Scorpion Changes I'd Like To See

[Hor_PeT]

Yeah they could just mash d1/d3 as soon as they see the teleport startup in pressure with no risk because cancel or not they will hit scorpion out of it. Or duck and kb d2...

Yes. No more "pressure" with tele cancel.
And no more mixup between regular and cancel tele.
Of course people want to see this as probably this is the most annoying thing about Scorpion right now (besides "teleport amp 50/50" looool).

I think the high tele hitbox issue would be bigger problem as you will not be able to whiff punish certain moves. E.g. Kitanas B231 / Cassie's low gun shot. Or just a D1/4 masher lol.

I do not think NRS would hit that but let's see how they think. I dont want to theorycraft more.

 

[vegeta]

Also all scorpions saying git gud.

Most of the stuff you need to counter scorpions requires hard reads and tricky timing with fast reactions.

Scorpion just has to hurr durr.

In terms of skill to play vs to counter he's so whack

"hurr durr"against an even halfway competent player you'll be doing that all into the next round. First off you can shut most of his stuff down up close by blocking low first then high. He has to open you up on your own mistakes. His strings are safe but he gives up his turn. If you block even accidentally he dies. Yea we're saying git gud because he's top tier but a fair top tier and not really tricky with crazy strings or anything. In addition any unsafe string we do into any cancel is all unsafe. ALL of it.

 

[vegeta]

Seems a lot of people don't know what the block button is. Half the cast of MKX makes this scorpion look weak af. The game is so slowed down now that if you're getting trashed it's either because A: You're no blocking and just wanna swing, B: you're not as good as you think or C: you simply don't know the matchup. Even 10 minutes of basic lab has allowed me to understand any character on a base level at the very least. Now that said there are a small handful of characters that pseudo break the rules of the game itself and you are for all intents and purposes guessing the entire time for the most part. THAT can be changed. Scorpion though? It's been 25 years and people still complaining about a move he's had in every single game smh

 

[vegeta]

Just because he switched to Scorpion that doesn’t mean he likes that MU more, otherwise he woulda done that to begin with. His backup main is Scorpion. His main main wasn’t working. I do this all the time. If I lose with Scorpion twice in ranked I use Geras or Jacqui. Same with Geras, I go Scorpion or Jacqui, etc. Not that the MU is better but my character I started with wasn’t working out. And the switch almost always does the trick for me... almost, lol.

yep. In every game I have my rule of two. A main and a backup. In this game It was going to be Frost/Scorpion but ended up being reversed since Frost is............wonky atm.

 

[spidey300]

I hope shang is shit on release

 

[spidey300]

My point is that neither one of you have an argument. Top players and bad players do both get hit by random teleports and they both can also block one and punish. So what exactly were you guys even arguing?

Clearly you're both shit at reading comprehension. The whole basis has been that casuals get hit way more by random teleport.

 

[spidey300]

Scorpion seems ok as he is to me honestly. Maybe some hitbox issues in some matchups but being an intended Frost player SHE has huge hitbox issues lol.
No need to buff scorpion. He’s like Ryu, pretty straightforward and fundamental. Super strong neutral but if you aren’t being reckless and pressing buttons he’s more than manageable

And just like ryu in sf5 scorpion is probably about to get unjustly nerfed

 

[spidey300]

What is fully seeable. The fuck.

If you mean you can visually react. No you can't, you read it coming and get ready to fuzzy, which adds to the stagger.

And you can end the string safely with pushback so go cry me a river.

On f32? There's no threat of a low so just stand block. He can't cancel the string into anything safe so just keep blocking and react to the low. Plenty of characters that can punish death spin from f32 range

 

[Wigy]

On f32? There's no threat of a low so just stand block. He can't cancel the string into anything safe so just keep blocking and react to the low. Plenty of characters that can punish death spin from f32 range

He has a first hit low so you need to be crouch blocking up close. Also a long range d4 and good d3

Which means you gotta block low high low while waiting for a stagger. The pushback I referred to is f34 not pain chain. Though that is a pain in the ass at some ranges with characters.

I have a pocket scorpion for skarlet and cetrion and it is baffling how easy he is compared to other characters

 

[spidey300]

So then there's really no overhead threat. F34 is also -7. Scorpion isn't doing anything after it that'll put you in a dangerous situation especially if you challenge. Of course he's easy. He's scorpion. The poster boy. The ryu. He better be easy. Him and subzero

 

[SaSSolino]

I hope shang is shit on release

Doesn't matter. I stuck with day 1 Shinnok, I'll do the same with Shang if necessary.

 

[BuffRaiden]

f3 should be significantly more negative. No one needs -3 staggers like this. Death spin should actually be punishable at all distances. Spear on block should allow for a full screen punish from characters like Kabal or Raiden. Any mention of buffs for this character is asinine.

 

[Hor_PeT]

f3 should be significantly more negative. No one needs -3 staggers like this. Death spin should actually be punishable at all distances. Spear on block should allow for a full screen punish from characters like Kabal or Raiden. Any mention of buffs for this character is asinine.

BuffRaiden then.

Yes death spin should be death for Scorpion for that minimal damage it can do (lot of character can punish it pretty well or at worst start offense after block)

I agree with spear nerf but please make it meterless combo launcher like in mkx (ofc.joking in this post).

 

[BuffRaiden]

BuffRaiden then.

Yes death spin should be death for Scorpion for that minimal damage it can do (lot of character can punish it pretty well or at worst start offense after block)

I agree with spear nerf but please make it meterless combo launcher like in mkx (ofc.joking in this post).

Since its a great anti air, does considerable chip on block with buff, limits any sort of approach, yes it should be death on block. I think scorpion is a fun character to play if his strongest tool was b14 as a wife punisher. But the way Scar played him at CB was just nauseating. Jump tele cancel rinse and repeat.

 

[OutworldKeith]

He has a first hit low so you need to be crouch blocking up close. Also a long range d4 and good d3

Which means you gotta block low high low while waiting for a stagger. The pushback I referred to is f34 not pain chain. Though that is a pain in the ass at some ranges with characters.

I have a pocket scorpion for skarlet and cetrion and it is baffling how easy he is compared to other characters

You can block low vs 90% of the cast and be alright. Scorpion is no exception dude. He has b3 OH startup is 20+ frames. All of his other OH attacks are follow up hits in a string. His stagger can be interrupted with a jab string. Just make a read instead of letting him lock you down.

F3,4 is like -7 with pushback. However, you can punish it with a f/block u2.

 

[OutworldKeith]

f3 should be significantly more negative. No one needs -3 staggers like this. Death spin should actually be punishable at all distances. Spear on block should allow for a full screen punish from characters like Kabal or Raiden. Any mention of buffs for this character is asinine.

staggers can be interrupted lol. The spear was like that in the beta. NRS changed it for a reason.

 

[Hor_PeT]

Since its a great anti air, does considerable chip on block with buff, limits any sort of approach, yes it should be death on block. I think scorpion is a fun character to play if his strongest tool was b14 as a wife punisher. But the way Scar played him at CB was just nauseating. Jump tele cancel rinse and repeat.

Ok but you complain about Scar's Reborn and want to nerf Searing Rage death spin.

Don't we need to nerf Reborn too a bit?

 

[Hor_PeT]

You can block low vs 90% of the cast and be alright. Scorpion is no exception dude. He has b3 OH startup is 20+ frames. All of his other OH attacks are follow up hits in a string. His stagger can be interrupted with a jab string. Just make a read instead of letting him lock you down.

F3,4 is like -7 with pushback. However, you can punish it with a f/block u2.

I think the Scorpion match up is not played properly by most of the players (including me as I know the match up but did not play too much).
With that it looks even more oppressive.

With proper match up playing he is strong character enough.

 

[trufenix]

You guys are the biggest babies. Scorpion is beyond fine.

 

[NaughtySenpai]

Only nerf I'd be alright with is hellport not amping on block. He's fine otherwise. If you complain about his f3 stagger, you gotta be crying all day in the Jaqui forums too.

 

[Hor_PeT]

Only nerf I'd be alright with is hellport not amping on block. He's fine otherwise. If you complain about his f3 stagger, you gotta be crying all day in the Jaqui forums too.

Jaqui has no teleport!!

Btw hellport nerf would be a buff to me as I always press amp without hitconfirm when I do the scrubport and just lose the bar on block.
If I do not amp most of the cases it will not be punished as they wait for the amp too much.

 

[OutworldKeith]

I think the Scorpion match up is not played properly by most of the players (including me as I know the match up but did not play too much).
With that it looks even more oppressive.

With proper match up playing he is strong character enough.

The most important part of facing Scorpion is your defensive skills as a player. Get comfortable with throw tech, neutral crouching throws, TP punishment, counterpoking with strings, etc.

If you suck at throw tech, he’ll eat you alive. Most players start to mash d2 trying to beat the throw. They’ll end up eating a b1 to the face.

Every time I face a Scorpion I make it a point to interrupt f3 stagger with a string. Ive been using Noob lately, so I’ll interrupt with 2,1,2, which leads to 300+ damage. This will discourage him from staggering with f3 knowing he could get blown up like that. It also forces him to use f3,4 and that’s an easy f/block.

 

[Hor_PeT]

The most important part of facing Scorpion is your defensive skills as a player. Get comfortable with throw tech, neutral crouching throws, TP punishment, counterpoking with strings, etc.

If you suck at throw tech, he’ll eat you alive. Most players start to mash d2 trying to beat the throw. They’ll end up eating a b1 to the face.

Every time I face a Scorpion I make it a point to interrupt f3 stagger with a string. Ive been using Noob lately, so I’ll interrupt with 2,1,2, which leads to 300+ damage. This will discourage him from staggering with f3 knowing he could get blown up like that. It also forces him to use f3,4 and that’s an easy f/block.

I agree but these fundamental skills are not easy to master I think.

I wait for the moment when somebody flawless block counters my F34. Then the real mind games begin!
Unfortunately so far I met 0 (zero) players who flawless blocked either F34 or F42.

But I play just Kasual and not too much compared to my apperance in the practice room, yet.

And tbh my game plan is around footsies i do not overdo F3 stagger. But that is not an excuse!

 

[OutworldKeith]

I agree but these fundamental skills are not easy to master I think.

I wait for the moment when somebody flawless block counters my F34. Then the real mind games begin!
Unfortunately so far I met 0 (zero) players who flawless blocked either F34 or F42.

But I play just Kasual and not too much compared to my apperance in the practice room, yet.

And tbh my game plan is around footsies i do not overdo F3 stagger. But that is not an excuse!

In most cases it’s not worth it. They’re +7 after a blocked f3,4. They have space to breath if they were getting pressured. If you’re good at f/block it makes sense to go for it.

I don’t see many Scorp players go for f4,3 myself included. Characters with 7f jabs can punish that string too.

All it takes is practice. I’m better at throw tech than I am at neutral crouch punishes, but I’m getting better at it.

 

[DrFolmer]

Just make his teleport cancel a bit more negative so the throw/string mixups arent so damn oppressive. It would still leave him in a desirable position where he can shimmy and attemp to bait buttons and neutral ducking. Or increase the spacing on cancel so it's not an immediate mixup. My main issue with Scorpion how easy it is for him to enforce respect. He should have to work for conditioning and not just spend a bar to enforce his gameplan from anywhere on the screen.

And come on guys, I know we can always "learn the matchup" but when people consistently switch to Scorpion when they get bodied and see immediate succes despite it being a pocket pick. Keep his teleport a mid, keep his strings, keep his KB's, keep his godlike f3, his strong pokes with pushback. Just do something about teleport cancel so it's not a free 33/33/33 from anywhere