What's new

Should pokes be more negative on block?

Pokes more negative on block?


  • Total voters
    157

Gaxkang

Banned
Yeah, but if you know they’re probably going to mash d1, you just take a half step back and blow them up for it.

You’re only getting hit by it because you’re trying to autopilot your string afterward, instead of catering your reaction to a read on what your opponent is going to do next.

Or you could just throw them out of their d1. That beats it no matter what.

Shimmies, neutral jumps, cross overs, throws, d4s etc. are all important in this game. If you’re just autopiloting a string every time you block one, you’re not really playing the game in an optimal way.
Well then they will probably do a D3 instead or something heh. Johnny Cages'...they love their D3 or maybe D4 as much as their D1. Really as much as I see people say Cage needs help in the game, I think he does fine really outside of having obscure krushing blows vs. characters who get krushing blows by just using their moves normally.
People might say he needs overhead stuff...but frankly a lot of characters probably want that. I still wonder why each character can't have a stand alone overhead.

Some of what my assessments may be colored by the online, since the online gameplay cannot guarantee Scorpion's teleport for example will be as unsafe as it should be and if that's happening one is left wondering what else is happening in the fight that isn't so obvious. Such as the poking game, etc.
And that can be going on even in so-called low ping fights.
That means the online fighting can be written off usually as a novelty mode.

But what you mention as being important things in the game you aren't wrong really as I have seen. Tho I would say don't neutral jump too much...either hitboxes are huge or hurtboxes are, but a neutral jump often times gets hit by all sorts of stuff. Someone coming over from Street Fighter won't find a neutral jump as useful. Especially say, neutral jumping on a wakeup.
But yeah I quickly learned that one's fastest string has minimal worth, and coming with a punishment mindset leads to disappointment...punishment on block anyways.

Somebody new playing MK11 I'd advise them to mostly forget about their fastest string outside of punishing really unsafe stuff and to mostly forget about punishing all that much. Punishment is D1 usually, and it doesn't punish some stuff anyways.
I'd also advise them to not be defensive, at least in the way they might think, since the game is geared for offense really. I consider the dial mixup's to essentially be on the rails mixup's especially online since they can be tough to block...so a valuable thing is whether you have a good one of those.

The projectiles as designed alone still shows NRS needs to evolve and grow, and their idea of fighting systems has always needed that...since let's face it the really old days of MK its selling point was not its gameplay.
I shake my head when a a Scorpion can do his spear full screen and you jump and you still get hit often times. It's like they try to force the player to play their lame crabwalk game.

I also feel the game needs a major balance patch to at least bring characters considered lower on the totem pole up to par with what other characters get away with. Either that or make the higher characters as lame.
 
Last edited:

kcd117

Noob
Been watching CB all weekend and didn't see one Geras, Scorpion, Sonya, Erron, Jacqui, Sub, Etc, poke mash get whiff punished... not one.
 

Gaxkang

Banned
In regards to some saying a mash poke meta exists online: if you are playing in lag then they probably can mash D1 but you don't change frame data based off online lag ever.
Revisiting the subject...as I play more and more, and I've played like 500 or 600 online fights, I think many things may come down to the online quality.

The way it should work is you block a poke and you get to do something, but online what tends to happen as I see it is you block the poke and when you try to do something you get hit by another poke, and the opponent goes from there.

So like someone will do a string, and mash their poke...you block the string, you block the poke and then...you get poked again.

Different options when you block a poke...it can feel like there's no time.

When I play people it's only online, so I don't know how it goes offline vs. folks.
 


Damn, Dragon must be a scrub, right? :DOGE

Why don't you practice mode masters teach him how to fight the poke fest?
Worst thing? this is totally legit. Posted weeks ago, if you have a character with a 9 frame mid, still you need perfect frame timing to beat geras/erron/scorping mash poking. There is no chance kitana 13 frame mid beat that geras 6+4 on block (10 frame) pokes. She needs to poke back like a scrub, but only if she is super close, otherwise d3 will whiff (and d1 isn't fast enough wtf).

Btw, I loved the part where he was chipped to death with d1s lol.

Every single poke should be at least, -6 on block. It's a damn check, not a pressure tool. You get blocked? Lose your turn.
 
Last edited:
hell no. people shouldnt be able to do a free string after a blocked poke. pressure would be unbearable. but pokes shouldnt be -2 on block either, online its like +. 3-4 negative frames are fine.
 

NaCl man

Welcome to Akihabara
Im not sure what the issue is here. There is multiple answers to somebody mashing d1 on you. Its not beoken so why should it go. So much whining on this site about things that have answers.
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
I just want them to be more plus on hit... that way there'd be more emphasis on pressing buttons post d1 instead of mashing grab or another d1.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Online d1d1 throw and d1 throw is a legitimate mixup.
I've blocked and tried to d1,b3 more pokes than I've thrown air glaives and more than half the time online d1 mashing wins.
Making them more negative on block would help the more popular venues of playing this game while it wouldn't particularly hurt the offline meta too much either.
 

Wigy

There it is...
Y'all want to dial the poke mash meta up to 100 go play frost. 16 frame is her fastest mid. Her fastest usable poke 9 frames. S1 S2 S3 all whiff on crouch block so.

Second geras gets in, guess I'll die llol
 

NothingPersonal

Are you not entertained!?
In MK11, either you straight up to into a mid string, or if you don't have one, you're playing orangutan D1 mash until one of you decides to D4, throw or use movement to make it whiff.
And you call this what? :)
I love poking wars. It's one thing I missed in MKX from MK9. In X I straifht up armored and didn't two shits. What needs to get better is online, it's killing the poking game and punish game in general.
 

TotteryManx

cr. HP Master
They should absolutely be more negative. Not to the point they are combo punishable on block or anything absurd, but if I block your poke I should be able to press another button besides d1. With some characters you can d1 on hit, think its your turn and be mashed out of w/e you try to do. Once you realize you can't do shit people start doing d1 into throw like a mixup lol.
 
The pokes are definitely a nuisance but in most cases after a round you notice a pattern. So many people go for d1 after a blocked combo and most of the time I eat it trying to back up in time or just block and d1 myself. Don't like it.....it's crap.