"I win. I always win." - The Official General Zod Discussion Thread

[Colonel-Gilgamesh]

I can't really think of any 2d fighters that don't have MU's like that. AE doesn't really but it only took 5 years of patching. This game is two months old, let them do their work to make it what it needs to be man. That's all I'll say on that. Not to mention I don't see many 7-3's or 8-2's in this game, especially with Zod. I haven't seen anything that could be worse than 6-4 with him. I won't talk anymore on that though because MU's are a matter of perspective lol.

Zoning isn't his only way to control the screen though. He has the tools to deal with people who start to break his zoning, and the trick is to simply understand when to use all of them. The reason we can't keep people out as well as other characters is because we have more tools than most of them and it's our job to apply them correctly. Let's add it all up:

A 3 frame parry
3 different speeds of forceballs
4 different ranges of low lasers
His side arm
ground and air zod dash
The bf3 phantom push thingy
Trait

Those are a lot of tools that can be used in a lot of different ways. It's going to take more than a week to get the hang of it. I'm not saying in the end he won't be beatable, but honestly he is still really good now even understanding the little that we do. I just think we are going about this a little too quickly. I for one will be focusing on Zod for a while in an attempt to replicate Reptile and main him.

Problem with Zod is that his regular zoning is not strong enough for people to let you get out a ball or a wraith like Sinestro with his trait. I dunno, I think I'm with the whole killer frost overhead thing. That puny thing is useless.

 

[godlessmode]

Problem with Zod is that his regular zoning is not strong enough for people to let you get out a ball or a wraith like Sinestro with his trait. I dunno, I think I'm with the whole killer frost overhead thing. That puny thing is useless.

If you develop your IAKR and IAZC game and can do both reliably it does wonders to open up his Zodball play as anytime you are within the IAZC range the opponent has to play defense to some extent (due to the speed of the charge) or approach you with caution, closing space.

Once the opponent is afraid to challenge the IAZC, you can start to use the IAKR as a way to control space. This also inherently helps with getting your trait out as well.

 

[SimSim]

I just played around 80 matches against a Grundy online. He wasn't the best player, but I to practice a lot of zoning, and it really helps to just get familiar with all of his zoning moves:

I would neutral jump rifle a lot (close to the ground) and not instant air them because then I could be caught by swamp hands.

When I saw he wanted to advance I did the pistol or low laser and when i jumped I would try to react with dive in the air.

After getting knock downs from full screen, I would charge laser and get the low explosion on wake up. I would then dash and do dive if I connected.

 

[shoshinsha]

I think people are WAY underestimating Zod's control. Yes, his shots are sometimes easy to get through, but they're so adaptable! Zod has tremendous, almost automatic control of the air space. You can iaKR or jump and KR on the way down and give yourself a major buffer for his less safe moves like trait and ground laser--especially if you MB the air rifle and/or adjust its speed based on your opponent. And if anyone tries to advance on you while you're setting up your air shots, you have a high-priority, hard-knockdown, dash attack that starts up in 1-FRAME! The importance of that cannot possibly be overstated. There is literally no way for a move to start up faster than that, which means you have a huge margin of error for reacting to your opponent.

Basically, I think Zod needs to be airborne long enough to cover his ground setups, because his ground setups are unsafe but hard to avoid and lead to huge damage. Get Zod's air options down, then learn all the ways he can combo into damage+setups from a safe spot on the ground.

 

[dribirut]

the more i play him the more one thing is becoming apparent.. he needs a buff to his b23 string and fix of other strings..
f21u2 is worthless right now because of the second hit always whiffing
and the b23 second whiffs from a distance even though b2 already doesnt have good reach..
3 has pretty shitty reach as well and you can only connect to to charge or phantom...
all his other strings have shit range..

Dont get me wrong, even if the strings dont get buffed or fixed hes still a very good character but without these fixes he relies to heavily on trait and meter and cannot compete at footsies range very well...

 

[Colonel-Gilgamesh]

And if anyone tries to advance on you while you're setting up your air shots, you have a high-priority, hard-knockdown, dash attack that starts up in 1-FRAME! The importance of that cannot possibly be overstated.

Sure there is, you're overstating it right now. Not by much mind you, but Zod Charge as far as knockdowns goes is pretty crap. Zod recovers only slightly before they do. It's impossible to get anything really significant off it. I much rather try to end combos with the 123 string or better yet, the d1 2 string. And as far as using it raw in the air, it works fine, but the situation afterwards always feels like it's hard to make anything of it. Which is super important for Zod.

 

[Swoops]

On a more specific strategy note, does anyone know anything about standing frames on wake up? I ask because I see some matches where characters will use a timed high projectile to connect with an opponent on wake up, even though the opponent was clearly crouching.

I'm wondering if this could be applied to a high attack. So basically if I could figure out a good timing to cancel out of charge db2 set ups, could I get standing 1 to connect regardless if they crouch?

 

[Briggs8417]

On a more specific strategy note, does anyone know anything about standing frames on wake up? I ask because I see some matches where characters will use a timed high projectile to connect with an opponent on wake up, even though the opponent was clearly crouching.

I'm wondering if this could be applied to a high attack. So basically if I could figure out a good timing to cancel out of charge db2 set ups, could I get standing 1 to connect regardless if they crouch?

You might be able to with some moves if timed correctly, but it would be character specific, against some you would be begging to eat a wake up.

 

[Swoops]

You might be able to with some moves if timed correctly, but it would be character specific, against some you would be begging to eat a wake up.

If you had a set up like the one I just posted a few posts back, they could easily be conditioned to not wake up. Although looking into his 123 string, there's honestly not much to get out of the overhead except a knockdown. You can definitely do it though as I replicated it a few time. Pretty cool considering his jab is +7 on block. Though as an overhead mix up to laser charge I think you're better off using MB f3.

 

[Briggs8417]

If you had a set up like the one I just posted a few posts back, they could easily be conditioned to not wake up. Although looking into his 123 string, there's honestly not much to get out of the overhead except a knockdown. You can definitely do it though as I replicated it a few time. Pretty cool considering his jab is +7 on block. Though as an overhead mix up to laser charge I think you're better off using MB f3.

Like I said it just depends on the character, some characters have fully invincible wake ups and don't feel the need to be afraid to use them. However, if you can still stuff these moves with the setups even after the invincibility frames have wore off, then hell yeah let's do this lol. Yeah that's one thing that kinda sucks about Zod is that it's a little tough to hit people with overheads because f3 is slow and all his overheads are in the middle of strings so people just have to block him like Liu Kang, block the first hit of a string low then the next ones high. I've honestly liked using MB laser to finish block strings, good chip and a little bit of space to give you room to maybe put out a projectile or something. MB f3 is a good one to use too though.

 

[BurdManJR270]

Here is some of Zod's corner anti wake up tech that might be useful knowledge to keep in mind.

 

[Farpafraf]

Can

Here is some of Zod's corner anti wake up tech that might be useful knowledge to keep in mind.

Does this work on every cr or just Joker?

 

[godlessmode]

It should work on everyone. He is using a system glitch that is used by a variety of other characters to the same effect (Grundy can do it with WCC for example), and it tends to work on everyone.

 

[BurdManJR270]

Can

Does this work on every cr or just Joker?

I can't speak for the Zod tech, but I know this tech for Grundy with works on everyone. Some wake ups still hit like Hawkgirl's Mace charge. Check out my youtube channel for a few of these tech videos I made. Check this one out showing the tech on various characters wake ups.

 

[Swoops]

Like I said it just depends on the character, some characters have fully invincible wake ups and don't feel the need to be afraid to use them. However, if you can still stuff these moves with the setups even after the invincibility frames have wore off, then hell yeah let's do this lol. Yeah that's one thing that kinda sucks about Zod is that it's a little tough to hit people with overheads because f3 is slow and all his overheads are in the middle of strings so people just have to block him like Liu Kang, block the first hit of a string low then the next ones high. I've honestly liked using MB laser to finish block strings, good chip and a little bit of space to give you room to maybe put out a projectile or something. MB f3 is a good one to use too though.

Damn, wish I could record so I could put a demonstration up. Basically, if you set up a charge laser by juggling into d1/d12 xx laser, the laser will charge up to level 3 right in the middle of their get up. This is different from 123 xx laser charge, since the opponent can jump or backdash out of that one. These are completely meaty, so the opponent gets hit if he doesn't block low.

However, level 3 laser actually recovers so fast in these set ups, that Zod recovers in time to block at least 7 frame reversals. Do if you do the d1 xx laser charge, you can block unsafe reversals after you attempt the lvl3 laser and punish. If you do the d12 xx laser set up, many of those reversals will whiff completely and you will completely recover in time to punish.

I definitely saw the set up wonder chef posted, and that should be pretty easily incorporated into these set ups in the corner. I'm just not sure what timing to use for d1/d12.

 

[Colonel-Gilgamesh]

Full screen Wraith/bf2+u mixups are scary good.

 

[Marcus]

Hey guys,

What string has the fastest startup? I dont really know what to use for punishing.

 

[Impractical Joker]

Hey, I didn't see if this was answered in this thread but I just started playing online again and I haven't downloaded Zod. How are you supposed to block his trait grab or can you not? I didn't have a chance to test since I don't have him but can you dash forward to avoid it or backdash? Holding down or forward didn't seem to work and neither did jumping obviously

 

[xInfra Deadx]

Hey, I didn't see if this was answered in this thread but I just started playing online again and I haven't downloaded Zod. How are you supposed to block his trait grab or can you not? I didn't have a chance to test since I don't have him but can you dash forward to avoid it or backdash? Holding down or forward didn't seem to work and neither did jumping obviously

It's not an instant crossup. You can block normally...just not crouching when it bites you.

 

[Impractical Joker]

It's not an instant crossup. You can block normally...just not crouching when it bites you.

So if I'm facing Zod do I hold back or forwards?

 

[xInfra Deadx]

So if I'm facing Zod do I hold back or forwards?

Back.

 

[Colonel-Gilgamesh]

Hey guys,

What string has the fastest startup? I dont really know what to use for punishing.

Try d1 2 into MB Lasers. Pretty much any two hit string can go into MB lasers and nets good damage. At least 30% and up

 

[dribirut]

Big question here:
Are any of you guys having trouble with his back forrward moves ex pistol, charge, phantom

I cant how many goddamn times ive lost a game or got combod for 50% for one of these three moves not coming out in the heat of the battle..

it drives me nuts

 

[insignis]

Big question here:
Are any of you guys having trouble with his back forrward moves ex pistol, charge, phantom

I cant how many goddamn times ive lost a game or got combod for 50% for one of these three moves not coming out in the heat of the battle..

it drives me nuts

I often end up punching air instead of pistol shots. Lost some games to Superman because of that still never had troubles eith strike and charge

 

[Colonel-Gilgamesh]

Big question here:
Are any of you guys having trouble with his back forrward moves ex pistol, charge, phantom

I cant how many goddamn times ive lost a game or got combod for 50% for one of these three moves not coming out in the heat of the battle..

it drives me nuts

I think that's just nerves. Lotta people sweat in the heat of the moment.