Guide Wrath of the Jackalope - First Edition (Smoke Kombos and Frame Traps)

[SZSR]

I wouldn't do that 2, 2 d+4 smoke bomb. Seems immpracticle, i have much better alternative.

It's not impractical. It's to hit your opponents out of the air and follow up with a combo.

 

[PeeJaeys]

This is when they cross you up? Give me a specific situation, specific scenario where this would work to a t.

 

[G4S KT]

OP UPDATED WITH NEW VIDEO. MORE CONTENT, CLEARER DESCRIPTIONS!

 

[Konqrr]

New info. for the Smoke matchup from pakostevens at the VSM stream last night. You can interrupt crossups with standing 2's and follow up with multiple 2's and d+4, Smoke bomb to create a combo.

That is not new. Kitana can do it with her standing 2 as well to stop crossups. Many characters have moves like this.

STSFN

 

[TheJaquio]

So I've been trying to find the middle ground between opinions in this thread and opinions in the stickied frame data thread regarding D+1 after smokebomb. Posters in the frame data thread seem very confident that a blocked smokebomb is at a lot of disadvantage on block (like, -7 or more), making it so that D1 is not only easily stuffed by a lot of characters, but also so that Smoke can be straight up punished during recovery from smokebomb.

This is making poke pressure after smokebomb sound a lot less viable.

 

[Altsa]

^against certain characters it is very unsafe to throw a smokebomb up close. Main one being Kung Lao, who can spin to punish every smokebomb with 30%+ combo.

 

[G4S KT]

It is at disadvantage, but only slight. That's why you want to go for instant pokes; they're only beaten by other pokes or spin/dash/superman. The only other option is block unless they're afraid and hold block too long.

Apparently KL can full combo punish because his standing jab is fast as a poke? That doesnt matter because if you're trying to do anything with any character up in KLs face, you're doing it wrong.

This isn't a global strategy either. There is no such thing.

Sent from my Eris using Tapatalk

 

[TheJaquio]

I know that there's no such thing as a global strategy, I'm just trying to check my bases.

The video is very informative, and I think that D1 after smokebomb is a good strategy to be used to catch people off guard. But since the soonest that D1 can connect is at least 13 frames after your opponent has regained control, I have posters suggesting that it's a bad idea to end blockstrings with smokebomb period. Now, while I disagree (mainly because B2,3 is even worse off on block if you don't smokebomb or smoke towards/away), I see the problem inherent when trying to loop more than one smokebomb in a single series of blockstrings and pokes.

 

[G4S KT]

Well, that loop was just an example of the tools that Smoke has. Yea, Smokebomb is at slight disadvantage on block, but if you throw b+2,3 and they block it you need to follow that up in some way. Blocking is one way which will pretty much keep you safe and another is with a poke, which will beat most things. That's why I think it's a good strategy.

 

[TheJaquio]

I agree, I was just trying to find a consensus. Another benefit is that at least a lot of fast highs will go over Smoke during low pokes, thus avoiding full combos from a lot of characters unless your opponent's execution is frame-perfect. I also like to think of it in relation to Reptile's dash: it has 15(?) frames of disadvantage on block, and look how many people have trouble punishing it online.

 

[arydious]

Thanks KT Smith NYC for the great video, and keeping it up to date. I picked up smoke about 2 weeks ago and have been frequenting many of the smoke forums but this video by far has been my greatest aide. Not to say that everyone else contributing to the conversation hasnt helped me at all but KT Smith NYC made the forum. For everyone else thanks for all the input its really nice to be able to read things when i just cant get it from the video.

I will say that first combo in your video JP 3 d1 2 NJP was really hard for me to pull off, it took me forever to get it consistantly i just could not figure out the timing. To pull it off i end up sliding my finger from 1 to 2 and it seems to work almost all the time for me now. I have been playing with the combo a lot and been pulling of JP 3 d1 2 NJP dash 3 d1 2 dash dash 2 smokebomb JK airgrab Enhanced smoke bomb, if i can remember it does 35, plus the OTG smoke of 10 for 45 total.

 

[G4S KT]

Thanks KT Smith NYC for the great video, and keeping it up to date. I picked up smoke about 2 weeks ago and have been frequenting many of the smoke forums but this video by far has been my greatest aide. Not to say that everyone else contributing to the conversation hasnt helped me at all but KT Smith NYC made the forum. For everyone else thanks for all the input its really nice to be able to read things when i just cant get it from the video.

I will say that first combo in your video JP 3 d1 2 NJP was really hard for me to pull off, it took me forever to get it consistantly i just could not figure out the timing. To pull it off i end up sliding my finger from 1 to 2 and it seems to work almost all the time for me now. I have been playing with the combo a lot and been pulling of JP 3 d1 2 NJP dash 3 d1 2 dash dash 2 smokebomb JK airgrab Enhanced smoke bomb, if i can remember it does 35, plus the OTG smoke of 10 for 45 total.

My pleasure. The more people that use my strategies, the more that others will have to expose holes in them and then I can make them better. As soon as everyone figures out how to punish blocked smoke bomb, I'm gong to have to make big changes lol.

For example, if you're poke pressuring someone and they cross you up at just the right time and your poke whiffs, the only thing you can do is block or ex shake. I was eating it hard last friday because I kept trying to AA d1 a crossup over a whiffed poke. Don't do that; it doesn't work lol.

 

[arydious]

My pleasure. The more people that use my strategies, the more that others will have to expose holes in them and then I can make them better. As soon as everyone figures out how to punish blocked smoke bomb, I'm gong to have to make big changes lol.

Lets hope that day does not come to soon. : )

 

[G4S KT]

Ok, so people have definitely caught on to the blocked Smoke bomb and have been punishing me consistently with attacks 10 frames or less (particularly throws).

I'm going to have to change my position and say that ending a block string with Smoke bomb is a bad idea, UNLESS you're going for a fake out like after a blocked 214 or 112.

From now on I'm going to be hit confirming b2,3 before throwing smoke bomb and canceling the string into smoke drift if they block.

Also, I may have some interesting developments in defensive Smoke tech. They are still theories but I will test them when I get home from work tonight and will let everyone know.

 

[FrothyOmen]

I see you're on xbox now. If you want to work some stuff like that in a few days I'd like to help, just have to get my roomates xbox set up for XBL

 

[arydious]

Ok, so people have definitely caught on to the blocked Smoke bomb and have been punishing me consistently with attacks 10 frames or less (particularly throws).

I'm going to have to change my position and say that ending a block string with Smoke bomb is a bad idea, UNLESS you're going for a fake out like after a blocked 214 or 112.

From now on I'm going to be hit confirming b2,3 before throwing smoke bomb and canceling the string into smoke drift if they block.

Also, I may have some interesting developments in defensive Smoke tech. They are still theories but I will test them when I get home from work tonight and will let everyone know.

One of my buddies learned it with his subzero. I feel cheesy but my tactic to beat him lately had been a baiting game. I smoke away and randomly throw in a smoke bomb to keep him on his toes, If he jumps at me and is close ill go for the air grab, which is a 50/50 because he seems to have a crazy fast air punch. If he goes for the slide i just laugh and fully punish him for that. Otherwise he will try a random iceball where i punish him or just try to rush in. If he is able to rush in, which normally he is not, I do smoke towards to change his controls and mess with him some. I will also wait to see him in jump rang and go for the b23 smoke bomb, or change it up and smoke towards with 21 smoke bomb. The 21 smoke bomb can get me in a world of hurt if he reads it though.

 

[arydious]

I am curious about your defensive game, Also for the corner game. I played in test mode and did 3d12 njp 3d12 214 enhanced smoke bomb reset, 32 32 jk airthrow, I didnt get the exact damage but it was above 70%. My question is how likley is it to be pulled off in a match? I know putting most people in the corner sets them into panic mode and they dont block so the reset is more likley but is there either A a better corner combo to do to them or B a safer one? I dont like ending the corner combo by throwing them out of the corner but I can generally Smoke towards them and get them back into the corner with 214 smoke bomb to do some more damage and generally finish them off. The person i did this to was not a very good player though.

Just looking for some feed back

Thanks

 

[G4S KT]

I am curious about your defensive game, Also for the corner game. I played in test mode and did 3d12 njp 3d12 214 enhanced smoke bomb reset, 32 32 jk airthrow, I didnt get the exact damage but it was above 70%. My question is how likley is it to be pulled off in a match? I know putting most people in the corner sets them into panic mode and they dont block so the reset is more likley but is there either A a better corner combo to do to them or B a safer one? I dont like ending the corner combo by throwing them out of the corner but I can generally Smoke towards them and get them back into the corner with 214 smoke bomb to do some more damage and generally finish them off. The person i did this to was not a very good player though.

Just looking for some feed back

Thanks

Well, I didn't have huge revelations for Smoke's defense. I was just fairly certain that both d+3 and b+4 lower Smoke's hit boxes enough to avoid cross ups entirely (like mileena). I actually forgot to test this because I was too excited about the f+4 reset discovery last night lol.

As far as for going for the old reset in the corner, the more I think about it the more risky it is. I don't think I would go for it, just for a hefty corner combo that leaves them in the corner.

That being said, you can get 91% (and maybe even more) in the corner with the new F+4 reset LOL.

 

[G4S KT]

I see you're on xbox now. If you want to work some stuff like that in a few days I'd like to help, just have to get my roomates xbox set up for XBL

Well, I've always had a Live account, but I only play shooters on xbox. I would need to get both a copy of MK9 for xbox and a ps2 to xbox converter in order to play. And on top of that (even though I've heard MK9 is much better on XBL) I'm still pretty against playing online.

 

[SZSR]

I only saw this today, lol two weeks.

This is when they cross you up? Give me a specific situation, specific scenario where this would work to a t.

It's when they try a crossup or an air attack (like Kung Lao's teleport), it's not consistent as you have to anticipate the air attacks, but it's doable.

That is not new. Kitana can do it with her standing 2 as well to stop crossups. Many characters have moves like this.

STSFN

Cool that Kitana can do that, but it's the first I heard of it for Smoke, trying to dissect Smoke so he has more strats in his arsenal, if you don't want to use it, fine by me.
What does STSFN mean anyways?

 

[FrothyOmen]

Well, I've always had a Live account, but I only play shooters on xbox. I would need to get both a copy of MK9 for xbox and a ps2 to xbox converter in order to play. And on top of that (even though I've heard MK9 is much better on XBL) I'm still pretty against playing online.

I was referring to your new defensive tech that you said you wanted to work on. XBL is okay for just grinding out scenarios and learning fundamentals of what you should be doing, then you can refine it offline. But with no MK it's a moot point, so nevermind

 

[arydious]

Well, I didn't have huge revelations for Smoke's defense. I was just fairly certain that both d+3 and b+4 lower Smoke's hit boxes enough to avoid cross ups entirely (like mileena). I actually forgot to test this because I was too excited about the f+4 reset discovery last night lol.

As far as for going for the old reset in the corner, the more I think about it the more risky it is. I don't think I would go for it, just for a hefty corner combo that leaves them in the corner.

That being said, you can get 91% (and maybe even more) in the corner with the new F+4 reset LOL.

Looks like i need to be doing some research to figure out this f4 reset. Off to the library i go, thanks for the tips!

 

[G4S KT]

I'm currently constructing a totally overhauled WotJ video. Updated combos with useful alternates, ways to score the reset, "new" poke tricks, updated defensive strategy, corrections from the first vid, etc.

 

[kandehbar]

Swag. Hopefully I'm able to place top 8 at River city runbacks with smoke with that info

 

[Mt. Mutombo]

This should be stickied. Had to watch the vid on mute but still learned some things i didn't know.