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Sub-Zero General Discussion Thread

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darthbrooks

darthbrooks

Noob
how do you get advantage as sub up-close? is it just a downjab-fest? playing lao and jax felt like playing infinite stamina run-cancel characters in mkx
 
RM Ree

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Poking and counter poking 101, my dude. If your poke hits, it’s your turn. If it doesn’t, it’s their turn. I think SZ d1 is +9 on hit, which means if it lands you can go into b32 uncontested as a frame trap. They either block or they get hit into your BnB.

Once they start respecting your advantage, you can mix them up with low/ OH/ throw, or go for f4 for +4 into d1 for /another/ frame trap.

Keep in mind, a lot of players will never respect your plus frames. You have to keep forcing it down their throat until they learn or you win. No point in advancing the mind game if your opponent isn’t playing it.
 
darthbrooks

darthbrooks

Noob
must be my timing being way off. I'm no stranger to poking after hundreds of hours of Tekken, I just had a hard time getting even jabs out. didn't even get to the mixup part, lol.
 
RM Ree

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
darthbrooks said:
must be my timing being way off. I'm no stranger to poking after hundreds of hours of Tekken, I just had a hard time getting even jabs out. didn't even get to the mixup part, lol.
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A Tekken player? That’s the good life dude, what sins did you commit that brought to an NRS game.

If you wanna practice it, set the training dummy to record and mash the shit out of d1. Timing is always super weird in MK. People get away with murder.
 
RagingRicans

RagingRicans

NetBattles
Thin ice is garbage actually. Slide is the only saving grace and it doesn’t even have quite the same utility as it used to. Redundant bad projectiles are the icing on the cake.

Save yourself some time and play Dead of winter. Enjoy ex iceball, better conversions and better damage.
 
Danger_Ranger

Danger_Ranger

Noob
Have you guys played around with rising ice yet? He feels like such a complete character with it. I'd kill for a tournament variation with rising ice and ex ice ball.
 
Trini_Bwoi

Trini_Bwoi

Kombatant
Tournament Sub-Zero feels like maybe 40% of a character. You lab him for 20 minutes and then you're like, oh, that's it?
 
LionHeart V1

LionHeart V1

You will feel deaths cold embrace
Tournament mode subzero is extremely disappointing. I'm actually quite disgusted. Completely uninspiring choices.
 
TheJaquio

TheJaquio

Kombatant
Honestly, I think his deep freeze + shoulder variation is better than his 2nd variation. Air axe is great, but the other two seem bad. Both are easily reacted to. Icicles seem gimmicky, and are punishable at anything except max distance. And I also feel like time spent throwing out frigid storm could be spent tossing iceball for a full combo instead, which is a faster projectile anyways.

Meanwhile, in his other variation, shoulder not only gives you better combo dmg on average, but has no side switch on amplify, so you can keep pushing your opponent to the corner where your 124 KB combos will be more effective. Yes, you lose the slide KB after 3 amped slides, but the average damage you gain across 3 combos with amped shoulder make up for it. Hell, if you really need to, you can even squeeze out another 2-3% in a combo with amped iceball if you have 2 bars to burn.

Speaking of amped iceball, it makes up for not being able to low profile high projectiles with slide, because you can just blow through them with iceball instead for a full combo. And finally, it even lets you full combo off of f2 so you can get full damage 50/50s. I just feel like this variation not only grants higher combo damage, but more opportunities for big damage as well.
 
Lokheit

Lokheit

Warrior
TheJaquio said:
Honestly, I think his deep freeze + shoulder variation is better than his 2nd variation. Air axe is great, but the other two seem bad. Both are easily reacted to. Icicles seem gimmicky, and are punishable at anything except max distance. And I also feel like time spent throwing out frigid storm could be spent tossing iceball for a full combo instead, which is a faster projectile anyways.

Meanwhile, in his other variation, shoulder not only gives you better combo dmg on average, but has no side switch on amplify, so you can keep pushing your opponent to the corner where your 124 KB combos will be more effective. Yes, you lose the slide KB after 3 amped slides, but the average damage you gain across 3 combos with amped shoulder make up for it. Hell, if you really need to, you can even squeeze out another 2-3% in a combo with amped iceball if you have 2 bars to burn.

Speaking of amped iceball, it makes up for not being able to low profile high projectiles with slide, because you can just blow through them with iceball instead for a full combo. And finally, it even lets you full combo off of f2 so you can get full damage 50/50s. I just feel like this variation not only grants higher combo damage, but more opportunities for big damage as well.
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Cold Shoulder is Hot (ironically) Garbage, there is no possible defense. Reach is crap, doesn't low profile highs, equally punishable on block, isn't a low, is much slower and only slightly increases the damage. Even if it didn't cost 1 slot I wouldn't replace Slide with it.
 
Lokheit

Lokheit

Warrior
Silly question: are there tech rolls in this game? I can't find the AI option in practice mode and it looks like now there is only the wake up metered rolls, is that true? Every move is a HKD now?

I ask because I was testing setups for ground freeze and the artict trap and I remember in MKX I always had to make sure to end combos in HKD to make the right setups.
 
TheJaquio

TheJaquio

Kombatant
Lokheit said:
Cold Shoulder is Hot (ironically) Garbage, there is no possible defense. Reach is crap, doesn't low profile highs, equally punishable on block, isn't a low, is much slower and only slightly increases the damage. Even if it didn't cost 1 slot I wouldn't replace Slide with it.
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Its main strength imo is as a combo ender that doesn't switch sides. However, I wouldn't pick it in a custom variation either, because I'd rather have rising ice or creeping ice (or both). My point is though, as far as the tourney variations are concerned, you don't really need to be throwing out random slides to close distance under projectiles because you have amped iceball instead. Deep Freeze is what largely makes that variation better than the alternative imo.
 
Danger_Ranger

Danger_Ranger

Noob
TheJaquio said:
Its main strength imo is as a combo ender that doesn't switch sides. However, I wouldn't pick it in a custom variation either, because I'd rather have rising ice or creeping ice (or both). My point is though, as far as the tourney variations are concerned, you don't really need to be throwing out random slides to close distance under projectiles because you have amped iceball instead. Deep Freeze is what largely makes that variation better than the alternative imo.
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[the side switch isn't really a problem https://streamable.com/iefzm

it sucks because i think he needs both ex iceball, and slide. As of right now, im using both on depending match up. against zone heavy characters im using DOW. The extra moves he gets in TI are useless, and the ex ice ball is too valuable. Everything else i use TI, because i think slide is very good.
 
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TheJaquio

TheJaquio

Kombatant
Danger_Ranger said:
[the side switch isn't really a problem https://streamable.com/iefzm

it sucks because i think he needs both ex iceball, and slide. As of right now, im using both on depending match up. against zone heavy characters im using DOW. The extra moves he gets in TI are useless, and the ex ice ball is too valuable. Everything else i use TI, because i think slide is very good.
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Same side, but with only about a sweep's distance of corner carry. The same combo with shoulder corner carries for over half the stage.

I'm not saying it's one of his better moves, but it isn't entirely without its benefits.
 
LiangHuBBB

LiangHuBBB

Warrior
subzero feels weak or kinda lacking of options, missing the ice clone he had back then.
still maining him among with cassie and looking foward what stuff Tom comes up with
 
RM Ree

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
darthbrooks said:
has anyone checked if this one works across the cast? could do it consistently enough on kano in practice, but I have a hunch it could be sensitive to weird hitboxes. I get a tingling feeling thinking about gender specific GM corner combos. aah good times
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Yeah, this is more or less the bnb. You can add a s2 after the jik for more damage, or ji2 after freeze to make it easier.
 
Braindead

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
The opponent can break away between slide and amplified slide -___-

Watch out for that when you think you're closing out the match with inescapable combos. Some people I play against already started catching onto that.
 
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