Question - Sub-Zero Which Sub-Zero is Better

[M.D.]

MKX Subzero clearly. He is a very good character.

Slide is instant, whiff recovery like reptile dash.
Overhead is GODLIKE. For any downplayers I suggest you reconfigure your oppinion after trying this : http://www.teyah.net/milliablocker.html
18 frames is NOT reactable. Period. If you're a cyborg with skynet implants that can react, NOBODY cares.

And clone is still one of the best moves in mkx. Going away on block doesn't change shit.

So yes, Subzero will NOT get buffed. So stop trying to fish for it because it's pointless.

 

[-narshkajke-]

MKX Subzero clearly. He is a very good character.

Slide is instant, whiff recovery like reptile dash.
Overhead is GODLIKE. For any downplayers I suggest you reconfigure your oppinion after trying this : http://www.teyah.net/milliablocker.html
18 frames is NOT reactable. Period. If you're a cyborg with skynet implants that can react, NOBODY cares.

And clone is still one of the best moves in mkx. Going away on block doesn't change shit.

So yes, Subzero will NOT get buffed. So stop trying to fish for it because it's pointless.

it's not about going away on block habibi, it's about the inconsistency of it, and how it's pokeable. that is all.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

So you think that SZ is better in MKX because the Clone improved? Or the fact that he is better means the Clone must be as well? Sheesh for someone who has the nerve to suggest that other people don't understand the differences between the two latest MK's, these statements are pretty suspect.... He's better now, but it's not because the Clone improved

And this is just clone. Let's not ignore everything else Sub possesses.

How the hell am I ignoring everything else? My original statement was that everything else got better INCLUDING the mechanics and meta of the game, while Clone got worse, I don't know hat you are trying to turn that into but just restating this.

Also, to comment on safety. Am I mistaken in that 100% safe clone blockstrings exist, granted you have to sacrifice hitconfirms? Am I mistaken in that one of clone's properties allows Sub to utilize other options a bit more freely when it is out? Yes, you have to commit to something to ensure you get it out on block as safe as possible. Yes, you can get rid of the clone by making Sub block. But don't ignore what is strong about clone and what you can do with it.

Still MUCH less safe which is all I'm saying

to say clone and Sub himself are worse...? I mean, if you want to sit there and think a character who got 3-7'd and 2-8'd by a vast chunk of the top half of the characters in the game, and didn't really have an advantage like that over any other character...is better objectively than a character who still doesn't come close to struggling that hard after being nerfed...then be my guest.

When, just when did I say any of that? I said he's a much stronger character in MKX so I have no idea what this shit is

 

[RagingRicans]

I think the sub community has a bad Rep because of the " I got Hands guy" the idiots are always the most outspoken.

Edit: does anyone take him seriously? I'm generally curious? He's a complete whiner lol

 

[I GOT HANDS]

I think the sub community has a bad Rep because of the " I got Hands guy" the idiots are always the most outspoken.

Edit: does anyone take him seriously? I'm generally curious? He's a complete whiner lol

You have 11 posts, and already have a guy posting on your wall telling you to go away, and also seem to have completely missed that the ONE other guy in here saying the Sub community has a bad reputation also said right afterwards that in his opinion I'm the only exception to that. YOU on the other hand are clearly are not going to be having anything worthwhile to contribute for the duration of your stay at TYM, so I think I'm just gonna go ahead and put you on my ignore list from the jump. Next time you make an alt account for trolling maybe you'll make it to 20.

Have a nice day.

 

[Ryncage]

I think the sub community has a bad Rep because of the " I got Hands guy" the idiots are always the most outspoken.

Edit: does anyone take him seriously? I'm generally curious? He's a complete whiner lol

Id like to know who actually got mad enough to make an alt account just to take shots at a guy.
Thats some dedication right there.

Now we just need that alt pretending to be a sz player to come in an say "omg right? That got hands guy is totally undermining everyone lollollol ex dee. "

 

[Flow]

Clearly MK9 Sub! His ice puddle was godlike

 

[LaidbackOne]

Anyone saying MK9 Sub was better must be high of his ass.

 

[Phosferrax]

he has a lot of bad matchups most of which are the more frequently seen characters so uwotm8?

Shit doesn't mean he's not viable. Sorry you don't have all winning MU's.

Personally I will take nearly every MU decision that the Sub players have concluded on with a pinch of salt because people seem to not know what they're doing with him now that they have to think.

 

[ZeZe]

There's only only department for me when MK9 sub is better from MKX one and it's consistency. MKX sub lacks it. His klone set ups are wrecked by breathing hitboxes. But in other departments I feel he's better. MK9 Sub was pretty solid before patches struck though, probably better then MKX one.

 

[Iced_Taz]

In MK9 Sub Zero was a high defence, turtle character.

In MKX he has more offensive options like low starter, mix ups, armor etc.

So... MK9 Sub is weak but in MKX he is qutstanding.

 

[C88 Zombieekiler]

Shit doesn't mean he's not viable. Sorry you don't have all winning MU's.

Personally I will take nearly every MU decision that the Sub players have concluded on with a pinch of salt because people seem to not know what they're doing with him now that they have to think.

you sound like a fucking idiot

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Shit doesn't mean he's not viable. Sorry you don't have all winning MU's.

Personally I will take nearly every MU decision that the Sub players have concluded on with a pinch of salt because people seem to not know what they're doing with him now that they have to think.

The opposite seems just as true to me, a lot of TYM didn't seem to know what they were doing against a Clone that actually punished you for attacking it, so now that they don't have to think about it anymore everyone is just like "stop trying to make your Clone work we like it as is!".

Sub DOES have some ridiculously slanted match-ups, Kenshi and Raiden can punish clone on reaction from anywhere on screen, Raiden and DVorah can both poke straight through Clone on reaction close range as well. You can take this with as many grains of salt as you want, that all depends on how salty you wanna be.

 

[Phosferrax]

The opposite seems just as true to me, a lot of TYM didn't seem to know what they were doing against a Clone that actually punished you for attacking it, so now that they don't have to think about it anymore everyone is just like "stop trying to make your Clone work we like it as is!".

Sub DOES have some ridiculously slanted match-ups, Kenshi and Raiden can punish clone on reaction from anywhere on screen, Raiden and DVorah can both poke straight through Clone on reaction close range as well. You can take this with as many grains of salt as you want, that all depends on how salty you wanna be.

GM has some wonky MU's.

He has 2 other variations, something that the Sub community seems to forget.

 

[Phosferrax]

you sound like a fucking idiot

Lol you're implying that he's not viable in MKX, and I'm the idiot?

 

[ZeZe]

He has 2 other variations, something that the Sub community seems to forget.

On a contrary. We are salty as fk and crying our best to get the other 2 variations at least half as good as GM, so that ppl who enjoy uber turtle or rush-down can switch from GM to them.

 

[Big Pampering]

Imo it has always been ridiculous for people to ask for grandmaster buffs. The ex clone thing is a fix, but all other buff suggestions are stupid. The other 2 variations could use some work.

 

[GLoRToR]

MKX because not shit tier, has tools and I can actually respect this character. In MK9 unless the player was really good, I had nothing to fear.

 

[LaidbackOne]

Sub just needs some fixes if it comes to the clone and buffs to the other variations and he will be perfect. I still think b33 ice blast should be universal but its manageable as it is.

 

[Tom Brady]

MKX Subzero clearly. He is a very good character.

Slide is instant, whiff recovery like reptile dash.
Overhead is GODLIKE. For any downplayers I suggest you reconfigure your oppinion after trying this : http://www.teyah.net/milliablocker.html
18 frames is NOT reactable. Period. If you're a cyborg with skynet implants that can react, NOBODY cares.

And clone is still one of the best moves in mkx. Going away on block doesn't change shit.

So yes, Subzero will NOT get buffed. So stop trying to fish for it because it's pointless.

Not here to get involved with which SZ is better. 2 things..

1. The overhead is "godlike"? It is full combo punished with little difficulty by almost the entire cast. Not something that is abuseable outside of corner traps and even then is full combo punished by half the cast.

2. Clone is a good move, but going away on block is a big deal. Turned matches like D'Vorah into 3-7s. At the very least the EX clone should form correctly as a special cancel off of attacks and remain on block like the old clone did.



I'm not sure why people think anything will change. I got over this weeks ago and I suggest you all do the same. SZ is not getting one single change or fix in any variation. I suggest you look at how I changed him around drastically once I just accepted this is how he is and there is no change coming. I did a BIG tutorial last night which I'm sure was missed by 90% of SZ players.

 

[Ryncage]

Not here to get involved with which SZ is better. 2 things..

1. The overhead is "godlike"? It is full combo punished with little difficulty by almost the entire cast. Not something that is abuseable outside of corner traps and even then is full combo punished by half the cast.

2. Clone is a good move, but going away on block is a big deal. Turned matches like D'Vorah into 3-7s. At the very least the EX clone should form correctly as a special cancel off of attacks and remain on block like the old clone did.



I'm not sure why people think anything will change. I got over this weeks ago and I suggest you all do the same. SZ is not getting one single change or fix in any variation. I suggest you look at how I changed him around drastically once I just accepted this is how he is and there is no change coming. I did a BIG tutorial last night which I'm sure was missed by 90% of SZ players.

Personally work 3rd 12 hour shifts, so cant be there for it. and for whatever reason watching previous broadcasts doesnt work.
That a subscription only thing now? Or am i just having some random issue.
Some other channels pastbroadcast playback works fine.

And dont rag on people for not being over/ putting up with the slap in the face from nrs.
im sure if you werent getting hatemail and spite out the ass, youd still fight for Fixes. The rest of sz players dont have a spotlight on them, or a status to keep and maintain, so they voice their displeasure.

 

[OnizukaPM]

Probably MKX Sub-Zero, but i fucking love MK9 Sub-Zero D4/22/21 so i voted for MK9 ;]

 

[M2Dave]

To answer OP, MKX Sub.

Better normals. Much better comeback factor due to 50/50. Clone absorbing projectiles strengthens the clone immensely, not to mention he can throw it or detonate it as a form of safe chip damage from specials that he didn't have in MK9. EX freeze being an actual projectile that eats others instead of being a beam is MUCH better. Running allows Sub to trade and consistently combo punish in comparison to MK9 freeze trades. Great jump attacks. Slide is ridiculous and actually has situational uses as a mobility tool. Armored launcher. Throwing the opponent into clone is actually consistently viable.

It is pitiful that people will have to wait until the fourth page to read a constructive, rational, and impartial post that answers the topic creator's dumb question.

May Tremor be a rush down character if I am wrong, but I highly doubt 90% of all Sub Zero players in this thread even played Mortal Kombat 9 and Sub Zero. If they did, they would know that Sub Zero did not even have a mid poke against 1/3rd of the characters. Perhaps more. He struggled immensely against top tier zoning characters, to whom he universally lost 7:3 except Kenshi, who probably beat him 8:2. In Mortal Kombat X, every Sub Zero weakness has been addressed to an extent. His anti-zoning tools have been vastly improved, his mid pokes can actually hit opponents, and running tremendously helps with maximum full-screen ice ball / ice blast conversions.

As far as ice clone disappearing on block and on hit, do you fools really want this change reverted? You fools do realize that as of 07/07/2015 another special move exists with identical functionality, right? And I am absolutely certain no player in the community would want to deal with this move not disappearing on block and on hit.

 

[Ryncage]

It is pitiful that people will have to wait until the fourth page to read a constructive, rational, and impartial post that answers the topic creator's dumb question.

May Tremor be a rush down character if I am wrong, but I highly doubt 90% of all Sub Zero players in this thread even played Mortal Kombat 9 and Sub Zero. If they did, they would know that Sub Zero did not even have a mid poke against 1/3rd of the characters. Perhaps more. He struggled immensely against top tier zoning characters, to whom he universally lost 7:3 except Kenshi, who probably beat him 8:2. In Mortal Kombat X, every Sub Zero weakness has been addressed to an extent. His anti-zoning tools have been vastly improved, his mid pokes can actually hit opponents, and running tremendously helps with maximum full-screen ice ball / ice blast conversions.

As far as ice clone disappearing on block and on hit, do you fools really want this change reverted? You fools do realize that as of 07/07/2015 another special move exists with identical functionality, right? And I am absolutely certain no player in the community would want to deal with this move not disappearing on block and on hit.

Actually, if you look at the poll up top there, you can see only about 17% of the people who came to this thread havent played mk9 sub at high levels.

As for the ice clone staying on block, why do you keep taking "fools" seriously and validating their dribble with a response?
Ex clone could be up for debate, but personally i think even it vanishing on block is alright if it would simply function at all times when you do the input.

 

[RagingRicans]

You have 11 posts, and already have a guy posting on your wall telling you to go away, and also seem to have completely missed that the ONE other guy in here saying the Sub community has a bad reputation also said right afterwards that in his opinion I'm the only exception to that. YOU on the other hand are clearly are not going to be having anything worthwhile to contribute for the duration of your stay at TYM, so I think I'm just gonna go ahead and put you on my ignore list from the jump. Next time you make an alt account for trolling maybe you'll make it to 20.

Have a nice day.

jDM is a friend of mine. I just lurked the boards for a while. Your name just leaves a sour taste in my mouth when you post. Writes paragraphs to argue with one guy complete derailing topics, argues for the sake of arguing and is almost always negative. You just might be the worst poster ever lol.