General/Other - Sub-Zero Sub-Zero General Discussion

[ILuvFightGames]

Aye boys.

What if I told you some character has a 33/33/33 launcher on Alien guys.

What if I told you that Alien's only working armor in that situation gets low crushed or broken/frozen, besides his very low risk/reward db1.

What if I told you that only one of the mix ups out of the 33/33/33 is punishable, one doesn't even grant you a turn if blocked.

What if I told you that this situation took one reversal slide and one right decision, or one hit and one right decision, at any point in the match?

What if I told you that snag and B3 aren't guaranteed unless you klone right in front of him like you have no match up awareness at all?

What if I told you that without armor, Alien has just as much trouble anti airing said character, as said character has anti airing him?

What if I told you, that this character has one of the only jump normals in the game that can trade and beat Alien's jump 2? The players of the character don't use it, though.

What if I told you that said character can punish everything outside of a 7% overhead flip that leaves Alien at -7? One reversal throw at -7, corner city, one confirmed B12 because you suspected a throw duck, corner city.

Nah, it's 7-3. The people who don't have Alien unlocked say so.

Don't take this the wrong way, it's just my opinion but here it goes, I believe that if you dropped Alien and mained subzero, and Tom Brady dropped subzero and mained alien, if you guys played again against each other he'd body you. Not because he's a better player than you per say, but because he'd have the stronger character.

 

[Tweedy]

Don't take this the wrong way, it's just my opinion but here it goes, I believe that if you dropped Alien and mained subzero, and Tom Brady dropped subzero and mained alien, if you guys played again against each other he'd body you. Not because he's a better player than you per say, but because he'd have the stronger character.

1. Tom and I are both players that are really big on playing one character in order to maximize efficiency.

2. Me losing or beating Tom with Sub Zero has nothing to do with what the match is. I might have a better understanding of Sub than he does of Alien, or the other way around.

3. Do you have Alien unlocked?

4. Do you know that if you don't klone right in front of Alien he can't B3 you?

The challenge should be, you guys should try to play the match from the other end, and try to win, to understand that it's not a pic-nic for Alien. That's a lot more practical than having character specialists switch around for some freakshow match. I mean what the.

But you can't ask TYMers to do anything like that.

Edit: If you think i'm being hypocritical and asking too much, you can start by unlocking Alien and looking at his frame data.

 

[ILuvFightGames]

1. Tom and I are both players that are really big on playing one character in order to maximize efficiency.

2. Me losing or beating Tom with Sub Zero has nothing to do with what the match is. I might have a better understanding of Sub than he does of Alien, or the other way around.

3. Do you have Alien unlocked?

4. Do you know that if you don't klone right in front of Alien he can't B3 you?

The challenge should be, you guys should try to play the match from the other end, and try to win, to understand that it's not a pic-nic for Alien. That's a lot more practical than having character specialists switch around for some freakshow match. I mean what the.

But you can't ask TYMers to do anything like that.

Edit: If you think i'm being hypocritical and asking too much, you can start by unlocking Alien and looking at his frame data.

Did you happen to main alien because you thought his design was cool? What made you main alien? Serious question not being a dick. Also are you saying that you only play Alien? As in you don't have other characters so you can maximize alien all you can?

 

[Dankster Morgan]

@Tweedy, Sub doesn't get a guaranteed re-clone after a slide ender, he will need F12 or NJK(nobody uses this but still it's there). I don't actually think it's 7-3 because it isn't as bad even as Acidic Alien. But at the same time it doesn't feel as close as 6-4 like SD Johnny. I think it is kinda of like 6.5-3.5 but I hate decimals.

 

[Amplified$hotz]

Is it known that you can trip guard cyrax' anti air grab into a combo midscreen with d3 clone?

 

[AcMilan91]

Guys, i staeted to play gm sub yesterday, i main wrestler jac and hqt predator, few questions: what combo do you use if you catch them with freeze in air? How do you land clone in corrner combo, sometimes it won't come out, do i need to wait a little bit for opponent to fall down in low air, which mixups you use for mid screen and what is good combo for corner and how do you anti air jip, i found some thread but it's old, thanks subbies.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

For an air freeze combo I use: njp, ji2, RC, 123 xx slide. But if I am closeish to the corner I replace 123 xx slide with 112. If I am VERY close to the corner I do: njp, ji2, ji2, f12.

Depends which corner combo you are trying.

Mixups are between B33 and B2 midscreen, corner it becomes a 33/33/33 with throw into Klone.

Off of what starter?

 

[AcMilan91]

For an air freeze combo I use: njp, ji2, RC, 123 xx slide. But if I am closeish to the corner I replace 123 xx slide with 112. If I am VERY close to the corner I do: njp, ji2, ji2, f12.

Depends which corner combo you are trying.

Mixups are between B33 and B2 midscreen, corner it becomes a 33/33/33 with throw into Klone.

Off of what starter?

B2 b2 d b12 clone and with shatter b2 242 1 11 clone... What is 33?

 

[Dankster Morgan]

B2 b2 d b12 clone and with shatter b2 242 1 11 clone... What is 33?

1. In the B2 B2 combo, do the d1 and the b12 when your opponent is closer to the ground.

2. The shatter combo I like to use is: B2, 24 xx shatter, 1, 11 xx Klone, njp, F12. 44% and extremely consistent.

3. I mean that instead of having just a 50/50 like you do midscreen, it becomes a 3 way split instead of a two way split because throw into clone starts a combo, so now they have more things to guess on.

 

[RVB]

Aye boys.

What if I told you some character has a 33/33/33 launcher on Alien guys.

What if I told you that Alien's only working armor in that situation gets low crushed or broken/frozen, besides his very low risk/reward db1.

What if I told you that only one of the mix ups out of the 33/33/33 is punishable, one doesn't even grant you a turn if blocked.

What if I told you that this situation took one reversal slide and one right decision, or one hit and one right decision, at any point in the match?

What if I told you that snag and B3 aren't guaranteed unless you klone right in front of him like you have no match up awareness at all?

What if I told you that without armor, Alien has just as much trouble anti airing said character, as said character has anti airing him?

What if I told you, that this character has one of the only jump normals in the game that can trade and beat Alien's jump 2? The players of the character don't use it, though.

What if I told you that said character can punish everything outside of a 7% overhead flip that leaves Alien at -7? One reversal throw at -7, corner city, one confirmed B12 because you suspected a throw duck, corner city.

Nah, it's 7-3. The people who don't have Alien unlocked say so.

So maybe it isn't 7-3 and it's a 6-4 it's still a bad matchup and no amount of your downplaying will change that... Poor, poor Alien he's only 6-4 against SZ

 

[Dankster Morgan]

So maybe it isn't 7-3 and it's a 6-4 it's still a bad matchup and no amount of your downplaying will change that... Poor, poor Alien he's only 6-4 against SZ

Can we please not do this today lol. And acidic is 7-3 free imo

 

[AcMilan91]

1. In the B2 B2 combo, do the d1 and the b12 when your opponent is closer to the ground.

2. The shatter combo I like to use is: B2, 24 xx shatter, 1, 11 xx Klone, njp, F12. 44% and extremely consistent.

3. I mean that instead of having just a 50/50 like you do midscreen, it becomes a 3 way split instead of a two way split because throw into clone starts a combo, so now they have more things to guess on.

Thanks bro, ill give it try today, is he doing well against sonya, cuz predator is so bad against sonya

 

[Revenant Zero]

Can we please not do this today lol. And acidic is 7-3 free imo

It really depends I guess: (For GRANDMASTER)
5-5 (Both Alien and Sub are beginner/intermediate level players; changes depending if players are spamming regular moves like Alien Flip, Low Tail, Ice Clone, Slide)
6-4 (Sub-Zero has a better control of the neutral and able to corner carry Alien, Alien has wrong guesses in corner game, Sub-Zero capitalizing on punishes and 100% on point with corner combos; Same with Alien and their mix-ups and game plan. Alien Player is Beginner/Sub-Zero is advanced or vice versa )
7-3 (Alien knows what they hell they are doing, Sub-Zero is literally at a disadvantage. Both players at an advanced level of playing, Alien using their tools and denying Sub their tools or game plan)

Seeing high level Aliens is pretty difficult for Sub but it's not impossible. Konjurer and Acidic can keep away and zone. I feel like 7-3 for Sub would only be if Alien is 100% Advanced in playstyle. Regardless of the Sub players play style, they will always take Ls. (Defensive Sub = Lose, Offensive/Defensive Sub = Lose, Offensive Sub = He shouldn't be doing that anyway)

 

[Dankster Morgan]

It really depends I guess: (For GRANDMASTER)
5-5 (Both Alien and Sub are beginner/intermediate level players; changes depending if players are spamming regular moves like Alien Flip, Low Tail, Ice Clone, Slide)
6-4 (Sub-Zero has a better control of the neutral and able to corner carry Alien, Alien has wrong guesses in corner game, Sub-Zero capitalizing on punishes and 100% on point with corner combos; Same with Alien and their mix-ups and game plan. Alien Player is Beginner/Sub-Zero is advanced or vice versa )
7-3 (Alien knows what they hell they are doing, Sub-Zero is literally at a disadvantage. Both players at an advanced level of playing, Alien using their tools and denying Sub their tools or game plan)

Seeing high level Aliens is pretty difficult for Sub but it's not impossible. Konjurer and Acidic can keep away and zone. I feel like 7-3 for Sub would only be if Alien is 100% Advanced in playstyle. Regardless of the Sub players play style, they will always take Ls. (Defensive Sub = Lose, Offensive/Defensive Sub = Lose, Offensive Sub = He shouldn't be doing that anyway)

Matchups are only given numbers when both players are at the highest possible level of play, so yeah it's 7-3 in acidics favor. He dominates Sub in open space, dominates him in footsies, outzones him, forces sub to move in, etc..

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Thanks bro, ill give it try today, is he doing well against sonya, cuz predator is so bad against sonya

Sub is really bad against demo Sonya too I'm sorry to tell you.

 

[Tweedy]

So maybe it isn't 7-3 and it's a 6-4 it's still a bad matchup and no amount of your downplaying will change that... Poor, poor Alien he's only 6-4 against SZ

Point out something that's "downplaying", please. You guys are the downplayers.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Point out something that's "downplaying", please. You guys are the downplayers.

Iv never downplayed sub

 

[Tweedy]

Iv never downplayed sub

Aye bruh when i'm spitting hot fire on TYM, I don't always mean everyone when I say "you guys".

I just mean the Sub Zero players that don't have Alien unlocked and mindlessly say that it's a 3-7. Even Brady doesn't really believe that it's worse than 4-6.

Edit: Tarkatan specifically

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Aye bruh when i'm spitting hot fire on TYM, I don't always mean everyone when I say "you guys".

I just mean the Sub Zero players that don't have Alien unlocked and mindlessly say that it's a 3-7. Even Brady doesn't really believe that it's worse than 4-6.

Edit: Tarkatan specifically

I play both characters and I think 4-6 is reasonable for Tarkatan. But when I say "Alien is really hard" I mean Acidic because he reams sub the worst, and would be an Alien player's best pick vs Sub. It's kind of like how you don't hear Jax players going "woo hoo Cryomancer Sub is so easy!" because Grandmaster is still Darth Vader to Jax players, and Grandmaster that should really be taken into account in Sub vs Jax.

 

[Tweedy]

Idk bro

Cryomancer has the mix.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Yeah he can mix lol

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Dat 50 frame hammer mixup doe

 

[RVB]

Point out something that's "downplaying", please. You guys are the downplayers.

What if I told you that this situation took one reversal slide and one right decision, or one hit and one right decision, at any point in the match?

That phrase is so generic I could switch up a few words and say the exact same thing about ALMOST EVERY character in the game. YOU REEK OF DOWNPLAY...

 

[youthinkyoubadyouaintbad]

Idk bro

Cryomancer has the mix.

Ur right not everyone can handle b3xxhammer f3xxhammer d4xxhammer

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Ur right not everyone can handle b3xxhammer f3xxhammer d4xxhammer

Or 11 hammer and 114 mixup