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Community Concerns Regarding NEC '13

Axel_Redd

Vampire Jesus....he wants YOUR blood now!!
i only notice a bit of choppiness in my mk occasionally when i first start it up, but other than that, it usually smoothes out shortly after and plays just fine :). And thats only when i first start it up, after 1 match its usually fine.
 

Konqrr

MK11 Kabal = MK9 Kitana
GGA Soonk, I wholeheartedly agree with your post, thank you.

We use PS3 mostly in casuals and certain stages lag and slowdown hardcore. It pisses me off in casuals and if it happened in a tournament match, I would be furious.

Nearly 100% of my fighting games are purchased and played on the Xbox 360. Why? Because they work and play better on that system.
Also, the ONLY fighting games that I have on the PS3 are MKAK, Skullgirls (free PSN points used lol), and MK9. This is because I have friends who do not have the Xbox versions, and so I can play the MKII/UMK3 people on PSN.

Laggy stream station issue happened at EVO and it wasn't until Daigo said something that they changed it out. I think this was in 2009. Absolutely ridiculous.

As for the video splitting, that in itself doesn't cause lag unless you have a bad device, the feed is broadcast to all ports simultaneously. I've never had an issue in our local tournaments with the stream/recording equipment.

The bracket situation where people were added after on-site reg was closed is ABSOLUTELY UNFORGIVABLE. In no situation should this have happened. When I heard about the Noobe EVO situation, I flipped out and complained, but the EVO staff said that that didn't happen... wtf?

If I spend hundreds of dollars to go to a tournament (or someone spends it on me to be there), I make it my mission to know everything there is to know about where to be and when. If I showed up 7 hours late not registered, I would not even think to ask to be put in and if someone offered to put me in the bracket, I would gracefully decline.
 
My thoughts on the bracket making and event in general.

The thing is you do need the mix of old school tournament players who are great T.O for running the event but you also need people who are in the scene currently to seed players properly. After this event , I think the people who ran it or helped in some way are still great people who should run events in the future but some adjustments might have to be made with the players who determine who is top seeded and who isn't. It is hard to determine who is right for the job because people have their own ideas on what determines skill and what doesn't but the person has to be chosen properly to avoid problems in the event.

I felt the seeding in my pool was due to the lack of connection some T.O's and players had with the scene and thus the seeding was done the way it was. CRUM yes, no player should get an easy path and I have proven numerous times that I can battle through adversity to place well but seeding based on accomplishments need to be taken into consideration. When you look at the full results of the tournament after it is all said and done, you should be like "Everyone who is better than me today placed higher than me and everyone who I outplaced, I have proven to be better than".

Alot of players use these placements to determine where they currently stand in the community. Sure the improper seeding might not affect the two best players in the pool but it drastically affects other players IN THAT SAME POOL. In the tournament , me and 16bit were on the same side along with seven while swift had natas and trepound. I don't mean this any disrespectful manner but having swift on the other side and not me is something I did not know about but It is something I strongly don't agree with. Furthermore , I put seven early in losers and then was put shortly in losers by 16bit. Then at WF 16bit put swift into losers and had to wait while everyone else battled it out. After beating Darknatas, I had to play seven who suprised me by beating trepound and also gave me a tough challenge twice. Then I convincingly beat SwiftTomHanks to make it out. Now looking at the results Swift is above seven and therefore has performed better then seven. I am sorry but that was not the case in this pool. I honestly feel if the seeding was done properly seven would have played swift, Swift would have been out earlier. I honestly think seven was the 3rd best in that pool and it doesn't show that in the tournament results. This is the main discrepancy that was caused in that pool. I honeslty feel that seven should be placed 17th at the end of the day. This has happened at other grass roots tourneys AND EVEN MORE OF A PROBLEM AT MLG.

I do not mean any disrespect to Dark Rob and Swift because they are my friends and I still think they along with the rest of the old school east coast should run events. I am simply stating an example of how small things can lead to big problems. For anyone thinking about not traveling to an East Coast major because of this, please don't let this one thing affect you. These guys put on a great event and have always gone out of their way to run the event smoothly. There were also many great things that came out of this event and we have these guys to thank for it.

Along with the Riu48 situation, there is nothing wrong with having riu48 play in the last pool aslong it was planned properly with the right seeding which unfortunately it wasn't. Even though me and my canadian friend Death were affected by losing to Riu48, I can't be mad because my friend got the chance to prove that he is still the most accomplished sonya and another friend (insuperable) got to show that he can beat some of the best around by upsetting both krazyie and Riu48. It is moments like these that every player hopes to showcase when they go to tournaments and it is a feeling that you have to experience to truly appreciate. It is not right to break tournament rules and affect everyone for the few but I hope you guys can understand why some T.O make these tough decisions for players and break the rules to accommodate them. Just showing you another side of the story is all.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
All in all Im sick to death of this community, its elitism, its gimme gimme, serve me, cater to me, be at my beck and call, when I want, how I want attitude. We broke our asses for you guys for two days straight, brought tons and tons of gear that we spent our own money on, ran two streams simultaniously the whole time plus recorded matches on yet another station(Thank you Pherleece :) ) and because of a few problems that were beyond our control, and because people want to jump to conclusions rather than ask us whats going on, we are gonna get blown up and shit on for all the hard work we did solely for you guys and to try and give you the best tournament we could.
<3

Maaaaaaaaaaaan...
 

Konqrr

MK11 Kabal = MK9 Kitana
I just read the post by Tom Brady explaining the Riu48 situation. Thank you.

However, the ONLY way he should have been entered in the bracket is if he had registered beforehand. Just because he might not be able to make it and doesn't want to be out any money if he can't is bullshit. You reg and get put in the bracket or you don't and watch everyone else play.

I also want to state that I hold no ill feelings toward the TOs for NEC running MK. This is an extremely overwhelming and unrewarding job. Outside of the issues brought up in this thread, mostly to the late entrants, they did a fantastic job.
 

GGA soonk

ĜĞÅ §ººñ|<®©™
I think there's a slight misconception here that I'm pointing fingers. As PL and Slips both know, all of my concerns apply to every tournament. The details I mentioned about this weekend are just that: details. They are merely examples of real issues that apply everywhere. My goal with this thread is to make the community aware and to start working towards solutions.

I'm working on a lagless stream setup for everybody and I've submitted my seeding/pool making idea to pig. Schedule efficiency and bracket integrity is on the TOs and holding TOs accountable is on the community.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I think there's a slight misconception here that I'm pointing fingers. As PL and Slips both know, all of my concerns apply to every tournament. The details I mentioned about this weekend are just that: details. They are merely examples of real issues that apply everywhere. My goal with this thread is to make the community aware and to start working towards solutions.
It's fair to speak about pains from every tournament.. However you specifically called this entire tournament 'terrible', which is insulting to all of the people that worked very hard for weeks to make it come together.

Hopefully everyone is starting to get back on track -- but just be aware that stating it in that way creates a butthurt firestorm of unnecessary hurt feelings that ends up pushing some of the hardest workers, and the people who sacrifice the most to make events like this happen, out of our community for good.

It's ok to disagree with how people do things -- just be careful how you say it.
 

GGA soonk

ĜĞÅ §ººñ|<®©™
I'm sorry that we had a terrible time and were honest about it. Instead of just not going back, I'm trying to address and resolve the issues we constantly face at tournaments. If I cared what others thought of the things I said, this post would have never been made, and nothing would change.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Who should make the brackets for grass roots?
This is gonna seem like a completely ridiculous suggestion, but...shit, if you guys want for Winter Brawl, I'll do it.

If there's one thing this weekend taught me, it's that I don't have enough time in the space of my life to get to the same astronomically high level as the Reo's and Dominicans of the world. And I don't really care as much as I thought I would when taking into account that I love the community and just being a part of the madness more than I love the competition itself.

Seriously.
I practically live on TYM, I know/know of every top player the community has, where they're from, who they play, how they stack up in comparison to one another, and I have no allegiances/clanmates/ties to anyone specifically except TYM itself, and I don't think anyone who knows me doubts that all I want is the best tournament we can possibly put on.
So if you guys - Phil, Rob, Shock, Summoning, all of you who'll be running the gamut for WB - will give me the honor...if what's gonna solve the problem and give EVERYONE peace of mind - at least for WB7 if not for other shows but we'll figure that out later - is a neutral party to build neutral, worry-free, well-plotted pools and brackets to provide for a gargantuanly awesome show, then I'll save myself an ass-kicking and volunteer.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
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So if you guys - Phil, Rob, Shock, Summoning, all of you who'll be running the gamut for WB - will give me the honor...if what's gonna solve the problem and give EVERYONE peace of mind - at least for WB7 if not for other shows but we'll figure that out later - is a neutral party to build neutral, worry-free, well-plotted pools and brackets to provide for a gargantuanly awesome show, then I'll save myself an ass-kicking and volunteer.
As much as I respect your knowledge of the community and appreciate you as a person, I disagree with this.. I think the only fair way to solve this problem is to base this off 2 things:

1) Actual tourney results
2) Geographic placement

It's easy enough to set this up based on actual data without 1 person calling all the shots.. And I think that as long as you keep trying to rely on X person or Y person to put who they think are the top players in X/Y pool or Z seed, you'll run into the same kinds of issues.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
As much as I respect your knowledge of the community, I disagree with this.. I think the only fair way to solve this problem is to base this off 2 things:

1) Actual results
2) Geographic placement

It's easy enough to set this up based on actual data without 1 person calling all the shots.. And I think that as long as you keep trying to rely on X person or Y person to put who they think are the top players in X/Y pool or Z seed, you'll run into the same kinds of issues.
No, I agree complete. That's exactly what I'd set out to achieve.
As in, if they said "Hey, you're in," today, I'd be making a thread soon after to start scouting for who's gonna be on hand for it, taking note of everyone entering/registering and their locations/stats, consult accordingly with other neutral heads as far as judgements in the event I get stuck on a choice, etc...
I know it seems like a risky idea, and it's no sweat off my soul if they handle it elsewhere, but I'm telling you, I could do it.
And for lack of less vulgar expressions, it would give you guys a boner.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
No, I agree complete. That's exactly what I'd set out to achieve.
As in, if they said "Hey, you're in," today, I'd be making a thread soon after to start scouting for who's gonna be on hand for it, taking note of everyone entering/registering and their locations/stats, consult accordingly with other neutral heads as far as judgements in the event I get stuck on a choice, etc...
I know it seems like a risky idea, and it's no sweat off my soul if they handle it elsewhere, but I'm telling you, I could do it.
And for lack of less vulgar expressions, it would give you guys a boner.
Hehe, I feel you -- but the thing is, the system to do this correctly is already being built.. I just need to make sure that it's filled with all of the necessary info to work correctly. I've been working on it for some weeks at this point. When it's complete it'll solve the problem not just for 1 tournament, but for tournaments in general.

----------

On another note, unrelated to Box's comment: as far as finding the One Setup to Rule Them All, I don't think everyone is going to buy exactly the same equipment for every tournament. I think the best thing to do is to find 3-4 diff. combinations of pieces of equipment that work (monitors/converters/splitters), and to also verify which setups are problematic and should be avoided. And for those 3-4 setups, make sure that everyone knows the optimal settings for each piece to minimize the lag.

That way people have choices, won't have to buy all new equipment, and can work with whatever sponsorships they have.

And it'll help standardize things so that TO's won't have to ask "Which mode should this monitor be in?" every time they setup a station, regardless of which brand of monitor they're using.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Hehe, I feel you -- but the thing is, the system to do this correctly is already being built.. I just need to make sure that it's filled with all of the necessary info to work correctly. I've been working on it for some weeks at this point. When it's complete it'll solve the problem not just for 1 tournament, but for tournaments in general.

----------

On another note, unrelated to Box's comment: as far as finding the One Setup to Rule Them All, I don't think everyone is going to buy exactly the same equipment for every tournament. I think the best thing to do is to find 3-4 diff. combinations of pieces of equipment that work (monitors/converters/splitters), and to also verify which setups are problematic and should be avoided. And for those 3-4 setups, make sure that everyone knows the optimal settings for each piece to minimize the lag.

That way people have choices, won't have to buy all new equipment, and can work with whatever sponsorships they have.
Agreed completely. Know what works, know what doesn't.
Just wish this shit wasn't so damn expensive >_<.
 

AREZ God of War

The Crazy BeastMaster
I swear to God when I was just reading the picture of the brackets I was thinking where is Arez name? Then i saw your post. BTW we had some good casual UMK games. Didn't have a chance to say peace out (had to leave quick) but good games and nice meeting you in person.
AREZ I did see you on the paper pools. Idk why you weren't on there.
Yeah, I thought Arez was in my pool.
Much apprecation to all of you who have kept me in your thoughts and considered my feelings on the matters at hand. There WILL be some shoutouts but unfortunately the length of it will be only for a select few individuals that made my weekend pleasurable, not collectively as a group.

I also myself left in a hurry due to my lost track of time, however I will take the time to give each and every person I wanted to have an official good bye with via telephone or PM if phoning is not an option, and i also apologize to you for leaving so abruptly.

If you don't hear from me it's because I don't have anything to say to you.
 

EdFig81

Original OBS mbr/VSM/G4S
I never thought it was rigged (Arez) not being on the bracket picture but i did just notice it. At least the website picture didn't include his name which was more then likely a typo.
 

AREZ God of War

The Crazy BeastMaster
View attachment 2970
Yea. Definitely there.
I seen that too, and when you consider I been planning for this for over 6 MONTHS and I have promoted NECXIII EASILY MORE THAN ANY OTHER MEMBER (not shouting, just putting emphasis, Goldie :)), you can clearly see how many people considered the importance of even including me at all.

Does ANYONE know of another person who started on this whole NECXIII-hype/promoting before AREZ God of War?

Why was everything in regards to me last minute? It's like I had to pull teth just to get registered.....in ALL 4 gmes everytime. Maybe I shoulda showed-up at 6PM on Sunday, gotten thrown into a bracket last minute and I would have gotten treated better.

And just so everyone knows, when i got DQ'd Sunday morning for being a few minutes late or whatever these people were crying about , that was when i quit my Staff position, so that's why I didn't play or participate. You wanna treat one of your own like that?


Seriously. Do everything yourselves. You want me to brush it off? I'm brushing YOUS off like the specks of dust you are to me.
 

IKizzLE

BloodHound
I'm not even close to a top player, I'm just a player who loves the game and wants to support it. In 2011, I went to every tournament within a 10 hour drive of me:
East Coast Throwdown
Civil War
Summer Jam
A few Console Combats
etc.

And the OP brings up some really good points. Nearly every tournament I went to, it was very chaotic, and never finished even close to on time. I once sat in a hotel hallway for 12 hours without playing a single game.

The only reason I comment on this is because I believe it is a barrier to growing the offline community--I stopped going to tournaments because of some of these reasons. I imagine anyone who isn't a top player or know a lot of people would also be detered from going--it's tough to sit by yourself, not able to play for hours on end, even though you showed up on time and did everything that was asked of you. It isn't being ungrateful or anything of the sort--if I drove a distance to get there, payed my event and entree fee, showed up on time, but was disappointed that I had to sit for hours without playing--that isn't being ungrateful, it's disappointment.

Getting to the point: there are reasons people do things, and that includes attending tournaments. For top players, I think we can say that they at least attend because they have a very good chance of placing well (and this includes a financial incentive in addition to the fun/happiness of placing well). This doesn't change because of the issues described in the OPs post.

For players that attend for fun or to support the community, including those that are not social butterflies, it will be tough for them to continue to attend events when not only are they getting bodied, but they are giving their entire day, and possibly their weekend, paying for hotel rooms, etc. to basically have a DMV experience of sitting for hours, not having much fun, and paying money to do so. Also, sometimes you cannot get in casuals before the tournament starts, and if you practice on a lag free set up, and your matches are on a laggy set up, you have to in your first match without practice adjust on-the-fly. Maybe your opponent is in a similar situation, hopefully so, but you'll never know and it will certainly stick in your mind.

Now you can say screw them, who cares if they attend, but that's my point--if tournaments only want hardcore FGC players then they don't need to do a thing, but if you want new blood, I think something will need done to make it easier for them to attend. In most of the tournaments I attended, I at least made it a few rounds in and even then it was still a lot of money and wasted time to attend--I cannot imagine how the person who went 0-2 in the last pool feels.

For those that put on tournaments, I assure you the community appreciates your dedication to the game they play. Though, I'll draw this anology:

Your girlfriend spent 10 hours making a feast for dinner (maybe Thanksgiving), but not everything tasted so great. Do I appreciate her thinking of me and making me dinner? Of course. But does her dedication change the fact that the food tastes awful? No. And I bet 9 out of 10 times, the girlfriend would want you to tell her you didn't like it, so that she adjust what didn't come out so well.

Luckily for me, it was just a tournament for a video game, so I just decided to stop attending, but hopefully my point isn't lost.
Best post in the entire topic.

Edit, best post was slips followed by Arez God of War.
Then this.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
I seen that too, and when you consider I been planning for this for over 6 MONTHS and I have promoted NECXIII EASILY MORE THAN ANY OTHER MEMBER (not shouting, just putting emphasis, Goldie :)), you can clearly see how many people considered the importance of even including me at all.

Does ANYONE know of another person who started on this whole NECXIII-hype/promoting before AREZ God of War?

Why was everything in regards to me last minute? It's like I had to pull teth just to get registered.....in ALL 4 gmes everytime. Maybe I shoulda showed-up at 6PM on Sunday, gotten thrown into a bracket last minute and I would have gotten treated better.

And just so everyone knows, when i got DQ'd Sunday morning for being a few minutes late or whatever these people were crying about , that was when i quit my Staff position, so that's why I didn't play or participate. You wanna treat one of your own like that?


Seriously. Do everything yourselves. You want me to brush it off? I'm brushing YOUS off like the specks of dust you are to me.
So im not following

Were you allowed to play or were you removed or what?
 

AREZ God of War

The Crazy BeastMaster
why

btw to answer your original post the first person to EVER talk about nec is you

Its appreciated
If I knew why i was DQ'd, I'd tell you but like I said, we wait for "celebrity players" for close to an hour or more, but when someone like me who Staffs and has slept a total of 4 hours Friday night and ONE hour Saturday night doesn't make it in the MK room MIND YOU, which was last minute cuz we all "randomly" found out that we were getting kicked out of th4e MK room at Midnight.....I, a STAFF gets DQ'd for being 10-15 minutes late.....but we got people coming and going as they please and it's ok because they are high-level players or "popular in the kommunity"???


REALLY? Call me crazy, but I just don't think that's how things are supposed to be done in the real world.

On top of all that, IF I knew we were getting kicke dout at midnight, I would have never came to this tournament in the 1st fucking place, so thanks to whomever for waiting until 11:30 Saturday night to tell us that MINOR little detail after we already wasted our time going to this piece of shit.

I had so much fun Saturday night, I didn't think it was HUMANLY POSSIBLE to ruin it after that, but like always, my faith in humanity is reinforced that no matter how much planning is done, people can fuck everything up in the blink of an eye.