Something that needs to be said

[xInfra Deadx]

I love how the EVO champ cant hit confirm b33~spin. I don't know whether to laugh or cry?

Try doing that for yourself and see how that goes...it's far from easy for me.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

This post is terrible and you're a terrible player/person.

YOU SOUND FOOLISH

You're fucking bad and your arguments are awful.

This is a massacre. I can't look anymore. HD Smoke - smoke away from this thread while you still can

 

[Hellion_96]

Make Laos overhead the same speed as Kenshis neutral on block but make it knock down

 

[xInfra Deadx]

B2 is overrated. It's easy to see coming man, 15 frames is slow and you never have a reason to block low on Smoke. Think about this, what does Smoke attack with???? Random SB and b2...2 is a joke unless for anti air and his other strings are so slow. So you have a character that can only throw a projectile that doesn't chip and a overhead that you can bait and jump over. Cdjr won with grabs when he played Smoke. Cdjr is just that good and knew grabbing was the only other mix up. Not only is smokes offense limited as hell....his defense doesn't even exist. Cage beats smoke free, especially in tournaments. It's hard to outplay when your character can only do so much. Smoke resembles a punching bag.

 

[Son ov Timett]

Try doing that for yourself and see how that goes...it's far from easy for me.

Uhh did it the other day, and my Kung is a month old. My brother did it 6 times in just about as many matches. The problem with b33~spin isn't it being hard to hit confirm, it's just that it is slow as hell and has crappy range. I see Pboard hit confirm it all the time. This isn't like Kitana's b3~ex fan, which is a buffered move that you commit to once ye input b3.

Just because something is "hard", doesn't mean it's not doable. I'm not slighting PL, dude is a phenomenal player, but in this circumstance he is incorrect sir.

Questioning the viability of a move is different than saying that it can or can not be done.

 

[GGA HAN]

This post is terrible and you're a terrible player/person.

15 frames is fast for an overhead. No one can block it on reaction. Try using d+4.

Smoke has some of the best defense in the game. You guys have been told ways to get out of Cage's pressure and refuse to do it.

The first thing that came to mind was this:

 

[Killphil]

Hang on hang on! I got one more for you! HD Smoke

Spoiler

You ever use this when you shower? Perhaps you could use it to get the flakes out of your game too. Its called conditioning. WAAAAA guys Ermac's tkp sucks balls! Why would you not just block it? You have no reason to not block it. The move only takes up half the screen and is terribad on block! /sarcasm

Long story short: you want your opponent to duck? CONDITION them to. Throwing out b2 all willy nilly isn't going to cut it. Sorry.

 

[Zoidberg747]

I swear If I ever saw a guy who fucking complained about Cyrax not being broken enough I would hit him with a crowbar.

Maxter lolololol

Also everything else you said is true. Grow a pair people.

 

[BookBurning]

"Hey guys this needs to be said. Tired of hearing KL is good, here's why."

Yawn and pend over 200 responses. I don't know why you'd care if people think your character is good or not; you've won EVO twice.

Plus you've proven to be a tier whore in every competitive fighting game you have ever played at a high level. Kung Lao is good, null thread.

 

[GGA HAN]

Also if anyone tells you they can react to a 15 frame move like Smokes' b2, they are lying or on speed. Ever try to block correctly in a scorpion 50/50 vortex? Those are 18 and 19 frame moves, and this is 4 frames faster than that. Top tekken players of world have debated this and they seem to agree moves become "see-able" after 20-22 frames. The chemical process that involves your eyes seeing the stimuli (the low/overhead), sending that signal to the brain, then the brain sending impulses to your hands to block said overhead/low takes a certain amount of time. Try telling a top tekken player you can block a hellsweep on reaction (its a 16 frame low) and you'll be laughed out of the room.

 

[Big Pampering]

Also if anyone tells you they can react to a 15 frame move like Smokes' b2, they are lying or on speed. Ever try to block correctly in a scorption 50/50 vortex? Those are 18 and 19 frame moves, and this is 4 frames faster than that. Top tekken players of world have debated this and they seem to agree moves become "see-able" after 20-22 frames. The chemical process that involves your eyes seeing the stimuli (the low/overhead), sending that signal to the brain, then the brain sending impulses to your hands to block said overhead/low takes a certain amount of time time. Try telling a top tekken player you can block a hellsweep on reaction (its a 16 frame low) and you'll be laughed out of the room.

this, anything below 20 frames cannot be reacted to. things like kung lao's f2 and jax's f3 can be fuzzy guarded on reaction.

also b33 is far from slow its 11 frames its only 1 frame slower than liu kangs b3, its the hitbox that sucks.

 

[Axel_Redd]

if only f3~spin actually comboed O:

 

[Perfect Legend]

b33 to spin is not hit confirmable. Like I said $100 says no one can hit confirm the last hit of b33 (not b333) b33 into spin. This means seeing the last hit hit and then cancel to spin on reaction.

Also 16bit you do have a char with good damage, runaway and a godlike d1 her name is Kitana.

 

[Axel_Redd]

b33 to spin is not hit confirmable. Like I said $100 says no one can hit confirm the last hit of b33 (not b333) b33 into spin. This means seeing the last hit hit and then cancel to spin on reaction.

Also 16bit you do have a char with good damage, runaway and a godlike d1 her name is Kitana.

what about if u see the first hit of b33 hit?

 

[Perfect Legend]

what about if u see the first hit of b33 hit?

That is still not exactly hit confirming the last hit into spin. The window to be like ALRIgHt BRO THE FIRST HIT OF b33 HIT LET ME DO THE 2ND HIT AND SPIN CANCEL IT is very small. I am talking about hit confirming the LAST HIT on reaction to hitting them with the LAST HIT on reaction not fucking hitting with the first hit then doing the 2nd hit. Thats not a hit confirm. Look up what an actual hit confirm is

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

B33 is hit confirmable, but its crap so theres barely any use for it.
What other string do you hit confirm in this game on the last hit into an unsafe special?

 

[G4S Claude VonStroke]

Let's put a stop to all of the madness. Cage needs faster recover on his projectiles to compete with heavy zoning characters. Why the hell does sonya have such a good projectile and cage has shit on top of that she has a SAFE combo launcher that leads into a reset while cage gets full combo punished for his. He needs it.

Also to compete with OP characters like Kabal cage needs more than that, f4 being plus on block would be a start. What say you CURBOLICOUS

 

[Juggs]

That is still not exactly hit confirming the last hit into spin. The window to be like ALRIgHt BRO THE FIRST HIT OF b33 HIT LET ME DO THE 2ND HIT AND SPIN CANCEL IT is very small. I am talking about hit confirming the LAST HIT on reaction to hitting them with the LAST HIT on reaction not fucking hitting with the first hit then doing the 2nd hit. Thats not a hit confirm. Look up what an actual hit confirm is

Axel_Redd

If the first hit of the combo b333 hits, b3, then the rest will hit/combo, right? So if the b3 hits, the next 3 will hit, then you spin. So you're hit confirming off of the first b3, not the 2nd.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

That is still not exactly hit confirming the last hit into spin. The window to be like ALRIgHt BRO THE FIRST HIT OF b33 HIT LET ME DO THE 2ND HIT AND SPIN CANCEL IT is very small. I am talking about hit confirming the LAST HIT on reaction to hitting them with the LAST HIT on reaction not fucking hitting with the first hit then doing the 2nd hit. Thats not a hit confirm. Look up what an actual hit confirm is

you never hitconfirm off of the 2nd hit of a string...

even in games like 3s with crazy hard hitconfirms it was always like cr.lk cr.lk super or shit like that

 

[RiBBz22]

You just said b+2 is easy to see coming. b+2 is a 15 frame overhead that leads to round critical damage. If your b+2 is easy to see coming it's a problem with you.

I like how Smoke's difficult MU are like Reptile now. Automatic loses. If you have Johnny in your pool you're done and there's no hope. OR you could do what the consistent top 8 characters do and actually outplay someone.

So you are the one who determines Smoke's bad MUs now

 

[Perfect Legend]

you never hitconfirm off of the 2nd hit of a string...

even in games like 3s with crazy hard hitconfirms it was always like cr.lk cr.lk super or shit like that

chun li cr mk to super, ken crouching mp and crouching mk to super.

 

[Juggs]

you never hitconfirm off of the 2nd hit of a string...

even in games like 3s with crazy hard hitconfirms it was always like cr.lk cr.lk super or shit like that

Yeah, once the first hit of a string hits, that's the hit confirm. I think PL is saying that you can't hit confirm off of the 2nd hit alone, like, if you have amnesia and forgot that the first hit connected, there's not enough time to hit confirm the 2nd hit into a spin. Kinda doesn't make sense though, since you only need the first hit of the string to connect.

 

[coolwhip]

That is still not exactly hit confirming the last hit into spin. The window to be like ALRIgHt BRO THE FIRST HIT OF b33 HIT LET ME DO THE 2ND HIT AND SPIN CANCEL IT is very small. I am talking about hit confirming the LAST HIT on reaction to hitting them with the LAST HIT on reaction not fucking hitting with the first hit then doing the 2nd hit. Thats not a hit confirm. Look up what an actual hit confirm is

By that definition 21 isn't hit-confirmable either (for the record I don't think B33 is hit confirmable). Nobody is godlike enough to react to the second hit in 21 landing and cancel into spin. What you're really reacting to is the first hit landing. Meaning that if your opponent blocks the first hit (standing 2), but for some reason lets go of block on the second hit (1), there is no way in hell you'll react in time to cancel into spin. What makes 21 hit confirmable is seeing the standing 2 land, which is the first hit.

 

[coolwhip]

So you are the one who determines Smoke's bad MUs now

What do you mean "now"?

 

[Axel_Redd]

Axel_Redd

If the first hit of the combo b333 hits, b3, then the rest will hit/combo, right? So if the b3 hits, the next 3 will hit, then you spin. So you're hit confirming off of the first b3, not the 2nd.

huh....well thats what i was pretty much saying this whole time then....i just misunderstood what part of hitconfirming that he meant lol. So pretty much anytime i've said u can hitconfirm b33, i guess i meant just b3, my bad.