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Kotal Kahn General Discussion

Mandolore1123

Man of Science Who Wields the Living Lightning
ive dabbled with totemic and i really like the character concept. hes more of a keepaway/whiff punishing char with self-healing. his best tool is obviously the totem, but i see some issues:
  1. the fact that he has only low damage output to benefit from it. with three totems up, you can heal yourself 100%, but he doesnt get the damage from combos and also has no good mixups. its also not easy to get the totem out because its slow (safe only after b22 but for damage sacrifice), let alone three. its great that a second summon already caches out the dealt damage and sets up a new count though.
  2. the fact that the totems dont always stack but sometimes appear in different locations and their effects dont synergize.
what do you kotal mains think and how do you play this char? i think i havent ever faced this variation.
Honestly I don’t mind if I have to sacrifice damage. He does get much anyways. The fact that I can end stuff in cat to get back to footsies range is pretty important and the totems are a viable threat and annoyance to the opponent.
 
Totemic tips.
Firstly it's match up specific to totem or sunlight etc. It is mainly neutral and life trading. Just assume conservatively that you can give up 30 percent of your life to enable damage.

Practice flawless block it is very important to kotal to utilize his excess meter. Also let's you not play into them and feel pressured to act

Below are ways to use his tools in addition to his spacing footsies. He does in fact have some of the best mid-range.

Anti zoning vs non zoners.
I can't stress this enough, trade with sunlight you win out by math. It forces them to come to you. Sunlight heals and damages for 100. If you soak a 70 damage high projectile then just duck you win without having to flawless. If they want to win they have to come to you or use amp. Either way you are commanding it. Just flawless the second amp projectile etc.

Anti rushdown
If you know your damage breakpoints then you can use sunlight to trade damage favorably especially while cornered. As an example, if their character can do 200 damage in a combo then you are even while giving up a hit. Since you gain 100 the total damage you take is 100 and they take 100. Understand how much damage they can do at what ranges. Obviously scout out crushes etc that work on counter or if you just want to get it out of the way early you can fish the hit. Math is important for Kotal, if you can't math while playing totemic is not worth it. For instance if scorpion has no more amp in neutral just pop it, most he can get is a raw teleport. You have to test their reaction and decision making. Because they would lose that trade and if you are already life leading he can't contest easily. I've trolled and won a lot of games with people offline just spamming light.

How to totem.
Firstly, it is a future investment or gamble. Always be conscious of this fact. I love gambling so totem is stupid fun for me. If players disrespect it and play regularly you will overwhelm them without them knowing. The heal procs when you summon another totem or when it times out. It's important to decide as you use it to figure out which way you want to utilize it. Using one at a time is typically not worth it. The timer is very long and you have a tremendous amount of time to utilize it. Sunlight also feeds the totem and so do throws. Kotal gets to choose sides on combos so play accordingly.

Panther dash uses.
Ground panther damage and wall carry is significant. You have to get good confirming your errant hits into this. Corner is a favorable position and even with your back to it is favorable against many match ups. The amp is only good for heavily telegraphed projectiles.

Air panther is really good. It keeps zoners honest at mid range without having to commit a forward jump. It is also good for dealing with characters that threaten mid range with forward advancing strings. You can jump and confirm wether to panther or not.
 
@Juggs come down and play me again man. I would not mind more scorpion xp.

Also, if you guys are still not wave dashing practice it. Combined with throws and his long reach he can threaten from very far.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
@Juggs come down and play me again man. I would not mind more scorpion xp.

Also, if you guys are still not wave dashing practice it. Combined with throws and his long reach he can threaten from very far.
Next week I can. Sister coming into town tomorrow and staying for the weekend. You going to anything next week?
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
I tried playing totemic yesterday. Totems were just straight up not giving me life on expiration if I was in hit or blockstun. I'd land full combos with 3 totems out, block a string or get hit by a D4 and receive no heals.
 

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
I tried playing totemic yesterday. Totems were just straight up not giving me life on expiration if I was in hit or blockstun. I'd land full combos with 3 totems out, block a string or get hit by a D4 and receive no heals.
Thats the really stupid thing about totems. If you get hit, it completely resets which imo makes them almost usless
 
I tried playing totemic yesterday. Totems were just straight up not giving me life on expiration if I was in hit or blockstun. I'd land full combos with 3 totems out, block a string or get hit by a D4 and receive no heals.
Are you sure the heal didn't proc while damage was being taken? I've definitely healed mid combo before. I actually outhealed one and just stopped playing due to laughing. I'll put it on my lab list priority. I do think I'm going to stick with kotal in the long run. He is a lot of fun, if anything I just have to identify the worst possible match ups and find an alt.
 

Ram

Buluc Chabtan
Air panther is really good. It keeps zoners honest at mid range without having to commit a forward jump. It is also good for dealing with characters that threaten mid range with forward advancing strings. You can jump and confirm wether to panther or not.
Just wanna add that a great utility of air cat is escaping the corner. If I'm cornered, I will use any advantage I get (e.g. hit them with a poke) then go for jump into panther, and escape the corner over their head. It's awesome and induces great amounts of salt in your opponent
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Are you sure the heal didn't proc while damage was being taken? I've definitely healed mid combo before. I actually outhealed one and just stopped playing due to laughing. I'll put it on my lab list priority. I do think I'm going to stick with kotal in the long run. He is a lot of fun, if anything I just have to identify the worst possible match ups and find an alt.
I'm 100% sure, I was looking at my lifebar more than the actual matches.

I landed a full combo + F4 with 3 totems up, got comboed expecting to just take it all back during, nothing.
 
I tried playing totemic yesterday. Totems were just straight up not giving me life on expiration if I was in hit or blockstun. I'd land full combos with 3 totems out, block a string or get hit by a D4 and receive no heals.
i figured you only get the heal if you dont get hit? isnt it supposed to be like that?
 

Jeffrey Wolf

YouTube: Jeffrey B Wolf
I've been meaning to test exactly when Blood Totem doesn't pay out. I knew FB and KB, unfortunately, but is it 100% confirmed that it doesn't if you are in block stun or being hit when it expires? I've certainly noticed failed payouts but haven't had a chance to dig deeper yet.

@dribirut, next time I stream Kompetitive Kasual with Totemic, I'll post here.
 

LawAbidingCitizen

Bomb Setups & Ball Rolls(Mileena/Cyrax)
does anyone think Kotal currently has any specific MUs where he has the advantage or is just good for him? Kotal seems underwhelming atm so I was just wondering
Very few but I think Kotals MUs are:

Sonya (L)
Geras (L)
Erron (L)
Jacqui (L)
Jax (L)
Scorpion (L)
Sub Zero (L)
Baraka (L)
Kabal (L)
Noob Saibot (L)
Cetrion (L)
Jade (L)
Scarlet (L)
Liu Kang (L)
Kitana (L)
Cassie (L)

He possibly wins:
Shao Kahn (?)
Frost (?)
D'Vorah (W)
Kano (?)
Kung Lao (?)
Raiden (?)
 

LawAbidingCitizen

Bomb Setups & Ball Rolls(Mileena/Cyrax)
With d1 mashers, you do d1 into d4 (they don't block, they just try to mash d1). The d4 jails for your f4 but I also like to f2 after d4 (on hit)
D1 wiffs against a large portion of the cast.
F2 after D4 is not a good idea. If they press any normal it will beat out his F2. Use F4 or F3 instead.
After D4 walk back a bit so last part overrides thier counter when using F24.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Very few but I think Kotals MUs are:

Sonya (L)
Geras (L)
Erron (L)
Jacqui (L)
Jax (L)
Scorpion (L)
Sub Zero (L)
Baraka (L)
Kabal (L)
Noob Saibot (L)
Cetrion (L)
Jade (L)
Scarlet (L)
Liu Kang (L)
Kitana (L)
Cassie (L)

He possibly wins:
Shao Kahn (?)
Frost (?)
D'Vorah (W)
Kano (?)
Kung Lao (?)
Raiden (?)
He doesn't win vs raiden, frost or shao kahn. I've played those matchups extensively.

If anything, I feel SK beats him.
 
F2 after D4 works very well in my experience... the spacing after D4 is excellent and F2 leads into options. Credit to some of the video here and acowboy2011 on youtube for opening my eyes on this point, as I used to employ D4 -> F4 far too much.
 

LawAbidingCitizen

Bomb Setups & Ball Rolls(Mileena/Cyrax)
No it won't, unless you mistime it.

+15 into 22f, your opp has 7f -1 to unblock.

You can only be interrupted as a just frame by 6f pokes.

If the very few chars with 6f pokes are willing to risk a d1 vs your f2, they can go ahead.
I think you are looking at paper way to much. His F2 only connects after last part of animation. And it doesn't connect on frame 22 it connects one frame after so 7f standing starters beat it when timed correctly.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
I think you are looking at paper way to much. His F2 only connects after last part of animation. And it doesn't connect on frame 22 it connects one frame after so 7f standing starters beat it when timed correctly.
What you said literally doesn't make sense.

22F startup means it comes out at 22F.

And no, 7f starters wouldn't beat it.

+15 into 22f = 7.

-1f unblock = 6.

Even if your one frame after was a thing, a 7f standing starter, which few chars have, would trade.

It's basic math.

edit: Just checked, a bunch of chars have 7f S1 and our F2 has 2 active frames. If the F2 was going to hit at any point, it'd trade. And that's only if it were to hit at the last possible frame.
 
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