Video/Tutorial - Cyber Sub-Zero Optimized Meterless Knockdown Vortex with 5-way Mix-Ups (42%+ Meterless Combos)

[JDM]

I am not downplaying Cyber Sub Zero, I am saying that he has no real decent mids (Cyrax in particular), and you can't just pick him (nor the other cyborgs) up and play them right off the bat without work, others will fall away, this always happens with all DLC.

I happen to think he is absolutely ridiculous, especially in the corner, and has excellent mid screen tools.

My exact words in twitch chat are "Cyber sub is F***ing stupid".
Find those quotes.

Pig pls.

"Tournament viable killing machine".

Cyrax has a great mid, F211. It's listed as high but it's actually a mid.

 

[WakeUp DP]

And we though Tanya was bad.

Remember when people were counting the teleports from Tanya at CEO? Final round should be fun to watch...

Banned dlc chars for final round.

 

[marietta1200]

In to note how much I hate people replying to an 8 page thread without reading anything besides the OP.

Cool thx.

 

[SaltShaker]

So I assume everyone is watching Brady's stream as he showcases how to easily escape the setups right? Good.

 

[Samsara]

So I assume everyone is watching Brady's stream as he showcases how to easily escape the setups right? Good.

I hope he puts up a thread. Please tell Tom to put up a thread and a rambling Brady video. It's been too long since he's been gone

 

[Samsara]

"This is Nothing like Summoner Quan"

thank god brady is back.

 

[Reauxbot]

There's a lot of people completely disconnected from reality posting here.

The "they make the character good to sell more!" Point, you guys need to realize 99.99999% of the people who are puechasing this have a hard time even doing a special move. None of this applies to them. The fact that the game has any sort of balance at a high level is thanks to people like Paulo who does care about this. So enough of that crap.

The "they have the worst testers" is insulting. The dumbass who made the comment about getting fired for releasing a character like this apparently can't tell the difference between what an actual QA does and what the QA guys at NRS do. I mean we all remember how 2000-2007 was a golden age in fighting game balance. The people who are qa'ing that are competitive players are very capable and I'm sure they've chipped in on this, and I'm sure that if there's another patch this will be addressed.

Yeah this is fucked up, but maybe you should stop pointing fingers and saying silly stuff.

I tip my hat to you sir.
Anyways.. Is his divekick being an overhead the only problem here? Ive yet to come across a CSZ thats doing this... Maybe Cyrax and Smoke..but ive yet to be worried about a CSZ doing this.

 

[Thiago Gomes]

@REO,
I just create some midscreen and fullscreen confirms to lead to the corner into your pseudo-unblockable optimized setup.

Take a look

http://testyourmight.com/threads/cyber-sub-zero-midscreen-fullscreen-setups-into-pseudo-unblockable.59204/

 

[IDYLEHANDZ]

having a real hard time seeing what exactly is goin on on the screen, is the text inputs available anywhere? or just the hard way?

 

[Thiago Gomes]

having a real hard time seeing what exactly is goin on on the screen, is the text inputs available anywhere? or just the hard way?

I'm going to bed now because is almost 4 am here in Brazil, but on my way to work I will add the input in the description ok?

 

[Thiago Gomes]

MKXL Triborg Cyber Sub-Zero 41% Meterless Corner Combo Without Bomb, Drones and Jump in by OPA|LPT.ThiagoKain

MKXL Triborg Cyber Sub-Zero 40% Meterless Corner Combo Without Bomb, Drones and Jump in by OPA|LPT.ThiagoKain

 

[MadeOfMetal]

He can't do any guaranteed ones like the ones in the OP mid screen.
The ones you are probably reffering to are the f2 reverse knockdown ones, which are random to get and can also be escaped because f2 is not a hard knockdown and you are not in the corner.

Cyrax has 100% guaranteed ones anywhere, CSZ only in the corner.

What? lol, you have to be joking. did you even lab him.. i can understand thinking it was hard to block, but "guaranteed".. go lab it, and you will find how easy it is to shut down, it can be armored, htb's can be backdashed, jumped out of, armored, reset can be easilyblocked once you know what to block for. and there is no meterlesssetup. that is guaranteed.
90% of the time you will get blown up if your sparing partner knows the matchup.

his net is -26 on block. both normal and ex
his bombs are 106 on startup and 73 recovery yes ofc if you standthere and let them hit you afterall that time they are plus 18 on block. ex bomb is +8 on block startup of 15, so tell me even with ex he can't be both read and armored from his setups?

I'll agree cyrax needs some toning down, i just can't understand how he can be nerfed.
Edit:I don't mean that he'll die if he gets nerfed i mean i don't understand what eh should be nerfed in.

honestly he is quite eazy to block both the reset and low bomb into B3D4 with fuzzy now that i labbed it a bit. so i don't think he needs a nerf, i honestly think he might need armor on DF4 while standing.

people will be baffeled when they learn the matchup that anyone even asked for ners this early. he is definitely top tier but thats not reason for a nerf.

So...

Cyrax can meterless hardtoblockable you into resets anywhere on screen.

Smoke can combo you, end in Harpoon into 21, force another 50/50, and Batgirl loop you to death until you guess correctly.

Sektor can land UpMissile, take a nap, wake up, and full combo punish you.

But CSZ has corner shenanigans like half the roster does and the character requires massive execution to be played to its peak, but it's too much?



#Neverchange.

Cyrax = i question the viability of the meterless htb and reset setups esp after everyone knows the matchup.

his resets are blockable which im sure discounts them as true resets "they should be called" Somewhat hard to bloackable loops"

as for the rest of them i agree with what you said, but still don't feel anything they have is any different than the majority of the cast, in short none should be nerffed.

This is the funniest part of all of this. I'd bet money 99% of people have not labbed this yet. When I visually saw it I was like "wow wtf? Impossible to block!" Then I went to the lab and found it was very easy to block. Borderline gimmicky. I dunno why it's so easy but it seems the inputs come out extra smooth on block making it easy, nothing like Quan's. Almost as if they programmed something in to make it easier to block.

But instead of even checking it one time, people visually saw it and demanded nerfs. Unbelievable.

yep i agree completely i was dumfounded when i labbed it up for an hour and found these so called op resets which are not resets more loops are completely blockable, and that there is several options for the HTB setups including easily being blocked.

Yeah of course man. That's how this community is. I saw people sharing that 100 percent reset unblockable Cyrax stuff saying "omg this game this is why I don't play this game".

Like bruh, you can get out of it pretty easily, and it's nowhere near that difficult to just sit there and block. Training mode is your friend.

I don't know what it is with NRS games, but they command absolutely no respect from like 99 percent of the player base. Characters in SF4 had fucked up shit and no one trashed the game and the company like people do for NRS games. It's weird to me.

But yeah, it's pretty damn easy to block. I'm sure I'd get hit with it every once in a while, but there's a very static timing to the mixup from what I can tell. And full punish on block.

took the words outofmy mouth

Why make it a mid? Just like quan their where ways out. Just like Tanya their where ways out. Just like GM corner their are ways out. YOU have to explore them. Instead calling for a nerf on 1st week. If you main CSZ you know these setups have to come from a knockdown. So tell me what type of player would (in the neutral) allow you to throw a ice ball then dive kick? The only guess is "should I block L the OH or OH then low." It's pretty fair. And you can't say "well I can throw a bomb the run up and b3" because a little term called (recovery) and no good player will allow you to run up and do a b3. You can only get these setups off a knockdown unlike Cyrax who can leave you standing with a net, then throw a bomb to force your low block and either do 1 or 2 things... #1 b2 for L - OH or OH - L. Or #2 for throw to where you can tech it and end up in the same position. So please tell me which is worse... Having a character having to knock you down or one whol leaves you standing with no way out.?

I'll wait for answer and explanation

Labup Cyrax HTB's and so called Resets before posting false info about him.

Well this is literally the one and only variation that makes me feel that way, not the DLC as a whole.

Also I don't play this game as a job, I think you and a lot of others has the wrong impressions Yomi. From MKX release until SCR, I played the game religiously 40+ hours a week. After SCR through KiT, I probably played the game 10 hours a week or less. After KiT I hurt my wrist, so from KiT until today I played the game about 2 hours a week or less.

The only DLC I'm using is Bo Rai Cho, and I'm not scared of any the DLC like many of you complaining are. Literally the one and only variation that scares me for Final round is Cyber Sub Zero

why are you scared of him, just like any other char, the player can be read by tendencies, its as much of a guess for him as anyone else

 

[M.D.]

What? lol, you have to be joking. did you even lab him.. i can understand thinking it was hard to block, but "guaranteed".. snip

I'm sorry for the confusion, I meant guaranteed ways of getting the setup to happen without having to be in the corner, not that the reset is guaranteed.

 

[Krabman]

Jagged for Downplayer of the year holy shit

 

[The_Tile]

What? lol, you have to be joking. did you even lab him.. i can understand thinking it was hard to block, but "guaranteed".. go lab it, and you will find how easy it is to shut down, it can be armored, htb's can be backdashed, jumped out of, armored, reset can be easilyblocked once you know what to block for. and there is no meterlesssetup. that is guaranteed.
90% of the time you will get blown up if your sparing partner knows the matchup.

his net is -26 on block. both normal and ex
his bombs are 106 on startup and 73 recovery yes ofc if you standthere and let them hit you afterall that time they are plus 18 on block. ex bomb is +8 on block startup of 15, so tell me even with ex he can't be both read and armored from his setups?



honestly he is quite eazy to block both the reset and low bomb into B3D4 with fuzzy now that i labbed it a bit. so i don't think he needs a nerf, i honestly think he might need armor on DF4 while standing.

people will be baffeled when they learn the matchup that anyone even asked for ners this early. he is definitely top tier but thats not reason for a nerf.


Cyrax = i question the viability of the meterless htb and reset setups esp after everyone knows the matchup.

his resets are blockable which im sure discounts them as true resets "they should be called" Somewhat hard to bloackable loops"

as for the rest of them i agree with what you said, but still don't feel anything they have is any different than the majority of the cast, in short none should be nerffed.



yep i agree completely i was dumfounded when i labbed it up for an hour and found these so called op resets which are not resets more loops are completely blockable, and that there is several options for the HTB setups including easily being blocked.


took the words outofmy mouth


Labup Cyrax HTB's and so called Resets before posting false info about him.


why are you scared of him, just like any other char, the player can be read by tendencies, its as much of a guess for him as anyone else

I usually think you're a solid poster, but you can't be defending the shit Cyrax has. It is literally Summoner all over again, hard to blockable loops which hit 1 frame apart where it can be either low/oh or oh/low. And if your opponent does start blocking it, you can do a B1 setup and cancel it into Ex bomb and be plus 8.

The worst part about this though is that it costs no meter. In fact, he's building meter while looping you with this.

And if you actually read what people are saying, if you do a max height net or place the bomb in a certain distance, the bomb break any armor or backdash in the game.

This was absurd on Quan Chi and it's absurd on Cyrax.

 

[Hiyomoto]

I refuse to believe that nrs guys don't know that their dlc come with all this bullshit when they release them. Surely they do on purpose because a broken character sells better...

This, or they have the worst testers in the world.

Remember that NRS is running a business and not a shoulder to cry on so having broken DLC characters then fixing them on later in the game when the hype has died down is a pretty good business practice to get sales boosting.

 

[FROST_]

What? lol, you have to be joking. did you even lab him.. i can understand thinking it was hard to block, but "guaranteed".. go lab it, and you will find how easy it is to shut down, it can be armored, htb's can be backdashed, jumped out of, armored, reset can be easilyblocked once you know what to block for. and there is no meterlesssetup. that is guaranteed.
90% of the time you will get blown up if your sparing partner knows the matchup.

his net is -26 on block. both normal and ex
his bombs are 106 on startup and 73 recovery yes ofc if you standthere and let them hit you afterall that time they are plus 18 on block. ex bomb is +8 on block startup of 15, so tell me even with ex he can't be both read and armored from his setups?



honestly he is quite eazy to block both the reset and low bomb into B3D4 with fuzzy now that i labbed it a bit. so i don't think he needs a nerf, i honestly think he might need armor on DF4 while standing.

people will be baffeled when they learn the matchup that anyone even asked for ners this early. he is definitely top tier but thats not reason for a nerf.


Cyrax = i question the viability of the meterless htb and reset setups esp after everyone knows the matchup.

his resets are blockable which im sure discounts them as true resets "they should be called" Somewhat hard to bloackable loops"

as for the rest of them i agree with what you said, but still don't feel anything they have is any different than the majority of the cast, in short none should be nerffed.



yep i agree completely i was dumfounded when i labbed it up for an hour and found these so called op resets which are not resets more loops are completely blockable, and that there is several options for the HTB setups including easily being blocked.


took the words outofmy mouth


Labup Cyrax HTB's and so called Resets before posting false info about him.


why are you scared of him, just like any other char, the player can be read by tendencies, its as much of a guess for him as anyone else

Thank you for accomplishing two things in your post...
1) You literally won the most downplaying person for a character on TYM...
2) You literally didn't read my post besides the Cyrax part...
Everyone on this site knows damn well Cyrax once he gets you in a net your life is gone. Due to 3 things
1) loopable unblockables which are 1f gap
2) 44% meter less combos into a low OH setup that breaks armor into a combo or setup
3) lame you out with bomb combos.

@Krabman @The_Tile @JDM @SaltShaker @YOMI FOREVER KING all agree you are a downplayed and you show it.

 

[RiBBz22]

CSZ is fine now guys since I am maining him


RELAX

 

[Krabman]

I'm maining CSZ too for the sole purpose of abusing other triborg players with a smile. I WILL AVENGE YOU TREMOR

 

[JHCRANE 14]

Well, it seems the rumors are true.

 

[Thiago Gomes]

Updated With The Inputs

Notations: (PS4 / XOne)
1 - Square / X
2 - Triangle / Y
3 - X / A
4 - Circle / B
B - Back
F - Forward
D - Down
U - Up
BLC - Block
RN - Run
EX - Enhanced Move
SRF - Short Run Forward
NJP - Neutral Jump Punch
JI - Jump In
IBS - Ice Bomb Setup
IBC - Ice Bomb Combo

Inputs:
IBS - Throw the Closer Bomb With DB1 and Immediately do the B3D4 String
IBC - F4, 3, D3, F4, 3, D3, NJP, 1112

Combo #1 (00:12) - Fastest String, usually used to Punishment:
111, BF1, DD3, A Short Step Back and JI1, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, Wait a Little Bit, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #2 (00:30) - Overhead Starter:
B1, BF1, DD3, JI1, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #3 (00:46) - Overhead into Grab and Meter Cancel
B1 2+4, BLC, DD3, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #4 (01:02) - Low Starter
B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, 4, BF1, DD3, RN, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #5 (01:16) - Safest String Starter
114, BF1 EX, JI, D4 To Land Closer to your opponent, NJP, JI1, D3 To Land, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #6 (01:30) - Wide Range String Starter
F12, BF1, DD3, JI2, B3U4D4, 21, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #7 (01:45) - Wide Range String Starter v2
F12, BF1, DD3, JI1, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #8 (02:01) - A Reguar Jump in Starter
J2, B3U4D4, NJP, J1, D3 To Land, D, BF1, DD3, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #9 (02:16) - Fullscreen Ex Projectile Confirm
BF1 EX, Empty Jump in, D3 To Land, J1, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Combo #10 (02:32) - Fullscreen Regular Projectile Confirm
BF1, DD3, Empty Jump in, D4 To Land, B3U4D4, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 1112, IBS & IBC

Mixup #1 (02:47) - Wide Range String Starter Into Medium Bomb
F131, DD2, Empty Jump in, D4 To Land, B1, Wait to Freeze, Short Step Forward, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, 1112, IBS & IBC

Mixup #2 (03:03) - Wide Range String Starter Into Medium Bomb v2
F131, DD2, Empty Jump in, D4 To Hit Overhead, Dash Forward (FF), Short Step Forward, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, 1112, IBS & IBC

Mixup #3 (03:18) - Another Wide Range String Starter Into Medium Bomb
F43, DF2, Empty Jump in, D4 To Hit Overhead, Dash Forward (FF), Short Step Forward, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, 1112, IBS & IBC

Mixup #3 (03:33) - Another Wide Range String Starter Into Medium Bomb v2
F43, DB2, Empty Jump in, D4 To Hit Overhead, Dash Forward (FF), Short Step Forward, NJP, JI3, D3 To Land, SRF, 21, 1112, IBS & IBC

 

[MadeOfMetal]

Thank you for accomplishing two things in your post...
1) You literally won the most downplaying person for a character on TYM...
2) You literally didn't read my post besides the Cyrax part...
Everyone on this site knows damn well Cyrax once he gets you in a net your life is gone. Due to 3 things
1) loopable unblockables which are 1f gap
2) 44% meter less combos into a low OH setup that breaks armor into a combo or setup
3) lame you out with bomb combos.

@Krabman @The_Tile @JDM @SaltShaker @YOMI FOREVER KING all agree you are a downplayed and you show it.

so thats how many can't lab... ok, like i said check it out and you will find they are quite blockable, and most of those players are just scared of the upcoming tournaments and not knowing the matchup.

ive openly stated that the loop should stay, but the buffer to block the reset should be lengthened so it could be blocked more consistantly by those who don't have the time to lab it up... but come on.. why get a character nerfed because youa re having a hard time learning the matchup on DAY 6-7
what ive sugessted will fix all loopables and HTB's.

 

[MadeOfMetal]

I usually think you're a solid poster, but you can't be defending the shit Cyrax has. It is literally Summoner all over again, hard to blockable loops which hit 1 frame apart where it can be either low/oh or oh/low. And if your opponent does start blocking it, you can do a B1 setup and cancel it into Ex bomb and be plus 8.

The worst part about this though is that it costs no meter. In fact, he's building meter while looping you with this.

And if you actually read what people are saying, if you do a max height net or place the bomb in a certain distance, the bomb break any armor or backdash in the game.

This was absurd on Quan Chi and it's absurd on Cyrax.

i openly stated that the loop should go, but the HTB's are easy to block, they are fuzzyable, and what i purposed fixes all HTB's and loops in the game..

simply add buffer frames in between OH's and Low's hitting at the same time.. that will fix CSZ, Cyrax, as well as many other characters.

make the block window 3 frames instead of 1.

even though they are fuzzyable now they could be easier!

i honestly don't even use the reset, i use it once then go into combo...

just tired of some users, (not you) thinking Cyrax is still MK9 Cyrax, wanna see unblockable go play MK9 and you will see unblockable, with legit setups for unblockable bombs that couldnt be punished.

i believe cyrax is top tier, not Stier but very top, and thats not a reason to nerf! but the loop does have to be more blockable for casuals, and i get that, but it can be done without ruining his great mechanics.


and honestly i don't think they should have
Nerfed Quan the way they did. he could have had the buffer window changed so that way they where all blockable.

but most of Cyrax's setups, loops and HTB's are Very minus on block and easily punishable if blocked correctly.

i just don't want his, B2, Net, Bombs, B1, B3D4 or Jump in Kick 3 or 4 touched.

and if i hade to ask for a small buff after the loop and HTB's are fixed. id ask for his DF4(Scatter Port EX) to have armor while standing and not just on Wakeup.

 

[FROST_]

i openly stated that the loop should go, but the HTB's are easy to block, they are fuzzyable, and what i purposed fixes all HTB's and loops in the game..

simply add buffer frames in between OH's and Low's hitting at the same time.. that will fix CSZ, Cyrax, as well as many other characters.

make the block window 3 frames instead of 1.

even though they are fuzzyable now they could be easier!

i honestly don't even use the reset, i use it once then go into combo...

just tired of some users, (not you) thinking Cyrax is still MK9 Cyrax, wanna see unblockable go play MK9 and you will see unblockable, with legit setups for unblockable bombs that couldnt be punished.

i believe cyrax is top tier, not Stier but very top, and thats not a reason to nerf! but the loop does have to be more blockable for casuals, and i get that, but it can be done without ruining his great mechanics.


and honestly i don't think they should have
Nerfed Quan the way they did. he could have had the buffer window changed so that way they where all blockable.

but most of Cyrax's setups, loops and HTB's are Very minus on block and easily punishable if blocked correctly.

i just don't want his, B2, Net, Bombs, B1, B3D4 or Jump in Kick 3 or 4 touched.

and if i hade to ask for a small buff after the loop and HTB's are fixed. id ask for his DF4(Scatter Port EX) to have armor while standing and not just on Wakeup.

Ok I misread your comment.

 

[MadeOfMetal]

Ok I misread your comment.

no hard feelings, i misunderstand comments my fare share