2 , then u know that ur character does rly low dmg . All of his ninja moves need to have REAL KBs, with real kb dmg on top of doing more dmg in general . He should be able to do around 280-320 from one bar considering he has more or less no zoning . I strongly agree for back throw kb part of the past comments, dmg buffs and so on , but i would also cut some frames from his slide , its 20 frames ffs .
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If they made the slide faster they would have to change KB requirements too. Now you have to be almost frame perfect to get the KB after the Rain kick and even more so after Ermac lift. Even slightly faster starup on the slide would make it impossible. That would just be a deal breaker for me since this is one of the most satisfying things in this variation for me.
 
B

blackelipse

Noob
just make the slide like subzero Kb slide... require 3 amps...n better startup..n lil more travel distance. i wouldnt mind that.

actually they can change F4 Kb requirement also...ive landed that Kb only once since he has been release in real match
 
M2Dave

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Spellmaster is "really bad" and "shitty". LOL. The ninja variation seems average. You give up zoning for anti-zoning, which only seems useful in a handful of match ups. You can somewhat still play the basic mid range game as you would in Warlock, but you replace ground eruption with lift and slide, which are more risky but provide a tiny bit more reward in certain situations.

Warlock arguably remains mid tier and Shang Tsung's best variation, but if you intend to play a competitvely strong character who is centered around zoning, there appear to be superior options (i.e., Highborn Kitana, Spring Cleaning Cetrion, Outtake Johnny Cage) in this version of the game.
 
legion666

legion666

Champion
Agilaz said:
Careful, mentioning any of that gets you branded "a scrub" and that you should "LaB MoRe"

That said, I feel Rain Kick functions pretty how much it has to. It's safe-ish on block (-8 or -9 I think, but with good pushback), leads to his big 2-bar combos and the cancels are good to have if you use them sparringly.

Two things I'd like to see improved in this variation are increased base damage on lift, and the Rain Kick KB should give a free follow up at no meter cost. Seriously, it's rare enough to hit, the damage is ass, but you ALSO have to spend meter for a follow up? The lift KB also has meh damage but at least it gives you a free bounce.
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Kick only functions properly off b1 and 3 because you can’t interrupt those with standing jabs. F24xxsuper kick can be interrupted with an 8 frame s1. I checked with Cetrion, and If you see rain appear off f24 just mash 11, the fastest cancel off f24xxSuper Kick cancel leaves you at -12. Full combo every time, at least with Cetrion’s long s1. Some characters can’t reach him if cancels.
 
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