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Cyborg General Discussion Thread

iAteUrLife

iAteUrLife

VinD
Yeah, when I play Cheetah I have to do 1 specific combo and combo ender so I can stuff it with a clean ji1, otherwise it kills all unmetered Oki. Its stupid. Same with Robins sword dance.


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just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
This wouldn't break him at all. His techno tackle and up disrupter are the most useless specials in the game. Im not here to break him in any since of the word. Give the man a neutral I mean every other zoning charater does. This would change that and make up for his stubby limbs in the neutral. Plus he was a gifted beast of a football player. You can't have him whiffing tackles man lol
 
Cursa

Cursa

Counterpoke with armoured DB2 at all times.
Resetting the neutral can be pretty strong in some matchups and it creates a decent amount of distance. MB does about 20% damage which is more than what Bane Bomb MB and Scarecrow's grabs do and has at least decent hit advantage which can be used mid screen to create more distance. It's nearly a half screen grapple. That's a massive footsie tool.
 
just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
Cursa said:
Resetting the neutral can be pretty strong in some matchups and it creates a decent amount of distance. MB does about 20% damage which is more than what Bane Bomb MB and Scarecrow's grabs do and has at least decent hit advantage which can be used mid screen to create more distance. It's nearly a half screen grapple. That's a massive footsie tool.
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Bane and crow have Oki options layers of yomi after there grab in which I'll take that over tackle as the dmg adds up from chip and mix into another grab simply pales in comparison. MB tackle actually lost hit advantage from igau as it use to grant a free TA. Fate has f2 Starfire had neutral and they added a 5050 on top of that and Batman has j2 lol jk.
 
Cursa

Cursa

Counterpoke with armoured DB2 at all times.
Then give Cyborg an advancing mid and not 50/50 tick throws off an advancing command grab if you want a neutral?

Like yeah tackle sucks but an advancing command grab is a huge deal. Like, the amount neutral that gives you is super strong, regardless of whether it gives you oki or not. Of course you can neutral jump it on a read, but that's when you go into stuff like DB1, IA BF1 which is already a pretty common cyborg tool, MB Power fist off of strings instead of tick throws etc.

Not to mention stuff like, for example, you get an air drone on the screen after a knockdown. You can go in for a max range command grab which you now can't jump out of because you'll get anti-aired by a drone. You could delayed wakeup but then no risk to Cyborg, just gives him more time to whatever he wants. Backdash might work but again, free space for him. You could go for a something like wakeup BF3 in the case of Superman but extremely risky and not in his favour at all.

The amount that a mid command grab would open up for a character like Cyborg is bonkers. It does minimal damage and doesn't grant oki but if the opponent is just taking them they'll add up real fast, particularly if you MB them.
 
just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
Cursa said:
Then give Cyborg an advancing mid and not 50/50 tick throws off an advancing command grab if you want a neutral?

Like yeah tackle sucks but an advancing command grab is a huge deal. Like, the amount neutral that gives you is super strong, regardless of whether it gives you oki or not. Of course you can neutral jump it on a read, but that's when you go into stuff like DB1, IA BF1 which is already a pretty common cyborg tool, MB Power fist off of strings instead of tick throws etc.

Not to mention stuff like, for example, you get an air drone on the screen after a knockdown. You can go in for a max range command grab which you now can't jump out of because you'll get anti-aired by a drone. You could delayed wakeup but then no risk to Cyborg, just gives him more time to whatever he wants. Backdash might work but again, free space for him. You could go for a something like wakeup BF3 in the case of Superman but extremely risky and not in his favour at all.

The amount that a mid command grab would open up for a character like Cyborg is bonkers. It does minimal damage and doesn't grant oki but if the opponent is just taking them they'll add up real fast, particularly if you MB them.
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Cyborg can't grab you again after he landed tackle he rolls back so far it whiffs. With no Oki options he can't loop it to keep mowing ppl over with it. I agree his neutral will be better but wouldn't be the overpowered at all. With no limbs to check in the nuetral and nova being slow start up. And easy to jump I honestly don't see it breaking him at all.
 
Cursa

Cursa

Counterpoke with armoured DB2 at all times.
just_2swift said:
Cyborg can't grab you again after he landed tackle he rolls back so far it whiffs. With no Oki options he can't loop it to keep mowing ppl over with it. I agree his neutral will be better but wouldn't be the overpowered at all. With no limbs to check in the nuetral and nova being slow start up. And easy to jump I honestly don't see it breaking him at all.
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The point is if you're in grab range you're in a 50/50 zone now, where the mixup is grab or some sort of button, whether it be a IA projectile, Up Nova blast or whatever you want it to be really. Changes depending on range.

He isn't in range for another grab but you could just take a micro step forward which is basically guaranteed after a MB grab since it's +24 and then you're back in the exact same situation. Counter play is available but Cyborg is also a character who could choose to go back to zoning if he felt like it which is something no grappler can do.

That's not even including all the 50/50s he gets off of his numerous tick throws that he would gain access to.

Just give the man a mid. It solves the problem and doesn't give him 50/50's that he doesn't need them
 
just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
Cursa said:
The point is if you're in grab range you're in a 50/50 zone now, where the mixup is grab or some sort of button, whether it be a IA projectile, Up Nova blast or whatever you want it to be really. Changes depending on range.

He isn't in range for another grab but you could just take a micro step forward which is basically guaranteed after a MB grab since it's +24 and then you're back in the exact same situation. Counter play is available but Cyborg is also a character who could choose to go back to zoning if he felt like it which is something no grappler can do.

That's not even including all the 50/50s he gets off of his numerous tick throws that he would gain access to.

Just give the man a mid. It solves the problem and doesn't give him 50/50's that he doesn't need them
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It's not plus 24 anymore that's the old advantage from igau it's plus but not 24 Making tackle a mid he still wouldn't be top tier they gave Starfire a 50 50 grab and she's not tearing up the scene she's a better zoner with better tools. Or a mid would be nice but tackle being a high is buns. Making it an overhead would be nice but making it a mid would be all he needs to compete.
 
Marinjuana

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
I don't know what's so hard to understand about Cyborg not needing a mid command grab with good range and invincibility frames on wakeup. It fundamentally goes against the design of the character. The simple fact that it would be a wakeup mid command grab should be enough for people to realize that.

Starfire received one extra mixup with high risk and low reward off of her f2 high. It's not remotely comparable to what you are asking for. You want your character to have multiple tick throws, a stupid wakeup game and a neutral where he can just throw out long range command grab when he doesn't feel like using his zoning tools. Not to mention all of the plus frames this character has already. That would be fun to deal with.
 
just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
Marinjuana said:
I don't know what's so hard to understand about Cyborg not needing a mid command grab with good range and invincibility frames on wakeup. It fundamentally goes against the design of the character. The simple fact that it would be a wakeup mid command grab should be enough for people to realize that.

Starfire received one extra mixup with high risk and low reward off of her f2 high. It's not remotely comparable to what you are asking for. You want your character to have multiple tick throws, a stupid wakeup game and a neutral where he can just throw out long range command grab when he doesn't feel like using his zoning tools. Not to mention all of the plus frames this character has already. That would be fun to deal with.
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Exactly.
 
just_2swift

just_2swift

MK1 is the best MK period.
Marinjuana said:
I don't know what's so hard to understand about Cyborg not needing a mid command grab with good range and invincibility frames on wakeup. It fundamentally goes against the design of the character. The simple fact that it would be a wakeup mid command grab should be enough for people to realize that.

Starfire received one extra mixup with high risk and low reward off of her f2 high. It's not remotely comparable to what you are asking for. You want your character to have multiple tick throws, a stupid wakeup game and a neutral where he can just throw out long range command grab when he doesn't feel like using his zoning tools. Not to mention all of the plus frames this character has already. That would be fun to deal with.
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She has nuetral he doesn't. bottom line I could care less about her 5050 it's the fact they gave her a layer to her neutral. Lol nova blast in the nuetral.
 
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