Sheeva Discussion Thread

[Cobainevermind87]

Fullscreen is quite hyperbolic. At complete ends of the tournament screen, there's 22 squares between you. Shield twirl sends them 6 squares away, grab 10.

Though, I'll admit, shield twirl distance is a lot more user-friendly, without needing to spend frames on dashing closer. Dmg difference goes from 20 with the short grounded combos, to 12 with the usual launcher... I'll give you this one.

You don't have to give me anything, this isn't a competition. I'm just letting you, and any other people who happen to read this thread, know that it leaves you in a much better position. You're close enough to take a step forward to bait a wake-up, backdash as their u3/2 whiffs, and punish with b3/bf3/f1, etc. And sometimes you can get away with immediately dashing forward into cross-up jump punch into full combo, as you just jump right over their wake-up and punish it for free.

 

[kevkopdx]

Somebody explain to me what v2 sheeva is good for? I’ve played this variation exclusively and it just feels like trash tier:

Shield toss, tho a mid, is too slow to compete with most projectiles and forget about the crushing blow- holding that move takes way too long to destroy projectiles.... like under what circumstances is that ever going to work?

Her teleport is basically useless in this variation except for hard reads.

Spinning dragon is a great move but it’s so hard to open people up with her.

I mean how do you compete with this variation? Am I missing something? If her damage made up for all of this, that would be something but she has garbage damage too. The only thing going for her are a few good kbs. Like I literally have to count on landing these in order to beat people. Feels like every match is dependent on landing b4s and b3s.
any tips or should I just be playing a diff variation?

 

[OPS_soldier]

V2 biggest weakness is the uselessness of Shield projectile. You can't zone bc the shield throw on hit does NOTHING.
I think people good at rushdown and pressure and staggers could succeed using shield twirl restand on hit and continuing Sheeva pressure / throw loop mind games.

Are people really FB'ing ya'lls meterburn that often? I figure it could be disguised somewhat

I found this out the hard way. Fujin players are figuring out they can zone her and then once they get midscreen expect the shield charge.

Somebody explain to me what v2 sheeva is good for? I’ve played this variation exclusively and it just feels like trash tier:

Shield toss, tho a mid, is too slow to compete with most projectiles and forget about the crushing blow- holding that move takes way too long to destroy projectiles.... like under what circumstances is that ever going to work?

Her teleport is basically useless in this variation except for hard reads.

Spinning dragon is a great move but it’s so hard to open people up with her.

I mean how do you compete with this variation? Am I missing something? If her damage made up for all of this, that would be something but she has garbage damage too. The only thing going for her are a few good kbs. Like I literally have to count on landing these in order to beat people. Feels like every match is dependent on landing b4s and b3s.
any tips or should I just be playing a diff variation?

The spinning shield is a reset. And you get a 12 frame special reversal that can punish a lot of things that are generally safe from a distance.

 

[Agilaz]

Somebody explain to me what v2 sheeva is good for? I’ve played this variation exclusively and it just feels like trash tier:

Shield toss, tho a mid, is too slow to compete with most projectiles and forget about the crushing blow- holding that move takes way too long to destroy projectiles.... like under what circumstances is that ever going to work?

Her teleport is basically useless in this variation except for hard reads.

Spinning dragon is a great move but it’s so hard to open people up with her.

I mean how do you compete with this variation? Am I missing something? If her damage made up for all of this, that would be something but she has garbage damage too. The only thing going for her are a few good kbs. Like I literally have to count on landing these in order to beat people. Feels like every match is dependent on landing b4s and b3s.
any tips or should I just be playing a diff variation?

While I agree on shield toss being next to useless (aside from maybe full screen chip out scenarios), I do consider v2, to be her most solid variation.

Shield spin leaving opponents standing is great + the easy KB and shield charge is a godsend in some MUs. Amp shield spin is safe, and because of the FB gap you can often get away with a regular one cause they'll be trying to FB the amp.

It's not the variation you'd play to open people up easily, it's the one you play if you want to double down on hit advantage and strike/throw. Once she tags you with a spin she has the momentum, and with a loopable throw she can make this game plan work.

If you want mix for easier openings go with v3.

As a side note, while her stomp is obviously better in v1, i wouldn't consider it useless outside of that. You'd be surprised how many people still can't deal with the delay.

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

FWIW to you guys I watch f0xy's stream a lot, he's been using Sheeva mostly V2. He says shield spin is shit, not worth using the meter burn vs a regular meterburn BnB for more dmg, and literally never uses it, even un-amped. Says the Variation is all about the oki mind game.

Just figured I'd share that with the thread.

 

[Cobainevermind87]

FWIW to you guys I watch f0xy's stream a lot, he's been using Sheeva mostly V2. He says shield spin is shit, not worth using the meter burn vs a regular meterburn BnB for more dmg, and literally never uses it, even un-amped. Says the Variation is all about the oki mind game.

Just figured I'd share that with the thread.

How is he getting any kind of oki if he doesn't end his combos in shield spin? It leaves them right next to you when they wake up. bf4 sends them fullscreen.

How is he ending his combos?

 

[kevkopdx]

How is he getting any kind of oki if he doesn't end his combos in shield spin? It leaves them right next to you when they wake up. bf4 sends them fullscreen.

How is he ending his combos?

He literally does throws and b3 non stop... he could be using any character the way he plays v2

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

How is he getting any kind of oki if he doesn't end his combos in shield spin? It leaves them right next to you when they wake up. bf4 sends them fullscreen.

How is he ending his combos?

shrrruggg, just repeating what i've heard him say multiple times.

He usually goes for shield charge meterburn into 23 bf4 i think.
He was saying if u meterburn 3x for worse damage and worse oki with dragonspin, it's not as good as going for the 3x meterburn dmg on regular BnB

 

[Cobainevermind87]

shrrruggg, just repeating what i've heard him say multiple times.

He usually goes for shield charge meterburn into 23 bf4 i think.
He was saying if u meterburn 3x for worse damage and worse oki with dragonspin, it's not as good as going for the 3x meterburn dmg on regular BnB

Nah I'm not trying to discredit you or anything, I just think it's terrible advice as you can't get any oki ending in bf4.

opener~shield charge amp, dash 21db2 leaves you in perfect range to bait and punish their wake-up. Or just straight up pressure if they have no meter.

 

[Agilaz]

I like foxy and would never discredit a top EU player like him, but I've tuned into his stream and it seems his opponents are the type who get hit by every stomp, barely block b3's, barely block sweeps, never break throws or read them..

I think shield spin has more value than he realizes but if your opponents can't even deal with 4 basic moves, why would you ever bother with shield spin and what it offers?

 

[Zer0_h0ur]

I like foxy and would never discredit a top EU player like him, but I've tuned into his stream and it seems his opponents are the type who get hit by every stomp, barely block b3's, barely block sweeps, never break throws or read them..

I think shield spin has more value than he realizes but if your opponents can't even deal with 4 basic moves, why would you ever bother with shield spin and what it offers?

True That. He's so damn good at working the back throw loop oki game, I'm jealous lol.

 

[Agilaz]

I feel the one and only thing Sheeva misses is a KB on one of her throws, preferably her forward throw.

 

[xKMMx]

This was as satisfying as MK 11 gets !

 

[Viny_Silva1]

Im playing Mean Queen and its my new main and i Discover good things with her and this glitch with the overhead can be useful in some matches

 

[Syzoth]

I cannot get over how bad and useless v2's shield twirl is. There's never a reason to use it in combos because you have bf4 grab, it's not good to use in neutral because of the flawless block gap... what is the purpose of this move even imagined to be?

I play V2 exclusively. I've made a thread about her plus frames off of the shield twirl on the Sheeva forum, I'll likely elaborate and make it more of a detailed explanation showing off all of her plus frames. I've made it to demi-god with Sheeva's V2. I love it. I could probably get up to God, but gotta be honest. Whenever I hit that top tier, I'm usually done with KL for the month.

 

[OPS_soldier]

I don't know if anyone knows this, but you can also do f1 as a mindgame when hitting an unamped to shield spin. It acts as another dash d3 if you don't wanna dash.

 

[Syzoth]

I don't know if anyone knows this, but you can also do f1 as a mindgame when hitting an unamped to shield spin. It acts as another dash d3 if you don't wanna dash.

If you're laggy and the opponent manages to poke you out of the forward dash d3, going for the b3 will give you a KB.

 

[Espio]

Time for tea:


This match up chart is for Smash & Grab and assumes you are utilizing the full potential of her great forward/backward movement, zoning and so forth.

Some match ups where Sheeva "loses" the neutral she wins at full screen simply zoning and spacing out.


Some match ups may get better or worse over time. She seems to do well against some of the higher tier characters, but also struggles against some of them in my opinion.

Skarlet: 6-4
Robocop: 6-4
Cassie: 6-4
Terminator: 6-4
Sonya: 6-4
Kano: 6-4


Jade: 5-5
Baraka: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Shao Kahn: 5-5
Geras: 5-5
Jacqui: 5-5
D'vorah: 5-5
Scorpion: 5-5
Jax: 5-5
Liu Kang: 5-5
Sindel: 5-5
Sub-Zero: 5-5
Johnny: 5-5
Raiden: 5-5
Kotal: 5-5
Frost: 5-5
Erron :5-5
Nightwolf: 5-5
Spawn: 5-5
Fujin: 5-5


Kitana: 4-6
Cetrion: 4-6
Kabal: 4-6
Shang Tsung: 4-6
Kollector: 4-6
Noob: 4-6
Joker: 4-6

 

[Swindle]

FWIW to you guys I watch f0xy's stream a lot, he's been using Sheeva mostly V2. He says shield spin is shit, not worth using the meter burn vs a regular meterburn BnB for more dmg, and literally never uses it, even un-amped. Says the Variation is all about the oki mind game.

Just figured I'd share that with the thread.

But...he doesn’t play her properly. He’s all thumbs.

 

[Wigy]

Time for tea:


This match up chart is for Smash & Grab and assumes you are utilizing the full potential of her great forward/backward movement, zoning and so forth.

Some match ups where Sheeva "loses" the neutral she wins at full screen simply zoning and spacing out.


Some match ups may get better or worse over time. She seems to do well against some of the higher tier characters, but also struggles against some of them in my opinion.

Skarlet: 6-4
Robocop: 6-4
Cassie: 6-4
Terminator: 6-4
Sonya: 6-4
Kano: 6-4
Shao Kahn: 6-4


Jade: 5-5
Baraka: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Geras: 5-5
Jacqui: 5-5
D'vorah: 5-5
Scorpion: 5-5
Jax: 5-5
Liu Kang: 5-5
Sindel: 5-5
Sub-Zero: 5-5
Johnny: 5-5
Raiden: 5-5
Kotal: 5-5
Frost: 5-5
Erron :5-5
Nightwolf: 5-5
Spawn: 5-5
Fujin: 5-5


Kitana: 4-6
Cetrion: 4-6
Kabal: 4-6
Shang Tsung: 4-6
Kollector: 4-6
Noob: 4-6
Joker: 4-6

how does sheeva beat shao kahn

d4 literally shuts down everything and if you block it hes out of range of everything. He can get spear trades to stop fireball and f34 is so hard to punish midscreen. Got to flawless block micro dash s1. I find that matchup Worse than most characters. His d4 is especially infuriating. His u3 is also kinda stupid cant do her usual safe spacing to bait wakeups.

 

[Espio]

how does sheeva beat shao kahn

d4 literally shuts down everything and if you block it hes out of range of everything. He can get spear trades to stop fireball and f34 is so hard to punish midscreen. Got to flawless block micro dash s1. I find that matchup Worse than most characters. His d4 is especially infuriating. His u3 is also kinda stupid cant do her usual safe spacing to bait wakeups.

I changed it cause it wasn't meant to be 6-4 her favor, but Jade and Erron's down 4 doesn't "shut down everything" so I doubt Shao Kahn's does given how much less safe he is than they are. People overly relying on down pokes subject themselves to jump in combos and bleed damage from her.

Most of her match ups she gets beat in the poke war, I can't think of anyone on the roster she out classes in down pokes lol. Shao Kahn is generally unsafe. He has great anti-airs and good pokes though to keep him in the running.

 

[Wigy]

I changed it cause it wasn't meant to be 6-4 her favor, but Jade and Erron's down 4 doesn't "shut down everything" so I doubt Shao Kahn's does given how much less safe he is than they are. People overly relying on down pokes subject themselves to jump in combos and bleed damage from her.

Most of her match ups she gets beat in the poke war, I can't think of anyone on the roster she out classes in down pokes lol. Shao Kahn is generally unsafe. He has great anti-airs and good pokes though to keep him in the running.

His d4 and s1 shit make him a brick wall in that matchup i find. Also b3 is a total ball ache to punish midscreen. Her jip’s are complete shit as well which makes it low profile time when you go to punish d4.

im not an outstanding sheeva player but shao i have ran a lot of sets against.

 

[Espio]

His d4 and s1 shit make him a brick wall in that matchup i find. Also b3 is a total ball ache to punish midscreen. Her jip’s are complete shit as well which makes it low profile time when you go to punish d4.

im not an outstanding sheeva player but shao i have ran a lot of sets against.

Your opinion is as valid as anyone else's. Your argument is all that matters. I definitely wouldn't disagree he has some good checking buttons.

Being honest, I do jump kicks with her and most of my characters. I really like her jump kicks and I play V1 so I'm always on hit going into anti-air grab conversions for my damage. Jump kicks also tend to b harder to anti-air or low profile and they also can lead to combos on hit so it's not much in the way of a sacrifice.

I would have to see more I'm not inclined to be worried as I was told Frost is terrible but Sheeva seems to be able to play her game fine. I think the thing about Sheeva is you have to concede that certain charactrs out space you and stop trying to play their game and double down on what you are good at overall.

Unrelated to this particular match up necessarily, but her sweep is so good for punishing people running away and trying to space her out it really does a lot of work for her. It reminds me of Baraka's sweep in the sense of it advancing and operating as a great check, whiff punisher and blowing people up for trying to space you too much. The best thing about the conditioning is now you're ducking to wait for it and now I can throw, overhead or stagger.

 

[Wigy]

@Espio

i should try jk more. I find it difficult with the wavedash and s1. Just difficult to space it.

his sweep does what sheevas does but better so cant use it as much as i would like.

If you do play the matchup one thing thats useful is using b3 on read of sweep or d4.

 

[Blewdew]

Time for tea:


This match up chart is for Smash & Grab and assumes you are utilizing the full potential of her great forward/backward movement, zoning and so forth.

Some match ups where Sheeva "loses" the neutral she wins at full screen simply zoning and spacing out.


Some match ups may get better or worse over time. She seems to do well against some of the higher tier characters, but also struggles against some of them in my opinion.

Skarlet: 6-4
Robocop: 6-4
Cassie: 6-4
Terminator: 6-4
Sonya: 6-4
Kano: 6-4


Jade: 5-5
Baraka: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Shao Kahn: 5-5
Geras: 5-5
Jacqui: 5-5
D'vorah: 5-5
Scorpion: 5-5
Jax: 5-5
Liu Kang: 5-5
Sindel: 5-5
Sub-Zero: 5-5
Johnny: 5-5
Raiden: 5-5
Kotal: 5-5
Frost: 5-5
Erron :5-5
Nightwolf: 5-5
Spawn: 5-5
Fujin: 5-5


Kitana: 4-6
Cetrion: 4-6
Kabal: 4-6
Shang Tsung: 4-6
Kollector: 4-6
Noob: 4-6
Joker: 4-6

Mind explaining the Cassie mu? I haven‘t played against a single Sheeva yet but from what I‘ve heard I have a hard time to believe she wins against her with how dominating cassie‘s neutral is.