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MK11 SHANG TSUNG Discussion

XxSYNDROISxX

XxSYNDROISxX

For the Shokan since Mk3
Invincible Salads said:
so theres nothing that makes the roundhouse kick safe....so is this gonna be a bad variation or what?
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No not really F212 is safe if the 1 connect you golf around house if it doesn't you finish the string the one thing I've noticed with these third variations is there going more for their classic character archetypes Jax having a launching ground pound Katana having air fan combo extenders
 
K

kcd117

Noob
If his dmg output stays capped at 35% for two bars with ninja moves, his lift KB and scaling stays shit and his roundhouse stays unsafe on block and on cancels with another crappy KB requirement I don't see how this variation can be decent.

He has to have something really really REALLY good to make up for the loss of his corpse drop. That is by far his best move and it is his main neutral tool. I'm expecting at least 35% for a bar with lift and upper 20s with safe roundhouse, + practical KBs.

I also hope NRS gives some love to his 2nd variation bc it is the undisputed worst variation in the game currently.
 
M2Dave

M2Dave

Zoning Master
deathstroke187 said:
shang has now a 50/50 and its not fuzzyable since there is only a 2f gap.
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Any gap that is two frames can be fuzzy guarded. The mix up will be good initially until people learn how to block properly.

@kcd117 does a good job summarizing the potential weaknesses of the ninja variation above. Unless the ninja moves receive significant changes, you are giving up a lot for very little.

Just like in Mortal Kombat X, I predict that the vast majority of these third variations will rarely be used at a competitive level. The variation system continues to be a flawed mechanic that ought to be discarded.
 
Invincible Salads

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
M2Dave said:
Any gap that is two frames can be fuzzy guarded. The mix up will be good initially until people learn how to block properly.

@kcd117 does a good job summarizing the potential weaknesses of the ninja variation above. Unless the ninja moves receive significant changes, you are giving up a lot for very little.

Just like in Mortal Kombat X, I predict that the vast majority of these third variations will rarely be used at a competitive level. The variation system continues to be a flawed mechanic that ought to be discarded.
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yeah no, 2 frames is still really easy to mess up, its still going to be a viable mixup. people can say it won't be all they want, but it will be, especially if you don't go for it all that often.
 
Agilaz

Agilaz

It has begun
We'll have to wait and see if the patch brings any tweaks to the frame data of the moves, but I have faith it's gonna be a viable variation. Losing Corpse Drop may sting, but gaining Shake makes it a go-to variation for me in MU's like Cetrion or Skarlet.

Losing Soul Steal too is very unfortunate however. I've just started integrating it into my game and I felt it would have great potential in the ninja variation. Oh well. Gimme patch pls
 
legion666

legion666

Noob
kcd117 said:
If his dmg output stays capped at 35% for two bars with ninja moves, his lift KB and scaling stays shit and his roundhouse stays unsafe on block and on cancels with another crappy KB requirement I don't see how this variation can be decent.

He has to have something really really REALLY good to make up for the loss of his corpse drop. That is by far his best move and it is his main neutral tool. I'm expecting at least 35% for a bar with lift and upper 20s with safe roundhouse, + practical KBs.

I also hope NRS gives some love to his 2nd variation bc it is the undisputed worst variation in the game currently.
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His lift KB is very practical, Try recording Shang do f242 and f24xxlift Amp hold, and play them back randomly. Then try Flawless blocking the f242, if you press block with the same timing when Shang does f24xxlift amp you get KB. There is a way to fuzzy that, by holding block after f24 and then just release tap it, but it is waaay harder to Flawless block f242 consistently like that.
 
legion666

legion666

Noob
Shake May compensates for the corpses, since Shang won’t zone effectively, but won’t be zoned either. But the lack of some crucial punishes that the far Ground Eruption makes possible, and the ability to convert of f242 makes me doubt as well. And on top of that he looses the Soul Steal and a KB on a back throw that it provides.
 
legion666

legion666

Noob
Why does Shang’s slide amp do less damage than Sub’s. Sub’s is 11 frames and does 7% non amp, amp adds 8%. Shang’s is 20 frames does 7% and the amp only adds 5%. Being slow actually helps it being a mix up off b1d2, but why so little damage for a bar?
 
Agilaz

Agilaz

It has begun
Max damage I found so far for midscreen, 2 bars is 375 off a 10f high.

It feels alright playing this sort of game but hopefully we'll have a bit of damage tweaking once the patchs drops
 
legion666

legion666

Noob
Agilaz said:
Max damage I found so far for midscreen, 2 bars is 375 off a 10f high.

It feels alright playing this sort of game but hopefully we'll have a bit of damage tweaking once the patchs drops
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It might be without using the reptile slide KB. What combo are you talking about exactly?
 
1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Agilaz said:
We'll have to wait and see if the patch brings any tweaks to the frame data of the moves, but I have faith it's gonna be a viable variation. Losing Corpse Drop may sting, but gaining Shake makes it a go-to variation for me in MU's like Cetrion or Skarlet.

Losing Soul Steal too is very unfortunate however. I've just started integrating it into my game and I felt it would have great potential in the ninja variation. Oh well. Gimme patch pls
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Shake doesn't parry her tongue move (ex either) so still think that mu be annoying
 
deathstroke187

deathstroke187

Noob
M2Dave said:
Any gap that is two frames can be fuzzy guarded. The mix up will be good initially until people learn how to block properly.

@kcd117 does a good job summarizing the potential weaknesses of the ninja variation above. Unless the ninja moves receive significant changes, you are giving up a lot for very little.

Just like in Mortal Kombat X, I predict that the vast majority of these third variations will rarely be used at a competitive level. The variation system continues to be a flawed mechanic that ought to be discarded.
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have you even tried to go lab and fuzzy it ? it might be possible but its super tight i dont care what anyone reactions are but online good luck
 
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legion666

legion666

Noob
B1d2/b1xxslide is fuzziable in theory, you can train yourself to block it every time with practice. But good luck with that online or in the hit of the tournament match. Only people like Sonic or Ninja will eventually block it. But I don’t think even they will do it every time in tournament.
 
Marinjuana

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
Well you won't have too much fun fuzzying B12/B1~slide as B1 is already a great stagger with the overhead and other followup.

legion666 said:
The 3rd variation gets damage off 114 autoshimmy in the corner which no other variation does
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1176996358957522946
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Hey, Soultaker gets 23% from that! :mad:

deathstroke187 said:
shang also have another 50/50

21 u2d2 or 21 slide i didnt check the frames on that one. the rewards arent that great but still a way to open up
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21U2D2 goes mid-overhead at the end I think people will be able to react to that quite easily. Speaking of which, that string is kind of trash. Anyone find uses for it?
 
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