Match-up Discussion Hitbox Zod mu chart- Khaotic Armor

[EMPEROR_OF_OUTWORLD]

I'm the batgirl player that is gonna body your black Adam right after Armor does.
As for the second part, I'm not sure I can even understand a thing you wrote. I get that it's a forum and grammar doesn't matter but at least try to make it understandable...
Also, pig literally came in here and said he stands by this MU chart, including the BA number. So pig is trash too huh?

BEGONE!!!!!! YOU REEK OF FAILURE

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Well you can't really base matchup charts like that all the time.

Everyone says Batman beats Batgirl, but no Batman has ever beaten Sonicfox.

Everyone says Zod beats Bane or goes 5-5, but no Zod ever beats Max or FKjr in tournament.

Everyone says Batman vs Batman is a 5-5 matchup, but no Batman ever beats mine.

That logic is pretty flawed

Do you know you're the only batman who leaves your backyard and does well??

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

BEGONE!!!!!! YOU REEK OF FAILURE

KING

I MUST SAY THOU ARMOR IS BUT A FOOL FOR BEING "KHAOTIC" BUT HIS HEART IS PURE W US AND DARK LIKE THE EMPERORS

AND HIS CHART IS THAT OF A MAN W LOINS

I ASK THEE GOD OF CREATION OUTWORLD TO ALLOW ARMOR'S TREACHERY

 

[ARMOR]

AND YOU ARE!!!!! ........RIGHHHHHHTTTTT!!!!!!

YOU WILL GOIN .... HAVE HIM SET IT UP DEATHMAZE .... I'VE READY BODIED YOU ... IT SEEMS EVERYTIME A KHAOTIC LOSE YAW MAKE ANOTHER KHAOTIC ACCOUNT AND WANT A 1V1 BUT HOL TIME YOU WANT A REMATCH OF THE LAST ASSWHOOPIN!!! .... YOU TRASH .... CLOSE THIS THREAD .. PIG DIDN'T SAY IT WAS OK FOR.YOU TO MAKE A THREAD ABOUT ZOD....

Ok so if I even was deathsmaze which im not btw, shouldnt you win free? Your logic tho

 

[MrSoloLobo]

Ok so if I even was deathsmaze which im not btw, shouldnt you win free? Your logic tho

Props for being able to read that

 

[Iamthejewish]

Well you can't really base matchup charts like that all the time.

Everyone says Batman beats Batgirl, but no Batman has ever beaten Sonicfox.

Everyone says Zod beats Bane or goes 5-5, but no Zod ever beats Max or FKjr in tournament.

Everyone says Batman vs Batman is a 5-5 matchup, but no Batman ever beats mine.

That logic is pretty flawed

You said that no one beats Max with Zod, so what is that?

Looks to me like m2dave beat max...
Edit: I just noticed its just casuals, not a tourny. But still, m2dave did it.

 

[M2Dave]

Well you can't really base matchup charts like that all the time.

Everyone says Batman beats Batgirl, but no Batman has ever beaten Sonicfox.

Everyone says Zod beats Bane or goes 5-5, but no Zod ever beats Max or FKjr in tournament.

Everyone says Batman vs Batman is a 5-5 matchup, but no Batman ever beats mine.

That logic is pretty flawed

A match up chart is supposed to be the two best players fighting each other at the highest level with their respective characters. The reality is that Aquaman and Sinestro players have been beating Zod players a lot more than Zod players have been beating them. I am optimistic and believe that Zod versus Aquaman and Sinestro may be 5:5 match ups, but until somebody beats Theo or Cowboy consistently Zod loses 6:4 to both characters.

As far as mirror matches are concerned, nobody beat me with Freddy. Nobody beat Pig with Kenshi. Nobody beat Tom Brady with Sub Zero. But mirror matches are naturally 5:5 match ups. If anything, having to invoke mirror matches proves that your logic is flawed and your argument is lacking substance.

 

[ForeverKing]

Do you know you're the only batman who leaves your backyard and does well??

Damnnnnn

 

[SkaGoogle]

And thats the reason why I hate some people in this community.
Shut the fuck up, I just asked him to explain, and here I got it. I didnt say its not 9-1, I asked why it is because it felt different when I played against Lex.
That means I have to play more in this MU, that means I need to get better, better at zonning (iaZb).

I dont really need to explain my self to you, just get lost.

I don't care for you to explain yourself, your opinion on the match up was laughable. If I said something untrue like cyborg beats Mmh would you not call me on it? exactly.

 

[M2Dave]

You said that no one beats Max with Zod, so what is that?

Looks to me like m2dave beat max...
Edit: I just noticed its just casuals, not a tourny. But still, m2dave did it.

I think the Zod player fighting Bane in the video is actually Pig. I am the one fighting Honey Bee.

The point is, King is a fool. I have beaten his little brother's Bane in casual games plenty of times. So has Pig.

King believes that Zod is some kind of God tier character because he has to work with Batman to win.

 

[ARMOR]

A match up chart is supposed to be the two best players fighting each other at the highest level with their respective characters. The reality is that Aquaman and Sinestro players have been beating Zod players a lot more than Zod players have been beating them. I am optimistic and believe that Zod versus Aquaman and Sinestro may be 5:5 match ups, but until somebody beats Theo or Cowboy consistently Zod loses 6:4 to both characters.

As far as mirror matches are concerned, nobody beat me with Freddy. Nobody beat Pig with Kenshi. Nobody beat Tom Brady with Sub Zero. But mirror matches are naturally 5:5 match ups. If anything, having to invoke mirror matches proves that your logic is flawed and your argument is lacking substance.

Some of the mu's are at the highest possible level. You think I just pulled these mu numbers out of my ass? I had opinions from players that are considered to be the best with there character and we had a few debates, but actually looking at the mu and seeing what zod is capable with 1 move completely changes mu's and alot of peoples opinions changed after we played a set. Bane in particular @Malarkey

 

[Iamthejewish]

I don't care for you to explain yourself, your opinion on the match up was laughable. If I said something untrue like cyborg beats Mmh would you not call me on it? exactly.

Again, I just asked him to explain it. I didnt notice that its a hitbox chart, so I asked why it's 9-1 and that I felt like its 6-4.
And the only one who laughs about it, is you... The point of this thread is to talk about the MU's, ask questions, etc.

 

[Iamthejewish]

I think the Zod player fighting Bane in the video is actually Pig. I am the one fighting Honey Bee.

The point is, King is a fool. I have beaten his little brother's Bane in casual games plenty of times. So has Pig.

King believes that Zod is some kind of God tier character because he has to work with Batman to win.

I dont know bro, I dont think Pig was wrong.
The gameplay/style looks like yours, buddy.

 

[M2Dave]

Some of the mu's are at the highest possible level. You think I just pulled these mu numbers out of my ass? I had opinions from players that are considered to be the best with there character and we had a few debates, but actually looking at the mu and seeing what zod is capable with 1 move completely changes mu's and alot of peoples opinions changed after we played a set. Bane in particular @Malarkey

You have never fought Theo's Aquaman or Cowboy's Sinestro. If you can go even with them, I will believe that the matches are 5:5.

I have always known how powerful iaZBs are while others were making threads such as this one.

 

[Malarkey]

Some of the mu's are at the highest possible level. You think I just pulled these mu numbers out of my ass? I had opinions from players that are considered to be the best with there character and we had a few debates, but actually looking at the mu and seeing what zod is capable with 1 move completely changes mu's and alot of peoples opinions changed after we played a set. Bane in particular @Malarkey

I've never played a Zod that was able to consistently do IAZB, and now that I have, it's completely changed my opinion of the matchup. Due to the acceleration of Bane's walkspeed, where he starts out very slowly and then speeds up, and his large hit box, he has to inch his way to Zod. You can D1 or command grab under the balls, but this does nothing but let him build meter and get trait back. And once you are even near jump distance he just Mb ground lasers you back to full screen. Even if he messes up the Zod balls and you try to dash, Bane's long dash doesn't help, you'll just eat a pistol shot.

The only saving grace in that matchup is Zod's bad wakeup game against Bane, but to get to that point is hell. Level 3 charge is not viable, Zod's air charge and Mb lasers see to that. F2 cancels? I would love to see someone consistently do that against slow Zod balls, it's not an option in my opinion.

If any Bane mains have any ideas or insight that could help, I'm all ears.

 

[ARMOR]

I think the Zod player fighting Bane in the video is actually Pig. I am the one fighting Honey Bee.

The point is, King is a fool. I have beaten his little brother's Bane in casual games plenty of times. So has Pig.

King believes that Zod is some kind of God tier character because he has to work with Batman to win.

Zod is god tier. Your the fool the in this conversation.

 

[HomeLee1121]

Zod is god tier. Your the fool the in this conversation.

meh zod is okay lol

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Zod is god tier. Your the fool the in this conversation.

Damnnn

 

[DarksydeDash]

@AK Pig Of The Hut and @General M2Dave, I've said my opinion and heard others on the Superman vs Zod matchup so what is your opinion on it? To me its a 6-4 Zod instead of 7-3 cause Superman dominates him in the corner but Zod's zoning game keeps him at bay. So its literally whoever hasthe life lead has the most chance of winning. I also mentioned on certain stages the match can be 5-5 as bounce cancels allow insane damage from Supes while Zod gets longer combos to bring his trait out. Some intereactables allow ambiguous OTG dive bombs such as the chandelier on Wayne Manor while others allow TOD in the corner, usually forcing the clash. On the other hand, stages such as Watch tower, or stryker's island let Zod use interactables to make his zoning game more frighting and allow pretty much a free trait call.

 

[Relaxedstate]

I'm curious. How do you feel about Zod Bane with IAZB's and all that now?

At the end of the day Zod could win 6-4, but for now I feel comfortable with 5-5. The momentum can go either way depending on who gets a life lead. Both charecters can run away with a lead and do it fast. That being said, Zod can sometimes get away even after losing a whole life bar and still comeback and win with smart zoning. BAne has options against iazbs though, including lvl 3 venom, it really isn't useless in a smart BAne players hands. They just have to be familiar with the 'hitbox' MU enough not to freak out. @Malarkey and @Everlast this was your first time playing a Zod who can decently do iaZbs? (or even a good Zod period?). Don't be so swift to judge this as unwinnable. Bane could be 5-5 and Superman is only a 6-4. Ill help you guys lab it out though, the first time you experience it is a definite 'wtf do I do?' moment.

 

[Mr Aquaman]

At the end of the day Zod could win 6-4, but for now I feel comfortable with 5-5. The momentum can go either way depending on who gets a life lead. Both charecters can run away with a lead and do it fast. That being said, Zod can sometimes get away even after losing a whole life bar and still comeback and win with smart zoning. BAne has options against iazbs though, including lvl 3 venom, it really isn't useless in a smart BAne players hands. They just have to be familiar with the 'hitbox' MU enough not to freak out. @Malarkey and @Everlast this was your first time playing a Zod who can decently do iaZbs? (or even a good Zod period?). Don't be so swift to judge this as unwinnable. Bane could be 5-5 and Superman is only a 6-4. Ill help you guys lab it out though, the first time you experience it is a definite 'wtf do I do?' moment.

I succumb to zod bodying ares 3-7, at the highest possible level ares has 0 options. And ill argue cyborg being a 5-5, instant blast gives him too much trouble.

 

[Relaxedstate]

Overall this is a pretty fair MU chart. I mean there is a few 7-3 here that are for sure 6-4s, but this minuscule difference is fairly unimportant, it is more about Zod simply winning them.

I stand by Aquaman and Sinestro being bad MUs, UNLESS Zod has respawning interactables and then they are even.

Thus, the only bad MU Zod has no matter what stage he plays on is MMH. I'm not ready to list that as a 4-6 or 3-7, but it is probably somewhere between that.

I think lobo is a solid 6-4 and NW is a 7-3 also (almost unwinnable on stages with respawning interactables).

 

[ARMOR]

At the end of the day Zod could win 6-4, but for now I feel comfortable with 5-5. The momentum can go either way depending on who gets a life lead. Both charecters can run away with a lead and do it fast. That being said, Zod can sometimes get away even after losing a whole life bar and still comeback and win with smart zoning. BAne has options against iazbs though, including lvl 3 venom, it really isn't useless in a smart BAne players hands. They just have to be familiar with the 'hitbox' MU enough not to freak out. @Malarkey and @Everlast this was your first time playing a Zod who can decently do iaZbs? (or even a good Zod period?). Don't be so swift to judge this as unwinnable. Bane could be 5-5 and Superman is only a 6-4. Ill help you guys lab it out though, the first time you experience it is a definite 'wtf do I do?' moment.

Zod beats him fullscreen and up close, how is it 6-4? I need an explanation. After playing several of supermen and having people watch the mu, they see how really broken the mu is
@Nightmare0900
@EMPEROR_THEO@Everlast

 

[Relaxedstate]

Zod beats him fullscreen and up close, how is it 6-4? I need an explanation. After playing several of supermen and having people watch the mu, they see how really broken the mu is
@Nightmare0900
@EMPEROR_THEO@Everlast

I don't think Zod beats Superman up close at all. Superman's options in the neutral are way better than Zods. And up close, when Zod has his back to the wall is even worse since he loses one of his best neutral game tool (backdash). Supes damage definitely keeps him in the game. Superman definitely has better ground mobility and air mobility than some of Zods other 7-3 MUs. With a few good reads the superman player is in. He can get zoned all day, but if he is patient then he should get in no problem at least a few times each match. And that can be the difference imo. It also just doesn't make sense that superman would lose 7-3 in context of his other good MUs. Nightwing and Black Adam are both much more limited in what they can do against Zod, yet this is the same? (Although tbh, I really think Zod-BA could be an 8-2 lol).

Zod annihilates Superman full screen though, no doubt about it. But that doesnt make it terrible, especially when you start having to alter the speed and height of the Zod balls. This opens up a meta game that the supes player can take advantage of.

 

[ARMOR]

I don't think Zod beats Superman up close at all. Superman's options in the neutral are way better than Zods. And up close, when Zod has his back to the wall is even worse since he loses one of his best neutral game tool (backdash). Supes damage definitely keeps him in the game. Superman definitely has better ground mobility and air mobility than some of Zods other 7-3 MUs. With a few good reads the superman player is in. He can get zoned all day, but if he is patient then he should get in no problem at least a few times each match. And that can be the difference imo. It also just doesn't make sense that superman would lose 7-3 in context of his other good MUs. Nightwing and Black Adam are both much more limited in what they can do against Zod, yet this is the same? (Although tbh, I really think Zod-BA could be an 8-2 lol).

Zod annihilates Superman full screen though, no doubt about it. But that doesnt make it terrible, especially when you start having to alter the speed and height of the Zod balls. This opens up a meta game that the supes player can take advantage of.

The footsie game vs superman is j1, i can tripguard superman for trying to f23 and superman loses every single air to air which also allows me to freely pop trait. I pretty much j1 my ass off in that mu and superman cant do anything about it.