Alright since I actually have some time now (finally some damn free time), I'll go ahead and address some of the comments in this thread.
Its hard out there for raiden
with interuptible strings and punishable tele and extele
It definitely comes down to the player because winning with him is hard
especially when somebody knows how to fight raiden.
Complete lameness will get the job done with raiden in a lot of his mus
I think he's been explored but has to be played differently idk
Good luck to anybody using raiden in tourny against high lvl lao,sonya,kabal etc it won't be easy.
I think with raiden you need at least one more character.
I don't think its possible to go all raiden anymore
But maybe somebody will prove me wrong
It's possible but extremely difficult. In all honesty I would probably be placing a lot better at tournaments if I used a character with braindead, safe, abuseable shit as a main or even an alt, but from the beginning I decided to push Raiden to his limits, regardless of other characters being easier. Anyways we've played before so you know whats up...the main people downplaying me are the ones that haven't really played me much or judge my skill based on a time I wasn't well schooled in a matchup.
Raiden's gonna keep being "Unexplored" until a player breaks top 8 at a major or beats a top player using him. That's just how it goes.
I agree. People only know what they see, so I understand why people think he's unexplored. This idea alone pisses me off because I know what I know, and I know what I can do...on top of the countless hours I've spent developing my own strategies and tech.
I just don't think Raiden has consistent representation among the absolute elite players, no disrespect to any Raiden player.
The absolute elite players are the ones using the best and/or easiest characters to win with, just sayin.
The fact is, PL is still the one who's done the most with him, and I don't think Raiden was ever his full time main.
I guess me placing top 8 at a major using only Raiden doesn't count right? People seem to forget that. At anaheim pig made a bad choice of character against his Raiden and Frosty Faustings was hardly a stacked tournament.
I never liked the idea of Brady going to Raiden, but LBSH, he's done amazingly well with a character with far more losing match-ups than Raiden. So while I'd understand why BWizz would feel somewhat offended upon hearing what Tom said, it's not that much of a stretch to suggest that someone as good as Brady would be able to play the character differently in specific match-ups, and therefore, show some of the "unexplored" aspects of Raiden's game.
I have my doubts of seeing anything new or or ground breaking. He's still in the beginning phases of figuring out how the character really works.
There is no whining here. I played him for 3 days in a MU I am grooming him for. It was very frustrating for the first 2 days. I stuck it out, despite the blow ups and ppl telling me to drop it after only 2 days, and things finally began to come together and I am on the right track in the MU I am grooming him for. The point was that it's frustrating learning a new character and this community will always tell you to quit after 24 hours rather then have you stick it out. This is why you dont see several characters represented.
and you can stop with all the " Maybe if he wasn't telling the Raiden community they aren't playing the character right and that he would be the best raiden people may have been a bit nicer to him." bs..
the FACT is that a Sub-Zero player, SOLY playing Sub-Zero on most cases especially recently, is a regular in top 8 at majors from DAY 1! Even now in his most nerfed state, he is still a regular in top 8's. Raiden is a much better character yet Raiden's have failed to do what some trash Sub-Zero player has been doing for almost 2 years. I have only stated the FACTS and the Raidens out there dont like it. Raiden is a much better character then Sub-Zero, if the Raiden player(s) are high level players then why do they fall short 99.9% of the time at BIG majors? Are they bad? NO! Is Raiden bad? NO!.. What is the answer then? aaahhhh.. maybe they are missing something? Maybe there arent any complete Raidens yet? Maybe there are aspects of him that are unexplored? If the Raiden community doesnt like hearing that some aspects are unexplored and Raiden IS in fact totally farmed out, then there are only 2 other possible reasons that they fall short. 1. Raiden sucks, or 2. They suck..
AGAIN.. THERE ARE ONLY 3 POSSIBLE REASONS FOR RAIDENS FALLING SHORT 99.999999999999% OF THE TIME
1. RAIDEN SUCKS
2. THEY SUCK AS PLAYERS
3. HE IS UNEXPLORED IN SOME AREAS
They get offend when I say he is unexplored. If they are yelling that he is totally farmed out, then rather then get mad at me, they should be me at themselves for saying that either they suck or their character is bad and they are too stupid to see it so they say he is good.
Man gtfo with the whole "I did good with Sub Zero so I'm a better player than any Raiden" nonsense. Sub Zero has more bullshit against a lot of the cast, mainly rushdown characters than Raiden does (which you see a lot of in tournament). Sub's defensive option is an ice clone which is less likely to get blown up than Raiden's defensive option, his teleport, which puts him right next to the opponent. If you don't calculate your teleports correctly you're fucked, sub can just hide behind his clone and use it as bait. I know by now you've discovered you can't exactly turtle beach all the time like you thought you could with Raiden...yet people want to talk like I don't play defensively enough. You have to have the right balance between the two.
You talking about Raiden's falling short at the big majors is more or less you talking about me, so I'll address a few of your points.
For one, several of the majors I went to last year I didn't exactly prepare properly for, on top of not being well schooled in particular matchups. If anything the past year I've pushed past several plateaus, learned various matchups, changed my entire mindset going into tournaments, and identified and corrected my mistakes, it's been a learning experience.
At Dallas who did I lose to? I lost to Scar and Maxter...so I guess that means I'm a garbage player right? Didn't Scar take out CDJR? Maxter needs no explanation. Just about everyone I played in casuals at Dallas (including players considered to be better than me by popular opinion), I went EVEN OR BETTER with. I honestly think this whole mentality of a player is only worth what he is done in tournament is complete and utter bullshit. Playing casuals and playing at a major are two completely different things, and in a sense you have to have good matchup experience and/or the right mentality to do as well in a tournament setting as you do in casuals. But seeing as you are someone who has been doing the tournament thing for the past what? 15 years or whatever? I can see why you think they are the end all be all of someones skill. In the end tournament placings just turn into one giant circle jerk and don't always reflect skill.
Raiden doesn't suck, he is good. However, he is only good when the player knows the matchup, makes little to no mistakes, and knows exactly what he is doing. That covers your #1 and #2.
As for #3 I will agree that he may not be completely fleshed out MATCHUP wise, but I will say that I have him more fleshed out than anyone else and it's going to take a long time for someone with no Raiden experience to reach my level of understanding. Not being cocky just telling it how it is.
I personally don't have a lot of Skarlet experience which is why I played like shit against Scar, and the same could be said about the Raiden Kitana matchup since that matchup has to be played completely differently than any other matchup...so it makes sense why PL Raiden looks good, it was only designed for a few matchups NOT the entire cast.
Anyways I will say my downfalls were I sucked in certain matchups, and the exploration aspect was left to me because who else is there? I also didn't have the right mindset at tournaments so my mentality alone needed adjustment since that's probably the most important aspect of playing Raiden (note the past tense keywords). Also seeing as I've always had to work for my wins and not rely on bullshit, I'd say I'm just as skilled as most of these top 8 placers who have a cakewalk with their characters.
he takes an extreme amount of discipline, an extremely accurate analysis of the opponent, and near mistake free timing and reactions otherwise his whole gameplan is fucked.... to play him properly and win and react right and succeed is a task and im not sure its even possible for any1 to do
At least someone knows what's up. I'm capable of playing him in this fashion but I have to be on that other level in order to do so.
To end this I'll say that I have no idea what my next major will be. I honestly haven't been playing MK much at all, I've been focused mostly on work. I have more important shit to worry about right now than traveling to play a video game. If someone else can top 8 with only Raiden, than more power to you.
