General/Other - Mileena Mileena's True Tier Placement

[JerzeyReign]

Piercing is love, piercing is life *I know, I know, I still need to get my Ethereal game up

 

[B. Shazzy]

maybe she doesn 't need to play yolo but you all resort to it eventually. like 90% of your gameplan works on the understanding that you could yolo anytime if i tried to do something as simple as a counterpoke. i wonder if we'd be having this thread if hurtboxes/hitbox mechanics in this game weren't wacky

i wanna see foxy's mileena

 

[C88 Zombieekiler]

Maybe man but the way I see it when I look at the roster...I only see Ailen, Johnny, & GM Sub giving her issues. Besides that everything else feels even or in her favor imo.

gm sub doesnt for sure

 

[mortderire]

Come on dude characters are more than 50/50s. Tempest lao didn't have a low and he was one of the best characters in the game after his buffs up until the XL patch.

I guess it depends how you define 'top tier'.

I agree she's a champion in the right hands, though.

 

[Derptile]

All of the system changes really don't affect Liu or Cage as much as you'd think. They still play exactly the same, the only reason he's not looking as crazy right now is because of KP2, as those characters are on another level.

I agree those characters you listed probably are better than him, but to suggest they're in a completely different ballpark is just downplay. The only somewhat significant changes to Liu were the breaker changes and Fkmb being changed because the super cheap stuff has gone. The risk reward is still in his favor though. All he has to do is zone after a breaker though vs most the cast as his fireballs are good and the cancel change is irrelevant because F213 still jails into itself.

He plays the exact same, but that play-style is no where near as effective as effective as it was prepatch.

And the FBRC nerf is not irrelevant, it's actually pretty rough. F213 is now a 1 frame link to jail into itself and all of the other cancels are now in the single digits and he doesn't get jails like "F44 FBRC 1", "B34 FBRC F2", and so on, hell "F44 FBRC F1" isn't even a true blockstring anymore. Plus it's not like they changed the cancel advantage on the FBRCs, you actually have to sit there and wait the extra 3 frames in order to do the cancel which fucks your timing up (a shitty argument I know, but it still counts). Cage can deal with the new chip/meter nerfs because his character design allows you to open people up where-as Liu Kang design was to play around with fireballs until he got meter and then get in and make you block forever, and the patch dampened all aspects of that.

Prepatch the only character that were on his level were Quan Chi, Tanya, and maybe Lao. Now the characters on his level and higher are Jax, Sonya, Sub Zero, Mileena, Takeda, Kung Jin, Shinnok, Kano, Cage, F/T, D'Vorah, and maybe Quan Chi, that's excluding both the DLCs as well.

Like I said, he's a good character, but he's not fucked up anymore and IMO no longer S tier.

 

[@MylesWright_]

Another situation where the U.S was just so far behind the meta. You just don't know

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

Mileena is fucking scary.

I wish I didn't hate her face.

#BringBackTheMK9Teeth

 

[Juxtapose]

Really good to use vs People who know the Mileena match up. It twists everything they think they know about the character & uses their knowledge against them. But Piercing sadly is still better.

What major changes do you see with Ravenous play now? I have the PC version so don't have the latest updates and am curious as to what I'm missing out on.

 

[ShadyHeart]

Wait what happened that is making everyone consider her top tier instead of "meh" or even bad like before?

 

[Baconlord]

Wait what happened that is making everyone consider her top tier instead of "meh" or even bad like before?

Faster pokes and better sai recovery. Her meta was developed more as well

 

[Jaiyson]

I've made the comparison before, but she feels like a Wonder Woman and Harley Quinn hybrid. She has the "jailing without actually jailing" factor that Harley had with her fullscreen presence of zoning but now add in a teleport. Mind you though, that there's no way to make it safe on block unlike pretty much EVERY other teleport in the game that still gets a combo after and gains armor. That, and in the neutral, corner and OKI game, she shares the threat Wonder Woman instilled along with her mobility and AA game.

I do remember you and I discussing this before and I still think that's how she is made up.. Very versatile and can adapt to different play styles for every matchup. Mileena is one of those characters that you have to fight against differently. Similar to how people always say that 'you cant find Grandmaster Sub-zero like every other character.' Mileena's zoning can really be as annoying as Harley's zoning was which can cause a player to become impatient and then she can capitalize on that for her advantage. Mileena's b12 is similar to WoWo b1 on block...the mind game behind it can make players fearful to press a button but they do have options to beat it just the same.

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

I do remember you and I discussing this before and I still think that's how she is made up.. Very versatile and can adapt to different play styles for every matchup. Mileena is one of those characters that you have to fight against differently. Similar to how people always say that 'you cant find Grandmaster Sub-zero like every other character.' Mileena's zoning can really be as annoying as Harley's zoning was which can cause a player to become impatient and then she can capitalize on that for her advantage. Mileena's b12 is similar to WoWo b1 on block...the mind game behind it can make players fearful to press a button but they do have options to beat it just the same.

I completely agree with this. Mileena by complete dumb luck is probably the one character I've spent the most time fighting/the one MU I'm most comfortable with regardless of how much of a pain in the ass she is, and dealing with her in any variation is a completely unique fight. I would consent that she would be to this game what Lao was to MK9: above par in just about every category, but not enough so to be regarded as seriously busted.

 

[SaltFace NS]

So I've let this thread rock now for some time to see everyone's reaction to my statement on Mileena.

1. Be completely honest on this...tell me a tool this character doesn't have in her arsenal?

2. Name off the top of your head a match up that she DEFINTELY loses after all these changes? I'm not talking about in theory but an absolute proven bad match up.

3. Tell me how you do you really fight her if she don't give you the "YOLO" that you all wait for?

When you take this into account you realize she is now the perfect character without a single flaw in her design. Her only flaw is human element. For that reason to me she is the best.

I'm still waiting on the answers to these questions to disprove my opinion on this character now.

 

[Apex Kano]

Those low sais stop me from rushing in and cmd grabbing. I have to play Cyber to counter those sais or switch to Sonya to have a better macth up. Piercing is top tier for sure. A smart Mileena knows everyone waits for the "yolo" rolls, they use that to thier advantage.

 

[Nu-Skoool]

Funny how I've always thought this and now it's being talked about. What's even funnier is reading the comments about how she's too good and just now got this way.

Can't take a character that has adequate tools that can compete in any situation and can capitalize very well on any hit, and be a bottom tier character.

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

@YOMI RM SaltFace shinnok beats her until a Mileena can beat Woundcowboy

 

[JDM]

I think mileena is good, but best in the game? That's a longshot. Maybe on paper cause "no losing matchups" but too many characters have really broken shit. Especially the KP2 cast.

Out of the main cast she's likely top 5 though. When the nerfs settle for the Kp2 cast she could probably be top 3 or best in the game. But as of now Idk.

Also yeah Johnny is top 5. Character is sooooooo good.

 

[Crimea]

she is good in the right hands, but fair and balanced
without some broken braindead shit

 

[1man3letters]

I'm still waiting on the answers to these questions to disprove my opinion on this character now.

to be honest dude, no matter what anyone answers your still going to have your own opinion which of course your entitled to and most likely wont change it because like you said your "headstrong" but you have 8 pages of the majority replying to you saying yea that shes super good now but maybe/prob not #1, will it really change your mind if someone can answer those 3 questions when all the other comments dont?

example:
1. a run cancelable move, safe launching armor attack, proper command grab
2. shinnok
3. out space,out pressure and outplay her.

change anything?
im sure you'll still think shes unquestionably number 1 no matter what is said to you, just like when you thought ravenous was best

 

[Espio]

to be honest dude, no matter what anyone answers your still going to have your own opinion which of course your entitled to and most likely wont change it because like you said your "headstrong" but you have 8 pages of the majority replying to you saying yea that shes super good now but maybe/prob not #1, will it really change your mind if someone can answer those 3 questions when all the other comments dont?

example:
1. a run cancelable move, safe launching armor attack, proper command grab
2. shinnok
3. out space,out pressure and outplay her.

change anything?
im sure you'll still think shes unquestionably number 1 no matter what is said to you, just like when you thought ravenous was best

I'm glad you chimed in honestly. That's why I didn't weigh in originally because no matter who I list or the reasons why, it's not gonna make people go "Hey, you're right man. She's not top 1 with no losing match ups". I was gonna mention lack of safe armor as well, when this question was posed that was the first thing that popped into my head.

Several characters have a chance of beating her still. Shinnok is a popular choice mentioned by people, but Goro still might beat her especially since he got his mobility buffed and has the armor, safeness, plus frames and footsies to give her a serious run for her money.

The other thing is, most of these questions are kind of moot and/or hard to answer from either side because A. Nobody has labbed all the possible losing match ups she could have yet so nobody knows anything for a fact. Just like nobody knows "for a fact" that she's number 1 with no losing match ups.

B. It's fair to say everyone isn't fully adjusted to the new Mileena anyway (this applies to all buffed characters).


And whether someone plays yolo or not, you cannot play 100% safe and never take any risks ever regardless of the character because you are always making reads. Goro for example is safe on pretty much everything, but if someone makes a good read on my plus frames, whiff punishes me or baits my command grab armor etc. I can still lose and still be outplayed. Then there's ignoring the fact that her means of opening you up without a bar aren't that great and to armor out of pressure is still a risk for her so I wouldn't say she has it all. There are times when even having a fast down poke doesn't get you out of pressure when someone just loops plus frames especially if their low pokes have better range than yours. You may have to risk an unsafe armor or back dash too.

Is Mileena good now? That seems like a reasonable assessment. Is she the juggernaut of the game now? I'd say that's reaching at best. Give people time to adapt and learn, we'll see where she ends up down the line.

 

[ismael4790]

When people start mentioning "safe armor launcher" as a tool a character is lacking, then you know that the character is good...

 

[Jolt]

When people start mentioning "safe armor launcher" as a tool a character is lacking, then you know that the character is good...

Well, to be fair in Mileena's case you could reduce it to just "Safe armor".

People will say "use Ethereal if you want safe armor" (or in this case, invincibility rather)

but...that isn't the variation with tools that make her "number 1", is it? You give up a surprising amount from Piercing just for the fades

 

[IrishMantis]

^^^
I see I'm late with this

But hay that's how you know the variation system works one variation can't have absolutely everything

When people start mentioning "safe armor launcher" as a tool a character is lacking, then you know that the character is good...

And Mileena does have that in Ethereal but it's better.
An invincible super plus on block launcher that's near impossible to whiff punish shuts down any argument

Plus thread is named "Mileenas true placement" not Piercing

 

[ismael4790]

Well, to be fair in Mileena's case you could reduce it to just "Safe armor".

People will say "use Ethereal if you want safe armor" (or in this case, invincibility rather)

but...that isn't the variation with tools that make her "number 1", is it? You give up a surprising amount from Piercing just for the fades

If Mileena had a safe armor in Piercing, the discussion wouldn't be about if she is top 1-5 or not.
Would be about if she is ridiculous or absolutely ridiculous xD

 

[TheGabStandard]

^^^
I see I'm late with this

But hay that's how you know the variation system works one variation can't have absolutely everything


And Mileena does have that in Ethereal but it's better.
An invincible super plus on block launcher that's near impossible to whiff punish shuts down any argument

Plus thread is named "Mileenas true placement" not Piercing

I wouldn't call it a launcher but I get where you are coming from