For Honor

[RagingRicans]

I usually play for a few hours every other night.

Let me know if you want to run some games together. I tend to avoid the cluster fuck of elim, skirm, and Dominion though.

 

[RagingRicans]

Dude this happens all the time. I think the streamers set the trend, they do this too. For me it's the players who win one then leave that annoy me. Like they will lose the first match, switch characters, win, then bounce. It's aggravating as hell. They think one win means something and they're scared to lose again. Which is RAH Tarded because there's not even a ranked mode yet, lol. They just don't want to hurt their precious little pride and ego, it's really sad and annoying.

Like I've said over and over, matchmaking is aids. 99% are scrubs and any somewhat decent player will leave after one match, usually win or lose. Their goal obviously isn't to get better, honestly idk what their goal is. Actually, the streamer who does this mentioned why he does it. He said he doesn't want to be downloaded. He literally admitted he doesn't want to give his opponents a chance to adapt to him, basically saying he likes winning off of gimmicks. So sad, this streamer is really good too. So confusing.

Which streamer? Lol

 

[GAV]

 

[Red Hood MKX]

messing around in dominion wow the server's are aids in this game mode jesus. Going back to 1v1 or 2v2 lol

 

[EntropicByDesign]

Im down for duels any time I have the time.. but I'm on PC.

So, yeah,.. I feel like the PC community is a *little* more mature than console, simply because I think console's are going to get the vast bulk of the young kids and they are the primary trouble. That's not to say the PC community isnt shit too, it is. Just maybe its like, solid, reasonable shit.. not messy, runny, post-mexican food shit.

@GAV The reason I prefer 2v2 or dueling is gear and ganking. The one v one combat in FH is what I enjoy. The mind games and the back and forth and 1v1 and 2v2 are the most distilled versions of that. I dont have to worry about reviving anyone (for the most part) or running to objectives or being out geared or getting ganked (I mean it does happen in 2v2, but not too much - just fyi I want the meta in 2v2 to shift to actual 2v2 and not just duels). I just have an opponent and when he's down, I have might have another one. Etc. I dont want to get blown up by an idiot because he has god-gear and I dont want to walk in and body people through no skill of my own, but by virtue of my gear.

Its not to say that those modes are bad or that they dont have hype shit, 2-3v1 and coming out on top is an incredible feeling Im sure (i dont play them, so the best I have is a handful of 2v1's where I managed to throw one of them off something then kill the other one normally) but to me, its not worth all the crap I have to potentially wade through to get to the good bits and actual, good fights. Now, if I had a dedicated team and we fought as a team, Dominion would probably be extremely hype. But waiting for the match with a good connection (easier in 1 and 2v - fewer parties) and guy with comparable gear and the moment of actual combat seems silly (to me) when i can just queue for 1 or 2v and get that almost every time.

As to the playerbase being bad.. Uhh yeah. I am crap-ass at this game. I have a lv9 Warden, thats it. Ive played @Gesture Required Ahead in a handful of duels and an equal handful vs a buddy that started at the same time.. so we're talking about 2-1/2hrs of actual match time, with maybe 2hours of practice/fiddling around and when I sat down the other night for a couple hours of 2v2 with my buddy, I was damn sure getting bodied occasionally, but, seriously, 8/10 times it was to a mistake *I* made, not anything my opponents did.. Id not keep a close eye on my stamina and then miss like two easy parrys in a row, or botch my techs, etc that was costing me the match more often than my opponent just doing good shit. I was fighting people ranging from my level up to prestige 6-7 (I fought a prestige 4 conq and bodied him like 6 out of 8 times) etc... And I am NOTHING special AT ALL. I miss proper punishes, I fuck up techs, I dont block ANYTHING, i try to parry almost exclusively (trying to learn) and miss constantly.. Im terrible, but its still enough to walk over SO many people. I ran in to one guy who's prestige 1 or 2 on like 4 characters and I rematched him a dozen times or so and went from losing every round to winning about 70% by the end..

People are just bad at this game lol.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Im down for duels any time I have the time.. but I'm on PC.

So, yeah,.. I feel like the PC community is a *little* more mature than console, simply because I think console's are going to get the vast bulk of the young kids and they are the primary trouble. That's not to say the PC community isnt shit too, it is. Just maybe its like, solid, reasonable shit.. not messy, runny, post-mexican food shit.

@GAV The reason I prefer 2v2 or dueling is gear and ganking. The one v one combat in FH is what I enjoy. The mind games and the back and forth and 1v1 and 2v2 are the most distilled versions of that. I dont have to worry about reviving anyone (for the most part) or running to objectives or being out geared or getting ganked (I mean it does happen in 2v2, but not too much - just fyi I want the meta in 2v2 to shift to actual 2v2 and not just duels). I just have an opponent and when he's down, I have might have another one. Etc. I dont want to get blown up by an idiot because he has god-gear and I dont want to walk in and body people through no skill of my own, but by virtue of my gear.

Its not to say that those modes are bad or that they dont have hype shit, 2-3v1 and coming out on top is an incredible feeling Im sure (i dont play them, so the best I have is a handful of 2v1's where I managed to throw one of them off something then kill the other one normally) but to me, its not worth all the crap I have to potentially wade through to get to the good bits and actual, good fights. Now, if I had a dedicated team and we fought as a team, Dominion would probably be extremely hype. But waiting for the match with a good connection (easier in 1 and 2v - fewer parties) and guy with comparable gear and the moment of actual combat seems silly (to me) when i can just queue for 1 or 2v and get that almost every time.

As to the playerbase being bad.. Uhh yeah. I am crap-ass at this game. I have a lv9 Warden, thats it. Ive played @Gesture Required Ahead in a handful of duels and an equal handful vs a buddy that started at the same time.. so we're talking about 2-1/2hrs of actual match time, with maybe 2hours of practice/fiddling around and when I sat down the other night for a couple hours of 2v2 with my buddy, I was damn sure getting bodied occasionally, but, seriously, 8/10 times it was to a mistake *I* made, not anything my opponents did.. Id not keep a close eye on my stamina and then miss like two easy parrys in a row, or botch my techs, etc that was costing me the match more often than my opponent just doing good shit. I was fighting people ranging from my level up to prestige 6-7 (I fought a prestige 4 conq and bodied him like 6 out of 8 times) etc... And I am NOTHING special AT ALL. I miss proper punishes, I fuck up techs, I dont block ANYTHING, i try to parry almost exclusively (trying to learn) and miss constantly.. Im terrible, but its still enough to walk over SO many people. I ran in to one guy who's prestige 1 or 2 on like 4 characters and I rematched him a dozen times or so and went from losing every round to winning about 70% by the end..

People are just bad at this game lol.

Yea it's just a thing with FGs with a big casual base. It's like how in NRS games you have a lot of people with high lvl and a billion games but are not that good because they just play KOTH with randoms or ranked. Whereas good players probably have a handful of training partners just doing private 1v1s all the time.

 

[GAV]

@EntropicByDesign
Gear definitely matters, but only when the players are even or when players don't respect the differences.

I played on another account just to prove a point. I used Conq in Dominion with zero gear and did just as well as I do with my 108 Conq. I did have to change tactics though. Whenever my opponent got his Rage, I steadily backed away until it ran out. Even before that, I avoided exchanging with opponents who almost had their Rage. I also went for hazard kills anytime there was an opportunity, but I didn't make it look like I was until the time came. I also stayed back controlling 1 zone at a time rather than what I usually do - and that is try to dominate the closest and the middle - or going to the zone closest to the other team's spawning point.

Above all, be willing to feel good and bad without tying it to a standard of perfection. In Dominion, being the best player doesn't always amount to winning. Have 2 separate measurements - one is based on how well you play and the other is based on winning or losing. If you can let go of your standards for perfection, Dominion will become a good time.

 

[Red Hood MKX]

Dominion is a fun gane mode besides the connection issues. I really just play dominion to chill out and relax really dont take it too seriously like i do 1v1 and 2v2

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

"As a Warden main, Kenseis are fun to fight. I have no complaints about them."

@1:25

 

[GAV]

I know what motivates me to play this game. Its what motivates me to play any game. Its visceral - with a clear beginning and ending, like hard/positive/yang kung fu...

Note the momentum throughout the body ending in blocks and strikes. The body must be hardened to endure such forceful impacts. There is a clear beginning, middle, and ending to each movement. Its invigorating.

Now, compare it to a yin counterpart...

It is explained as multiple vectors of force, but there is no clear middle or end and that is why it slips through. Its like water. All angles aren't defended so it simply takes the path of least resistance - the angle least defended at each turn. If he tenses up and uses muscle then it follows a clear path so it can be defended with a clearly angled, hard, counter.

When I was purely a hard fighter, I encountered a soft fighter. I had nothing for him until I learned to couple some yin with my yang. Learning the soft takes time and understanding, more so than the hard - which focuses on effort.

My For Honor game, right now, is all yang - and thats the way its most fun for me. Until I am forced to implement some yin, it will stay that way. Once I implement soft, I will be better - but also less motivated to play.

If you're confused and asking why I wouldn't want to be better, just know that we are all wired differently. We all know our own motivations, but not necessarily the motivations of others. If you can see through the eyes of just one other person, your perspective and horizons broaden.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

You know my thoughts on those kinds of martial arts. But I won't rehash our argument here lol.

Anyway , Kensei is dope, and I feel bad for him. I mean, I lose to better players all the time but I can tell Kensei have an uphill battle. I've been able to just bully some that by all accounts should have beat me. Warden is cheesy and I couldn't be happier about it.

 

[GAV]

You know my thoughts on those kinds of martial arts. But I won't rehash our argument here lol.

Anyway , Kensei is dope, and I feel bad for him. I mean, I lose to better players all the time but I can tell Kensei have an uphill battle. I've been able to just bully some that by all accounts should have beat me. Warden is cheesy and I couldn't be happier about it.

Kensei's mixups after the guard break are dope. I feel like most players struggle against the Warden Grinder, but if they are quick on the dash and blocks - Warden has no fall-back. Kensei's high level game is just as good.

My post was kind of long for just a perspective point, but I played a few duels where I took no risks and I won all of them, but afterwards I needed to take a break before playing again because I didn't feel excited to play anymore. After a break, I went back to my old way - and was excited again. It felt kind of like when I got bodied by soft concepts before implementing them. The understanding and implementation of soft concepts deadened my vigor a bit, but made me much better. Its hard to compare gaming to reality, but for me - the feeling is similar.

 

[GAV]

 

[EntropicByDesign]

Warden can cancel misu into GB though, or just cancel it cold and attack out or dash back. Misu can be held and charged,, Ifisu hits guaranteed double side light into another misu. GB guaranteed heavy. GB into a wall and top heavy (which is freakishly damaging). Or double side light into misu again, Etc. There are 100% ways out of the grinder/vortex but Warden has insane options and mixup potential that when successful not only guarantees damage but keeps the vortex rolling (since thats the definition of vortex, lol). So even if you are quick on the dodge I can just cancel into a GB to catch the dodge (sometimes you still dodge away but in my experience most of the time I'll catch you, unless my spacing was really bad to begin with.), And my ability to hold misu before letting it fly means I can keep mixing the timing up.. And even IF someone can TOTALLY nullify my vortex, I can Parry and dodge and feint and do the same shit everyone else can with decent movement, solid damage and unless in mistaken, a guaranteed GB on a parry if the spacing isnt too jacked up.

I'm not saying that to toot my own horn and to say Warden da best! But just to say I don't think it's as simple as dodging shoulder to nullify him and that Kensei has some dope shit for sure (I really like Kensei) but he doesn't have the level of guaranteed damage that Warden does and that holds him back a lot imo.

This is just a general statement on the characters, I'm not saying Kensei doesn't/can't dumpster me.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Question: what's stopping Assassin characters from Side-dash attacking fast Unblockables? I feel like it's the only solid counter to fast Unblockables but some non-assassin characters with Side-dash attacks aren't fast enough to compete.

 

[GAV]

@EntropicByDesign
Haven't seen any Wardens utilize mixups that complex.

 

[GAV]

Question: what's stopping Assassin characters from Side-dash attacking fast Unblockables? I feel like it's the only solid counter to fast Unblockables but some non-assassin characters with Side-dash attacks aren't fast enough to compete.

Those classes generally have unblockables of their own. The only one that doesn't has a hidden stance to compete.

Has anyone met the Trapzerker yet?

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Those classes generally have unblockables of their own. The only one that doesn't has a hidden stance to compete.

Has anyone met the Trapzerker yet?

Kensei's Swift Strike ain't no free out of jail card when it comes to Warden's vortex. And it sure as hell ain't his Unblockable lmao. Nobu also doesn't get out for free.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

@EntropicByDesign
Haven't seen any Wardens utilize mixups that complex.

It's standard Warden play actually. There's no need to make a read when you can just react to what your opponent does because of Warden's ability to cancel bash with GB if they dash.

 

[CrazyFingers]

Kensei's Swift Strike ain't no free out of jail card when it comes to Warden's vortex. And it sure as hell ain't his Unblockable lmao. Nobu also doesn't get out for free.

Im curious, what would you change to help Kensei?

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Im curious, what would you change to help Kensei?

IDK that wouldn't shoot him to top tier. I think it's more of a game mechanic overhaul that needs to change to make Kensei viable. ie. Remove safe parries by making the feint timing to be towards the end of a heavy attack instead of the beginning. This mechanic will also help offensive play as the opponent will be blocking more Heavies because they're afraid to get baited.

Otherwise, I think his side Lights need to be faster, also Swift Strike. Top Heavy could also have a bigger feint window similar to Side Heavy. But like I said, those changes might be too good.

A dream change could also make it so that Kensei could force players to play his Unblockable mix-up when they get GB'd instead of an easy escape by rolling out.

EDIT: Actually I think a decent change is to allow his Heavy feint into GB interrupt the opponent's parries like Berserker and Warden does. Because as of now, feint into GB pushes Kensei back and he gets punished.

 

[Juggs]

The problem with Kensei is that he is a lot like Raider. They have to pretty much rely on mixups and feints, they don't have any dirt like Warden's Vortex. The dilemma is that without Warden's dirt, he is severely limited. Likewise if Raider and Kensei had dirt to go along with their play now, they'd shoot up to top tier and be really hard to deal with.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

@EntropicByDesign
Haven't seen any Wardens utilize mixups that complex.

The irony is I lose because I try to be that complex and then fuck up my inputs and mistime something. lol. Its not super complex though really, the idea is only really to keep from being overly repetitive so that just dodging wont annihilate your vortex. I have a bad habit of misu>double side light>misu>single side light>misu>GB>side heavy, and once a good opponent sees that a couple times they know when its safe to dodge and such. I just get stuck in a pattern and go on autopilot. A lot of people dont even seem to realize you can cancel into GB or just cold cancel. I got called a hacker by a rep3 Raider because I was GBing after a misu and popping him like that, then when he started to tech me I just let the misu go.. then towards the end of a round he was winning I had a nasty sequence that took him from full to a pip reallly fast (I was on a pip when this happened) and then misu'd, canceled it into a top heavy that I feinted, and didnt figure he'd parry because he was so mindfucked from the misu's, so I GB him and killed him with a side heavy. Lots of shit talk, then he quit - all because he didnt seem to realize misu is sorta stupid and I can do what the hell ever I was out of it. The real trick to beating it is not letting me do it at all when you can. If you think its coming, keep your fastest light on deck.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

The problem with Kensei is that he is a lot like Raider. They have to pretty much rely on mixups and feints, they don't have any dirt like Warden's Vortex. The dilemma is that without Warden's dirt, he is severely limited. Likewise if Raider and Kensei had dirt to go along with their play now, they'd shoot up to top tier and be really hard to deal with.

Warden without dirt is def limited, but removing it like you say, could be a huge problem, unless the class got a mini-overhaul to compensate. Maybe make the timing more specific so i cant shoulder THEN see a dash and react with the GB.. I have to commit to one other the other when I let the shoulder fly? Thats a small change, but I feel like it would be helpful.

Ive actually decided to pick up a pocket character that DOESNT have guaranteed damage like my Warden does, I feel like there is a side of the game Im able to totally ignore, and while Im fine with that on my main, I want to know how to *play* this game, not just play Warden. Kensei is a possibility here as well as Orochi and Nobushi and Zerker. I just dont like Raider or LB all that much to be honest. Shrug. Conq/WL/PK/Valk are out because they all have guaranteed damage stuff like headbutts and all that or in the PKs case, she just doesnt play the same game as anyone else in general. Essentially I want to rely on attack mixups, feints and that kind of thing to get my damage. I feel like having that experience will make me a much better For Honor player in general and elevate my Warden indirectly. You never know what the future holds, and I just dont want to end up cultivating a skillset that gets nuked by a patch.

 

[Gesture Required Ahead]

Warden without dirt is def limited, but removing it like you say, could be a huge problem, unless the class got a mini-overhaul to compensate. Maybe make the timing more specific so i cant shoulder THEN see a dash and react with the GB.. I have to commit to one other the other when I let the shoulder fly? Thats a small change, but I feel like it would be helpful.

Ive actually decided to pick up a pocket character that DOESNT have guaranteed damage like my Warden does, I feel like there is a side of the game Im able to totally ignore, and while Im fine with that on my main, I want to know how to *play* this game, not just play Warden. Kensei is a possibility here as well as Orochi and Nobushi and Zerker. I just dont like Raider or LB all that much to be honest. Shrug. Conq/WL/PK/Valk are out because they all have guaranteed damage stuff like headbutts and all that or in the PKs case, she just doesnt play the same game as anyone else in general. Essentially I want to rely on attack mixups, feints and that kind of thing to get my damage. I feel like having that experience will make me a much better For Honor player in general and elevate my Warden indirectly. You never know what the future holds, and I just dont want to end up cultivating a skillset that gets nuked by a patch.

Warden is still your best choice because he still has offense potential even without the Bash. Top heavy feint into Crushing Counter is a good opener. And on GB you can Side Heavy into top heavy feint GB and repeat. Top Light kara-cancel into Zone Attack is also really good (or just the Zone vs Top Light mix-up overall)

Bash is really just icing on the cake for Warden he can still play the game honestly.