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Patch reaction

kcd117

Noob
I understand your point, the whole game receives a buff when they tone down the top tier. I agree with that.
I don't want any changes tbh, I just want fixes so he doesn't need to spend like 3 more months with the same issues we knew were there before the first patch arrived.
 

G11OST

Noob
Did I say anything about crying for buffs? No, I didn't. So don't put words into my mouth. Second of all, you said by yourself it is too early and I also said that and others as well. Not to mention that some characters also got nerfed, that alone already buffs Sub-Zero without giving him any changes too soon after his release. And as for the string, yes it could've been an option for the MB Ice Burst but you still have B23 and F22 for that job as well, and yes B23 deals more damage on juggle but not only it is bit harder to land when you wanna end the combo with the Command Grab but the damage is just one point higher then 3,3. I think that if you're in the corner you should go for for the 3,3 into Command Grab rather then B23. That way you still get the same damage more or less while having a bit easier execution.



Yes you talked about lowering the hitboxes while the character crouches, I didn't ignore this part. You just seemed to worry to much about the 2nd hit of the string whiffs as that is a moment when Sub-Zero is on offense and I showed you just like it can happen to Sub-Zero when he's on offense, he can do the same to other characters such as Deadshot.

But the thing is that each character can have it's own hurtbox depending on the size of the character. So if a female character crouches it only make that her hurtbox will become smaller even beyond the hurtbox of crouch blocking male character just because of the overall size of the female character. In MKX the females have smaller hurtbox on juggle combos as well. So for example Pretty Lady Leatherface couldn't get some of his juggle combos on female characters because of this. So yes, technically, a crouching character shouldn't avoid a mid on block, but if the overall hitbox of that character is already smaller then of some other characters, all of the moves should work according to that character's hurtbox.

I won't give it any other type name, all of those moves got their right type, just because the hitbox and hurtbox in some scenarios lead to different result that change anything.

And yes there are more examples of that in the game and previous NRS/WB games, but don't you think that if this thing has happen for so long, that this might have been intentional from the get go? I mean, yeah there might have been some hitbox/hurtbox stuff that weren't suppose to exist originally but if for MKX for example some of those hitbox/hurtboxes still exist after the last patch, then perhaps these things were intentional from the get go, like the example of Reptile in MKX that I brought earlier. You might not like some of these scenarios, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't suppose to happen. You need to adapt to the character and call every single that you don't like an issue. Not to mention that since the patch isn't out yet, NRS can still do a couple of changes at last second. And if they don't it only makes sense because like I and others said, Sub is only a couple of weeks out, unlike Red Hood, so giving him changes now would be too early. And once the patch comes, just the nerfing of the top tiers alone should buff Sub-Zero already.

This argument has gone for far too long. We need to wait until the patch comes out. Period.

33 whiff on crouch blocking, deadshot move whiffs on moves that lower the hurt box, how r u comparing these?

N I dnt think this is intentional, I think people r'nt perfect, including NRS.

Why do u defend this so much tho? I just don't understand?
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
I understand your point, the whole game receives a buff when they tone down the top tier. I agree with that.
I don't want any changes tbh, I just want fixes so he doesn't need to spend like 3 more months with the same issues we knew were there before the first patch arrived.
These aren't fixes if it was intentional, like Tom said himself.

33 whiff on crouch blocking, deadshot move whiffs on moves that lower the hurt box, how r u comparing these?

N I dnt think this is intentional, I think people r'nt perfect, including NRS.

Why do u defend this so much tho? I just don't understand?
Never said NRS are perfect, but this could be intentional, like Tom said himself.

And I compare between the two because it's all about the hitbox/hurtboxes while also taking the properties of each move, both cases fall under that same thing.

And the only reason I defend it so much is because you and some other people make so much noise about it. That's why. I said myself that you guys make so much noise about it.
 

Legion DC

"Another weakling..."
Premium Supporter
Tournament scene is what % of the community? 98% of us don't go to tournaments, I don't need players to play at tournaments to enjoy playing my favorite games online.
That is what people on this site mean by 'games dying', though. You can still go online and get MKX games right now.
Capcom is a bigger company than NRS
Y'all see Capcom give their fighting games more support after it's release way longer than NRS does their games.
Of course this keeps people playing the Capcom titles longer, right?!
Capcom doesn't have a boss. They're they own boss. They have more freedom than NRS to sit on 1 title longer than expected.

NRS have a boss. As we know a company called WB Entertainment. WB keeps NRS financially paid with advances and busy with deadlines for more new games to follow up on. In other words, NRS and their small staff can't sit on 1 title for long because they have and obligation to work on the next project.
A solution to this is for the NRS developers to start their own publishing company, and self publish their own titles.
Then, they can do things similar to what Capcom do.

Reminds me, also Rockstar Games develop and self publish their titles too. They haven't made a game in 4 years but continue to support and update their latest title GTA5. Why? because they have more control over what they do.
Kinda wish NRS was like this
 
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Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
Capcom is a bigger company than NRS
Y'all see Capcom give their fighting games more support after it's release way longer than NRS does their games.
Of course this keeps people playing the Capcom titles longer, right?!
Capcom doesn't have a boss. They're they own boss. They have more freedom than NRS to sit on 1 title longer than expected.

NRS have a boss. As we know a company called WB Entertainment. WB keeps NRS financially paid with advances and busy with deadlines for more new games to follow up on. In other words, NRS and their small staff can't sit on 1 title for long because they have and obligation to work on the next project.
A solution to this is for the NRS developers to start their own publishing company, and self publish their own titles.
Then, they can do things similar to what Capcom do.

Reminds me, also Rockstar Games develop and self publish their titles too. They haven't made a game in 4 years but continue to support and update their latest title GTA5. Why? because they have more control over what they do.
Kinda wish NRS was like this
That is very true. The thing is though, WB are the ones who hold the right for Mortal Kombat after Midway got shut down, so if NRS would become their own publishers, Ed Boon would have to get the full rights for MK, as he didn't had it even back in the 90's, nor did John Tobias, Midway did. And even if NRS get the full rights, the probably won't be able to make anymore Injustice games as WB had the DC license for a very long time and DC aren't gonna give that to any other company probably.
 

RVB

twitch.tv/rvblacktail
I once had a guy tell me that Raidens superman going through the klone in mkx was "intended" and "part of the matchup"... I have since learned that TYM has some delusional ppl around who will say and believe anything as long as this character never receives fixes to CLEAR BUGS.
 

Shaka

Tier Whore.
Capcom is a bigger company than NRS
Y'all see Capcom give their fighting games more support after it's release way longer than NRS does their games.
Of course this keeps people playing the Capcom titles longer, right?!
Capcom doesn't have a boss. They're they own boss. They have more freedom than NRS to sit on 1 title longer than expected.

NRS have a boss. As we know a company called WB Entertainment. WB keeps NRS financially paid with advances and busy with deadlines for more new games to follow up on. In other words, NRS and their small staff can't sit on 1 title for long because they have and obligation to work on the next project.
A solution to this is for the NRS developers to start their own publishing company, and self publish their own titles.
Then, they can do things similar to what Capcom do.

Reminds me, also Rockstar Games develop and self publish their titles too. They haven't made a game in 4 years but continue to support and update their latest title GTA5. Why? because they have more control over what they do.
Kinda wish NRS was like this
Marvel 2 didn't get support and it was played for years, stop.

It's the community's fault

Capcom doesn't have a boss, really? you guys can't be that naive!
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
I once had a guy tell me that Raidens superman going through the klone in mkx was "intended" and "part of the matchup"... I have since learned that TYM has some delusional ppl around who will say and believe anything as long as this character never receives fixes to CLEAR BUGS.
If it's hitbox thing it's not a buf, and I'm not a Sub-Zero fan, I still like him in IJ2 more then the rest of the cast of course, but if something like that of Raiden in MKX would have happen in IJ2 and someone could've just go through the Klone in IJ2, that would be a legit bug (unless of course that character uses a move that has armor).

Marvel 2 didn't get support and it was played for years, stop.

It's the community's fault

Capcom doesn't have a boss, really? you guys can't be that naive!
Here is the thing about Capcom and NRS.

Capcom has several dev teams that work on different games, the SF team is lead by Ono, and that team, as well as the other teams, work for the bosses at Capcom and they are all under the same building, while sometimes Capcom hire other dev companies to work on their games, like they did when they hired the dev company called "Ninja Theory" to work on the DMC Devil May Cry reboot.

NRS, however, are a dev team that have their own building but they are not an indy dev team and they work for WB, who own the right for both MK and DC (hence IJ) while they hire other companies to work on their games like how they hired Rocksteady to work on the Batman Arkham games, but they also hired HVS to work on the PC ports of MK9, IJ1 and MKX, as well as the PS4 port of IJ1, and they hired Qloc to work on the PC port of MKX after HVS couldn't have fix it. WB also hired Iron Galaxy to work on the PC port of Batman Arkham Knight, that turned out to be just bad all around.

But when it comes to the fighting games, the reason MVC2 got that such long tenure was because that original idea of the MVC series was that Capcom would help Marvel to advertise their franchises through their games, and Marvel no longer needed that after MVC2, that just happen to become such an iconic game, that is why it tool 11 years for MVC3 to come out, also SF3 Third Strike wasn't received very well in the public eye due to it's roster, and if it wasn't for Daigo and EVO moment #37, that gave would've never become that much popular, and that's' why it took 9 years for SF4 to come out. Now Capcom, after building such a huge support system for their fighting games while also doing a lot of bad decisions for all of their games, have realized that as of right now, ESports is the only true financial income for them, so they keep supporting their fighting games and they tend to make them as ESports as possible so that player would join the tournaments.

Ed Boon and his team in Midway, never got that scared to hold the MK series for so long just because of sales. Even when MK Special Forces got very low sales, MKDA was released just two years afterwards, and it was a success. Ed Boon said that all of the 3D MK games were never meant to be competitive (even though that both MKDA and MK Vs. DC had a few tournaments), but now both NRS and WB realized that they must go through Esports as well, but also didn't forgot that they must cater to the casuals like they always and they can't keep one fighting game for that long just for the Esports community, and because that once again, NRS is a separated dev team that work for WB, they can't focus on more then one game at once, while they also have to jump between the 2 franchises, MK and IJ, to keep both of them fresh.

So we all must remember that when we talk about Capcom, we talk about the bosses of Capcom, who are the bosses of all of their dev teams, including Ono's team, just like WB are the bosses of NRS, and we also must separate each practice, like game release schedule, between the bosses (Capcom's bosses and WB) and the devs (NRS and Ono's team).

Just to expend this further, EA, for example, are the publishers of Battlefield, but the devs behind it are DICE, and DICE work for EA, just like NRS are the devs of MK and IJ and WB are the publishers of them and NRS work for WB.

Hope that now it is clear to everyone :)
 

Shaka

Tier Whore.
If it's hitbox thing it's not a buf, and I'm not a Sub-Zero fan, I still like him in IJ2 more then the rest of the cast of course, but if something like that of Raiden in MKX would have happen in IJ2 and someone could've just go through the Klone in IJ2, that would be a legit bug (unless of course that character uses a move that has armor).



Here is the thing about Capcom and NRS.

Capcom has several dev teams that work on different games, the SF team is lead by Ono, and that team, as well as the other teams, work for the bosses at Capcom and they are all under the same building, while sometimes Capcom hire other dev companies to work on their games, like they did when they hired the dev company called "Ninja Theory" to work on the DMC Devil May Cry reboot.

NRS, however, are a dev team that have their own building but they are not an indy dev team and they work for WB, who own the right for both MK and DC (hence IJ) while they hire other companies to work on their games like how they hired Rocksteady to work on the Batman Arkham games, but they also hired HVS to work on the PC ports of MK9, IJ1 and MKX, as well as the PS4 port of IJ1, and they hired Qloc to work on the PC port of MKX after HVS couldn't have fix it. WB also hired Iron Galaxy to work on the PC port of Batman Arkham Knight, that turned out to be just bad all around.

But when it comes to the fighting games, the reason MVC2 got that such long tenure was because that original idea of the MVC series was that Capcom would help Marvel to advertise their franchises through their games, and Marvel no longer needed that after MVC2, that just happen to become such an iconic game, that is why it tool 11 years for MVC3 to come out, also SF3 Third Strike wasn't received very well in the public eye due to it's roster, and if it wasn't for Daigo and EVO moment #37, that gave would've never become that much popular, and that's' why it took 9 years for SF4 to come out. Now Capcom, after building such a huge support system for their fighting games while also doing a lot of bad decisions for all of their games, have realized that as of right now, ESports is the only true financial income for them, so they keep supporting their fighting games and they tend to make them as ESports as possible so that player would join the tournaments.

Ed Boon and his team in Midway, never got that scared to hold the MK series for so long just because of sales. Even when MK Special Forces got very low sales, MKDA was released just two years afterwards, and it was a success. Ed Boon said that all of the 3D MK games were never meant to be competitive (even though that both MKDA and MK Vs. DC had a few tournaments), but now both NRS and WB realized that they must go through Esports as well, but also didn't forgot that they must cater to the casuals like they always and they can't keep one fighting game for that long just for the Esports community, and because that once again, NRS is a separated dev team that work for WB, they can't focus on more then one game at once, while they also have to jump between the 2 franchises, MK and IJ, to keep both of them fresh.

So we all must remember that when we talk about Capcom, we talk about the bosses of Capcom, who are the bosses of all of their dev teams, including Ono's team, just like WB are the bosses of NRS, and we also must separate each practice, like game release schedule, between the bosses (Capcom's bosses and WB) and the devs (NRS and Ono's team).

Just to expend this further, EA, for example, are the publishers of Battlefield, but the devs behind it are DICE, and DICE work for EA, just like NRS are the devs of MK and IJ and WB are the publishers of them and NRS work for WB.

Hope that now it is clear to everyone :)
Too long didn't read... but Capcom went bankrupt and Sony brought it back to life.

SFV is a ps4 exclusive for a reason.
They rushed the shit out of it for a reason.
Marvel4 has chars no one gives a shit about and the fan favs are missing for a reason...
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
Too long didn't read... but Capcom went bankrupt and Sony brought it back to life.

SFV is a ps4 exclusive for a reason.
They rushed the shit out of it for a reason.
Marvel4 has chars no one gives a shit about and the fan favs are missing for a reason...
The char most likely was done before the game released LBSH but yeah Subz is new.

Capcom didn't go bankrupt, at least not for now. Yes they lost a ton of money and they barely stand on the ground but they not bankrupt still, even though they are very close to it ATM.

The reason that SFV made it only to PS4 and PC (no XB1 or Arcade) is because that since they indeed lost a lot of money they couldn't have make SFV before 2018, so they got money from Sony to make SFV already in 2016, last year. And the reason that they rushed is because that just like that now they get all of their income just from Esports, they wanted to put SFV for Capcom pro tour and that's why it got released in that state, and that was indeed a huge mistake on their part. But as for the structure of the company, it is still the same as before, just barely functional, unlike WB and their teams, including NRS.

As for MVCI, they release it with that roster because they wanna make the game too much Esports focus while also helping Marvel get some advertisements for their MCU movies, and Capcom hope that the their Esports support along with the MCU populairity would help the game, despite the fact that the X-Men were the staple of the series while they also don't put enough fan-service Capcom characters.

You should read my previous post, you will understand this message more clearly.
 
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Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
@Roy Arkon

Reasoning just whiffs your head, huh?

I'd throw my mic at u but it'll just go through your head, seems to be no hurtbox inside
That is more reasoning then just making so much noise about just one string, or now just go out and throw straight insult like you do right now. Not my fault.
 

G11OST

Noob
That is more reasoning then just making so much noise about just one string, or now just go out and throw straight insult like you do right now. Not my fault.
Lol
Not one string, whiff issues N general

Does it connect this time? Or are these hit boxes just flying over u?
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
Lol
Not one string, whiff issues N general

Does it connect this time? Or are these hit boxes just flying over u?
Are you still wanna keep this argument? Seriously?

Yes it was about this string as well as whiff stuff and hitboxes/hurtboxes in general. But you still making so much noise about it, you and other people in this thread as well, and now you're just spamming insults.

Look dude, I've said everything I need to say. If I'm gonna come back to this thread it's not going to be for talking to you, that's for sure. I'm done, for real.
 

G11OST

Noob
Are you still wanna keep this argument? Seriously?

Yes it was about this string as well as whiff stuff and hitboxes/hurtboxes in general. But you still making so much noise about it, you and other people in this thread as well, and now just spam insults.

Look dude, I've said everything I need to say. If I'm gonna come back to this thread it's not going to be for talking to you, that's for sure. I'm done, for real.
It connects
"Drops mic"