Name your top 5 MKX Characters in order & List one hypothetical Nerf for each

[STRYKIE]

4 - Shinnok (Boneshaper)
- Dark Beam and Dark Blast is now 20f start-up from 15f;
- Dark Beam and Dark Blast is now -20 from -12

So you essentially want to make Dark Beam WORSE than VANILLA Dark Beam?

@Braindead

ppl asking liu nerfs : "give it the same as scorpion received about cancels"... cool...
so give liu top 5 air game , instant teleport and high damage mix ups.

plus flame aura

Can Hellfire get Liu's F4, B1, D3, low and air fireballs, and armored reversals then pls?

 

[One Inch Punch]

So you essentially want to make Dark Beam WORSE than VANILLA Dark Beam?

@Braindead

Can Hellfire get Liu's F4, B1, D3, low and air fireballs, and armored reversals then pls?

better idea: leave kang with his own tools and for scorpion the same

also, give kang a armored move that can go full combo, teleport cancel, and pokes faster than 9 frames

and, as a quan player, could u explain why a mix up is plus on block leading to another 50/50 ?

 

[Zabru]

come on tooki we all know why you put erron top 5 you silly goose

tooki exposed

https://account.xbox.com/en-us/gameclip/528d3d79-3061-4c35-9c6d-b4d25c86c5dc?gamerTag=LAHWFF&scid=1a930100-429f-476c-bfaf-f01b3c1f5b39

I could not stop laughing so fucking funny that hitbox is pretty good.

 

[DarkFire*]

IMO the only character that needs nerfs is Quan Chi, and a universal jump in punch nerf to make air attacks much more susceptible to anti-airs and much less ridiculous lol.

1.) Quan Chi (Summoner) - Increase damage scaling on bat
Reason: He won't get ridiculous damage anymore

Honestly I don't think any other character needs nerfs. I'd buff the lower tiers first. But for the sake of discussion:

2.) Kung Lao (Tempest) - EX Hat Spin sucks you in on block
Reason: Make it much easier to punish (this has already been said several times)

3.) Shinnok (Boneshaper) - I would say d4~hellsparks is no longer a true blockstring since it's kinda dumb, but that might hurt the other variations so Idk.

4.) Liu Kang (Dragon's Fire) - MB Flying kick is now neutral on block or -2
Reason: He can't get in and start pressure for free anymore

5.) Jax - Remove the OS he has
Reason: OS should not be in the game at all, no character should have them, but Jax especially takes advantage of it

 

[james1926]

Hello, My name is Shujinkydink and they call me a Quan Chi downplayer.

Since this is an opinion thread im gonna give my opinion. There are only two characters on this roster who i think need nerfs. Tanya and Kung Lao. Quan chi does not need nerfs!!! He is perfectly fine the way he is and is a top 5 character. Honestly, i wouldn't even care so much if Kung lao didnt get nerfed. But Quan is not a serious threat to the tournament scene. There is currently only one quan chi doing well, and i believe his best placement is 3rd at a major. A lot of people whine and say "oh but hes so broken online, his hard to blockables are pretty much impossible to block." Well imo facts would say otherwise. Ive done some research and here's what ive found.

During the first 5 weeks of ESL, Tanya has been present in the top 8 a total of 10 times. Kung Lao has been present a total of 11 times. You know how many times Quan chi has been in Top 8? not once. His setups and damage are great, and his mixups are annoying, but NOT OP. People clearly know how to beat him and are doing so consistently. The reason balance changes happen in fighting games is for the competitive player, not the casuals, and right now competitively quan doesn't seem to be giving anyone major problems. There's lots of things i would LIKE nerfed in this game, such as sub zeros clone, Kung Lao's tempest spin, hell i even think Erron black could use some toning down, but none of things are neccessary. At this point in the game, infinites and glitches have been mostly removed and we are lucky to even see a new patch. The nerf list should be a very short and very minimal one, and we should be focusing more on buffs to the lower tiers to lessen the gap and make it more enjoyable so everyone can use their character.

In my opinion people dont use Quan Chi because their opinion is his pseudo unblockable will be removed 100% and they dont want to rely on that broken tactic to take wins on MKX.

 

[DDutchguy]

First of all this thread is gold, thank you Pig. The combination of salt and downplayers is fun to read

So second of all the top 5's and respective nerfs.

1. Kung Lao: Reduce JIP2's range to not-half screen. If Lao needs jip2 really really bad sure, make it Kotal's jip1's range max. Not one bit more.

2. Quan Chi: Sorry Dink, Summoner isn't fine. I'd say change low bat in a way that makes Quan unable to perform 30-40% how-do-you-block-low-and-high-at-the-same-time into even more pseudo-unblockable resets. This way I guess Quan can still do his unblockables, but only yields like 12% for it that a Quan player can use to just cash in some damage. Pls no more death traps.

3. Cassie Cage: B1 increased start-up, by a frame or three.

4. Roo Kang: Make fireball cancels not +10 to +14 but + in such a way that each character can poke out after F213's. This is mostly to make sure Liu's corner game doesn't get out of control where he can F213 fbrc you in the corner where you don't have the midscreen option of having the last hit of the string hit you. (Roo Kang is my 'I don't know a fifth' choice btw)

5. Tanya: Make the first hit of B1 a high so people can poke out and not be stuck in her skill-based (ahum) pressure. Tanya players, would B31 or whatever her low string is still work well enough instead of B1 with this nerf? No hard feelings Tanya players, I'm just salty and think her pressure is stupid. B1 nerf feels justified though.

 

[STRYKIE]

better idea: leave kang with his own tools and for scorpion the same

also, give kang a armored move that can go full combo, teleport cancel, and pokes faster than 9 frames

and, as a quan player, could u explain why a mix up is plus on block leading to another 50/50 ?

If Scorpion had one then... I suppose.... if only he had a "Flame Fist" to go to.

And friendly reminder that Warlock/Sorcerer also exist and entertain a totally different neutral to Summoner, and benefit greatly from having another way to keep the opponent on their toes.

 

[Goat-City-II]

ppl asking liu nerfs : "give it the same as scorpion received about cancels"... cool...
so give liu top 5 air game , instant teleport and high damage mix ups.

plus flame aura

I see what you're saying there, but hellfire Scorpion recieved more nerfs than just that and he's very balanced now. Plus, Scorpion doesn't have a move like Kang's b1 that can break armored moves, he doesn't have a move that gets him in for free from full screen like Dragon Fire's meter burn double dragon kick, and he doesn't have good zoning. I think making his run cancel block pressure non-guaranteed would be fine. I would like to see his fireball cancels on hit easier to do though. Give him a bit more hit advantage on his strings so the run cancel links would have a little more leniency.

 

[Eddy Wang]

This thread is full of lol.

god help us if some of the absurdity written here actually happens, and besides that, pig said one nerf, some ppl are just listing more than one, lel.

 

[st9rm]

- Tempest Lao:
regular hat spin -5 and a high
nerf jump in/back 2 range
damage scaling

- DF Kang:
flykick mb 0 on block
b1 is now 11f
d3 0 or -1 on block


- Summoner Quan:
regular lowbat hits mid, ex one hits low
bat cannot be summoned during trance
damage scaling
pushback added to ex rune

- Tanya
b1 is a high

-Cassie
gap between b121 X d1+2

 

[Big Pampering]

Some of these tempest nerfs make no sense at all. Make hatspin full combo punishable on block? Youre literally taking away his safe mid(which you can armor out of anyways), his safe overhead(which I dont get why it wouldnt be safe because he doesnt have a low, as it is right now it is a mixup between d4 and a safe overhead which is completely fine). Good kung laos dont really cancel 112124 into normal hat spin anyway. This removes the threat of armor after getting 112124 blocked. You dont want to do 112124 normal hat spin on block. Making hatspin punishable would probably move tempest to midtier

Its clear that a lot of people don't seem to even understand tempest to begin with. an 8-9 second cooldown on ex hat spin is like triple the cooldown it has now, that is really overdoing it.

If you want to nerf tempest I suggest hat spin to be -5 on block. And another 2% damage nerf to ex spin, b2 hat spin, f2 hatspin, 11212 hat spin, b321 hatspin combos. And some people seem to have a hard time punishing ex spin for some reason, so just remove the pushback on block to make it easier for them. No universal nerfs should be applied.

Quan chi: make bat a mid

Cassie: ex flipkick should be punishable

Liu kang: Not sure what he should get, but his pressure is a little bit too good.

 

[st9rm]

Hello, My name is Shujinkydink and they call me a Quan Chi downplayer.

Since this is an opinion thread im gonna give my opinion. There are only two characters on this roster who i think need nerfs. Tanya and Kung Lao. Quan chi does not need nerfs!!! He is perfectly fine the way he is and is a top 5 character. Honestly, i wouldn't even care so much if Kung lao didnt get nerfed. But Quan is not a serious threat to the tournament scene. There is currently only one quan chi doing well, and i believe his best placement is 3rd at a major. A lot of people whine and say "oh but hes so broken online, his hard to blockables are pretty much impossible to block." Well imo facts would say otherwise. Ive done some research and here's what ive found.

During the first 5 weeks of ESL, Tanya has been present in the top 8 a total of 10 times. Kung Lao has been present a total of 11 times. You know how many times Quan chi has been in Top 8? not once. His setups and damage are great, and his mixups are annoying, but NOT OP. People clearly know how to beat him and are doing so consistently. The reason balance changes happen in fighting games is for the competitive player, not the casuals, and right now competitively quan doesn't seem to be giving anyone major problems. There's lots of things i would LIKE nerfed in this game, such as sub zeros clone, Kung Lao's tempest spin, hell i even think Erron black could use some toning down, but none of things are neccessary. At this point in the game, infinites and glitches have been mostly removed and we are lucky to even see a new patch. The nerf list should be a very short and very minimal one, and we should be focusing more on buffs to the lower tiers to lessen the gap and make it more enjoyable so everyone can use their character.

as much as i respect the time and work you put into the character, i absolutely disagree with this...
summoner quan is just broken, his vortex is stupid and doesn't even require any resources...
also after seeing the damage output you demonstrated in your video out of a SAFE and UNREACTABLE 50/50 (if meterburned), all i can do is shake my head

 

[DDutchguy]

Some of these tempest nerfs make no sense at all. Make hatspin full combo punishable on block? Youre literally taking away his safe mid(which you can armor out of anyways), his safe overhead(which I dont get why it wouldnt be safe because he doesnt have a low, as it is right now it is a mixup between d4 and a safe overhead which is completely fine). Good kung laos dont really cancel 112124 into normal hat spin anyway. This removes the threat of armor after getting 112124 blocked. You dont want to do 112124 normal hat spin on block. Making hatspin punishable would probably move tempest to midtier

Its clear that a lot of people don't seem to even understand tempest to begin with. an 8-9 second cooldown on ex hat spin is like triple the cooldown it has now, that is really overdoing it.

If you want to nerf tempest I suggest hat spin to be -5 on block. And another 2% damage nerf to ex spin, b2 hat spin, f2 hatspin, 11212 hat spin, b321 hatspin combos. And some people seem to have a hard time punishing ex spin for some reason, so just remove the pushback on block to make it easier for them. No universal nerfs should be applied.

Making hatspin full combo punishable is definitely too much, but making it more - is definitely needed. It's not like I play seriously good Lao's or anything, but very often he can just get away with a regular hatspin into jump back 2 or d4, the latter of which low profiles like no tomorrow. Regular hatspin as it is now gives Lao a numerous options on block, even though he's -. I'd say make it -6 or -7 so that Lao's turn actually ends.

8-9 second cooldown is an extremely severe nerf if people are talking about the hat staying away for 8-9 seconds. That would really mess up Tempest. If they're talking about just not being able to do EX-hat spin for 8-9 seconds, it's less ludicrous though still a tad bit much. Thing is that Lao's throw takes up a lot of time and he can deal with a big part of that cooldown just from a grab, which is something Lao is great at anyway.

 

[M.D.]

If cassie ex flip kick becomes full combo punishable then make it the same for subzero ex frost bomb, for the entire cast.
Otherwise gtfo.

 

[DDutchguy]

If cassie ex flip kick becomes full combo punishable then make it the same for subzero ex frost bomb, for the entire cast.
Otherwise gtfo.

Eh, I'd say make EX flip kick -9 or something. The hitbox on it is hot garbage anyway. Making it -9 does make sure her getting out of the corner becomes too powerful.

 

[SaSSolino]

Why? He is a character with 0 losing matchups (as far as I know) and several 6-4s. How can a character like that not be Top 5? And before you say there are a lot of characters with no losing matchups... Name them, there's right around 5.

Bone Shaper might be versatile, but he does lose mathups, luckily Impostor covers most of them.

 

[Youphemism]

Someone PLEASE explain to me , exactly what shinnoks weakness is?

no they are just calling you out on your bullshit claims of shinnok not being top 5, yeah he is fine but that doesnt mean that he isnt top 5. he has massive utility, godlike space control, etc. the only thing he lacks is damage. which i would take utility over damage ANY day

Mediocre damage, meter heavy, unsafe on pretty much everything (besides F41D2 in Bone Shaper).

 

[MrProfDrPepper]

Mediocre damage, meter heavy, unsafe on pretty much everything (besides F41D2 in Bone Shaper).

He has mediocre damage to offset the amazing utility, you can make all his strings safe with hell sparks, or hell even butter gun since it pushes them so far back that it is impossible for most characters to punish him, and those that do punish him don't get much damage off it.

 

[MKB]

You mad I have a second account? Lol just wanted to let you know that on the account you blocked I completely countered all of your arguments in a comment you can't see. Gg kid, you lose. Now get counter blocked and have a wonderful day yourself

For reasons that will become apparent in several minutes, publicly admitting you have a second account is never a smart idea.

 

[Big Pampering]

Making hatspin full combo punishable is definitely too much, but making it more - is definitely needed. It's not like I play seriously good Lao's or anything, but very often he can just get away with a regular hatspin into jump back 2 or d4, the latter of which low profiles like no tomorrow. Regular hatspin as it is now gives Lao a numerous options on block, even though he's -. I'd say make it -6 or -7 so that Lao's turn actually ends.

8-9 second cooldown is an extremely severe nerf if people are talking about the hat staying away for 8-9 seconds. That would really mess up Tempest. If they're talking about just not being able to do EX-hat spin for 8-9 seconds, it's less ludicrous though still a tad bit much. Thing is that Lao's throw takes up a lot of time and he can deal with a big part of that cooldown just from a grab, which is something Lao is great at anyway.

That's just how the minus 3 - minus 5 metagame works for every character in the game not just kung lao. Making it -6 would make it full combo punishable for cassie and -7 would make it punishable for a handful of characters, which is worse than the cooldown that was suggested.

 

[SaSSolino]

1. Shinnok
Remove from the game.

2. Shinnok
Remove from the game.

3. Shinnok
Remove from the game.

4. Shinnok
Remove from the game.

5. Superman
Can't nerf Superman.

but he is the coolest char in the game D:

anyway MY TOP5 CHARS ARE (no order)

HQT PREDATOR - probably more recevery and damage nerf on lasers

SUMMONER QUAN CHI - low bat is a mid

TEMPEST LAO - ji2 gets bodied, normal hat is -6/-7 and probably something in the ex hat? really not sure

KOBU JUTSU TANYA - b1 is a mid and doesn't armor break, then either no meter build from rekkas or remove the delay thing

DRAGON FIRE KANG - something with the cancels ofc

and NERF JUMPS!

 

[stamatis]

Everyone must be nerfed except the chars you main!Nice thinking.

 

[MrProfDrPepper]

Mediocre damage, meter heavy, unsafe on pretty much everything (besides F41D2 in Bone Shaper).

He has mediocre damage to offset the amazing utility, you can make all his strings safe with hell sparks, or hell even butter gun since it pushes them so far back that it is impossible for most characters to punish him, and those that do punish him don't get much damage off it.

 

[Pan1cMode]

1. Quan Chi
Bat has 8 second cool down from when it's released and an obvious cue for when bat can be used again (Quan flashes, audio cue, just something)

2. Kung Lao
Regular hat spin is -8 on block

3. Cassie
Ex flip kick is -18 on block, still pushes her back though.

4. Tanya
Half the meter build of wreckers on block

5. Predator
8 extra whiff recovery frames on lasers
or
All lasers (including ex laser) are -10 on block

 

[Goat-City]

Publicly admitting you have a second account is never a smart idea.

Why's that? Edit* nevermind lol. I didn't even mean to make another 1, just strange circumstances led to it. I wish you had banned this account instead of the other one but it's cool.