SaltShaker
In Zoning We Trust
He may not even be the strongest character but he's the one getting the most attention.

He may not even be the strongest character but he's the one getting the most attention.
Yeah, man. These guys worried about his tools and shit.The problem with Deadshot is his fucking ugly skull mask gear.
Idk man. I didn't like MKx and I definitely called how stupid Alien was. So people who liked MKx must've seen it.Remember how no one noticed Alien that entire time, calling him "likely low mid tier" while they complained about CSZ, and Alien turned out the most broken of all?
Ryu or Nash would be a better example. Idk if anyone was out for Dhalsim blood like that. People might have thought he was better than he acruelly was but IDK about nerfs.Remember in SFV when Dhalsim was "broken with OP zoning that needed to be nerfed ASAP"? Remember when he was considered Top 3? Remember when a couple of months passed and people realized he wasn't that great once they learned the MU and he ended up low tier?
Nerfing his 50/50s is the most reasonable suggestion because it would make his gameplay be comparable with the other zoners. You're right there are other ways to nerf him but this way would be the most agreeable by the general public. I personally feel that meter burn roll should come out faster for a lot more characters and characters who are mainly zoners should have slower recovering forward dashes to make their meter burn rolls come out slower (dead shot has one of the best meterburn rolls) but I understand that this would be hard to agree upon. It does not take that much time to realize that deadshot's zoning gameplan doesn't really match up with the rest of the games logic and so I don't see the point in waiting unless you just want to take advantage of it.I just don't see how you or anyone here can know what specific changes need to be made within a weeks time. Maybe the best solution is to buff some of the characters who struggle? Maybe not. Like I said early, it's more risky to make knee jerk changes early on than it is to let the game play out a bit before hand. He may not even be the strongest character but he's the one getting the most attention.
I don't play deadshot though. I just don't want them to start changing the game before things are more thoroughly explored. I never mentioned other ways to nerf him or nerfs at all. If anything I've only mentioned buffing weaker characters but it's still too early.Nerfing his 50/50s is the most reasonable suggestion because it would make his gameplay be comparable with the other zoners. You're right there are other ways to nerf him but this way would be the most agreeable by the general public. I personally feel that meter burn roll should come out faster for a lot more characters and characters who are mainly zoners should have slower recovering forward dashes to make their meter burn rolls come out slower (dead shot has one of the best meterburn rolls) but I understand that this would be hard to agree upon. It does not take that much time to realize that deadshot's zoning gameplan doesn't really match up with the rest of the games logic and so I don't see the point in waiting unless you just want to take advantage of it.
I don't think Fate does well against Deadshot. He's got nothing to contest Deadshot's projectile speed, no chance you're getting out an orb period, get in where I feel Deadshot is better up close, or maybe land a push and send him full screen again where you get outzoned. Is there something I should be exploiting?let the damn game breath... all this bitching and its not even week 2.
the mentality to cry and ask for NRS help rather than figure it out on your own is the scrubbiest thing you can do. many characters deal with his zoning just fine. fate, atroc, cheetah the list is acutally huge.
but you guys just go ahead and be hypocrites and complain about deadshot and cheer for atrocitus unfuzziable 50/50/50/50/50/50 or let captain cold keep his corner unavoidable unblockable reset.
man get gud ppl
how much damage does deadshot high shot do? or bounce shot.I don't think Fate does well against Deadshot. .
Nah they weren't crying as bad as the babies here are about Dhalsim, but they definitely were on the top 3 bandwagon for quite a while. Had players wrecking with him early on like "wow so OP" but then time happened. I forgot all about Ryu though, that actually is a better example further proving my point here.Ryu or Nash would be a better example. Idk if anyone was out for Dhalsim blood like that. People might have thought he was better than he acruelly was but IDK about nerfs.
And since you brought up SF, do you really believe it's OK to have a safe (or plus) invincible move? For a zoner? SF4 did away with those and SFV punishes you with big damage. And I did see that black canary video you posted and I have no clue why that even works like that. But just like how tech got developed in SF4, it still got taken away.
I'll try to initiate a trade war more often, good tip. I just don't see it happening unless it's literally full screen.how much damage does deadshot high shot do? or bounce shot.
how much damage does fate projectile do?
how much damage does fate trait projectile do?
what happens if I duck a high shot and do a projectile and you do another one full screen? if he blocks you do another and trade with any follow up and keep your turn or get in a trade war. then see the first to questions.
what happens if you are 3/4 screen and duck a high shot and do a projectile and he does another high shot?
what happens when you trade?
I reallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllly am getting sick of bullshit posts from people that just want to see nerfs
Is it being punished on startup like that canary vid. BTW, do other wakeups get beat by a meaty? I ask because that raises the question if it's "working as intended".For the WU, I don't think this should even be discussed anymore as many of the good players are already finding multiple ways to punish it during matches.
they couldn't handle it, besides Jin vs Jin was the only even MU in that game and the only one able to cancel out JFLS since Jin had a parry since then.Just imagine if this current community had to play through years of Tekken 4 Jin and simply learn the MU, their options, and deal with it. Imagine. @Eddy Wang
Public outcry absolutely has an effect on game patches, it's not the only deciding factor but you're crazy if you think that it's not on people's radar, they're game designers but they're also a business, keeping the masses happy definitely comes into play at some level(this doesn't just go for NRS games or even just fighting games in general).Do people really think public outcry is a determining factor for patches? Y'all must really think NRS can't think for themselves. NRS always releases bonkers character then go through a patching process. This should be nothing new to anyone even slightlY paying attention. I think they've gotten better at patching but overall still need to get better. And no way DS doesn't get touched by Mid-June
Idk man. I didn't like MKx and I definitely called how stupid Alien was. So people who liked MKx must've seen it.
Plus it's NRS, broken (in either direction) DLC is kind of their thing.
Ryu or Nash would be a better example. Idk if anyone was out for Dhalsim blood like that. People might have thought he was better than he acruelly was but IDK about nerfs.
And since you brought up SF, do you really believe it's OK to have a safe (or plus) invincible move? For a zoner? SF4 did away with those and SFV punishes you with big damage. And I did see that black canary video you posted and I have no clue why that even works like that. But just like how tech got developed in SF4, it still got taken away.
When I've played solid players, the jump and whiff punish for full combo is too real to the point where I was nervous to WU. Ducky punished almost every one of my WUs.That doesn't sound as godlike as some make it out to be. Since it's a short forward lunge you can also full combo punish with S1 if you aren't directly on top of him when the invincibility frames are gone. With the meaty's though I still haven't figured that out on who is punishable how, but it seems like almost all WUs are full punishable one way or another with very few exceptions, Deadshot not being the exception.Is it being punished on startup like that canary vid. BTW, do other wakeups get beat by a meaty? I ask because that raises the question if it's "working as intended".
not to get too sidetracked, but ryu was definitely not top 1, but he was also well above upper mid tier. He was very arguably a top 5 character.that being said he did receive way too many nerfs because people were dumb.Yeah, Ryu was considered top 1 by some on SF5 S1 when he was upper mid at best. He caught some serious nerfs that pushed him to bottom tier. This was after almost a year into the game...
Haha yea I think Yoshimitsu (of all people) was the only other 5-5 for Jin. Then you had Steve and Nina in a tier of their own right behind Jin, with Lee almost there. Jin beat like 5-6 characters 8-2, the rest 7-3, and a few 6-4 LOLOL!!! Through all of that you didn't hear complaining even close to this, and it was hype when you beat a Jin or a Steve. First hand my most memorable fighting game moment ever was beating Justin Wong's Jin in tournament at ChinaTown Fair and yelling at him to go back to Marvel vs Capcom 2 lol. Some epic pop offs.they couldn't handle it, besides Jin vs Jin was the only even MU in that game and the only one able to cancel out JFLS since Jin had a parry since then.
Sometimes i feel like this is not even a community problem, is just ppl creating account to come bitching in here as usual.
I don't necessarily think the argument that bad balance can equal hype moments is a good one, it's true but it's not a great argument to champion. Jin was busted, and in today's competitive scene would be patched into either normalcy or oblivion(justifiably). If you wanna have purposefully bad characters you can, but I don't think having purposefully op characters is a thing you can do.Haha yea I think Yoshimitsu (of all people) was the only other 5-5 for Jin. Then you had Steve and Nina in a tier of their own right behind Jin, with Lee almost there. Jin beat like 5-6 characters 8-2, the rest 7-3, and a few 6-4 LOLOL!!! Through all of that you didn't hear complaining even close to this, and it was hype when you beat a Jin or a Steve. First hand my most memorable fighting game moment ever was beating Justin Wong's Jin in tournament at ChinaTown Fair and yelling at him to go back to Marvel vs Capcom 2 lol. Some epic pop offs.
In 2017 though, these young boys don't relate, no grinding required. Ya gotta shed them tears to get what you want. -.-
I never said no company looks at public outcry. But it's nowhere a deciding factor or else that company might as well be deemed incompetent. If a ton of my player base is complaining about a character sure I'll look over that character. But just hearing complaints shouldn't make me or any Dev actually change a character.Public outcry absolutely has an effect on game patches, it's not the only deciding factor but you're crazy if you think that it's not on people's radar, they're game designers but they're also a business, keeping the masses happy definitely comes into play at some level(this doesn't just go for NRS games or even just fighting games in general).
They will pick lord akumer to get back in the game... shit we're derailing this thread hard, lets continue this in the Tekken forum.Haha yea I think Yoshimitsu (of all people) was the only other 5-5 for Jin. Then you had Steve and Nina in a tier of their own right behind Jin, with Lee almost there. Jin beat like 5-6 characters 8-2, the rest 7-3, and a few 6-4 LOLOL!!! Through all of that you didn't hear complaining even close to this, and it was hype when you beat a Jin or a Steve. First hand my most memorable fighting game moment ever was beating Justin Wong's Jin in tournament at ChinaTown Fair and yelling at him to go back to Marvel vs Capcom 2 lol. Some epic pop offs.
In 2017 though, these young boys don't relate, no grinding required. Ya gotta shed them tears to get what you want. -.-
Nah that's not what I meant. Obviously T4 Jin was better than anyone this community has ever seen, by far actually.I don't necessarily think the argument that bad balance can equal hype moments is a good one, it's true but it's not a great argument to champion. Jin was busted, and in today's competitive scene would be patched into either normalcy or oblivion(justifiably). If you wanna have purposefully bad characters you can, but I don't think having purposefully op characters is a thing you can do.
Also that's a bad comparison lol. Jin wasn't a character you could suddenly make balanced by learning the mu. Dead shot might be.