Cetrion General Discussion Thread

[SaltShaker]

keep in mind those are incomplete too. the jax one is missing moves so expect every slot to be filled out

Yea the theory is that the ones that are incomplete are missing a slot, not that the ones currently listed are inaccurate. Like the for Jax, his two variations were where one was exactly the same as the Kast, and the other was two of the same and one missing (the third slot shown in the Kast). The only reason we know that third slot move is because we saw the Kast, but everything lined up perfectly. When looking at the characters used at the event today, all variations were exactly the same as the leak barring missing slots. So it seems the only mystery would be guessing the third slot move on variations that have two from the leak. In Cetrion's case though, Wind Shield and Water Geyser are both two slots so it's a good chance those are hers.

That's the theory anyway lol, but it does seem to be hold some truth given the circumstances. I don't know much about Boulder Delay, but in theory I would like that a lot. The rest of the moves would be obvious levels of greatness.

 

[Obly]

So if the leak variations hold true (at this point it seems legit) we will have-

Variation A- Cyclone and Wind Shield
Variation B- Boulder Toss Delay and Water Geyser.

I would be very, very, very happy with this outcome.

Hrmmm... assuming these are the final presets... I'm pretty discouraged to not have her ground pound or teleport to use; those felt extremely useful.

Mixed feelings about A. I like the Cyclone but would rather have skipped all auras unless the costs are reduced. But of the four, Wind probably does have the most utility.

Variation B is a total mystery? I assume Water Geyser is the geyser-like move we saw in the trailer? Looked good, but what are its properties? And no idea at all what Boulder Toss Delay is; that must not have been shown at all.

Your enthusiasm makes me more optimistic though...

 

[SaltShaker]

Hrmmm... assuming these are the final presets... I'm pretty discouraged to not have her ground pound or teleport to use; those felt extremely useful.

Mixed feelings about A. I like the Cyclone but would rather have skipped all auras unless the costs are reduced. But of the four, Wind probably does have the most utility.

Variation B is a total mystery? I assume Water Geyser is the geyser-like move we saw in the trailer? Looked good, but what are its properties? And no idea at all what Boulder Toss Delay is; that must not have been shown at all.

Your enthusiasm makes me more optimistic though...

Don't take it as golden yet as we're still just in assumption mode (Day 1 Patch can blow the whole thing up). Though the evidence is looking pretty strong now. The leak matching the listings other than slot gaps is pretty big. They'd have to have actually adjusted the variations since the leak for the patch, which would probably be unlikely this late. Anything is possible though. With that being said,

Yea Cyclone appears to be really solid. I do hear you on the auras though. I think we're on the same page in regards to cost/reward with them. 2 slots for 7 seconds of usage draining both D Bars as slow as break? Situational. Against the non-teleport characters the Cyclone+Wind+Core Specials might be devastating for late round ranged pressure. Would probably be my secondary MU specific variation against the Sonya/Jacqui/Johnny's of the world early on because I prefer variation B on paper.

Water Geyser is the move from the trailer, and according to the description on the move it's a low. The startup was very fast, so it's unreactable, and it lifts them up for damage giving you time to set up. It was the only special of hers that had quick startup like that, so that alone is worth the two slots. The similarity would appear to be something like Ermac/Raven grab or Aquaman FTD. Hopefully it isn't super negative on block where you get punished by tele on block reaction (though for two slots I doubt that is the case). That paired with her moveset would probably be all I'd ask for. With Boulder Delay, it's a bit more iffy. Can you cancel the Delay? How long can you hold the delay? Can you switch between regular/air boulder? Too many questions to make an assumption on it until we see it in action. Wish it was Ground and Pound but hopefully we see something impressive.

Yea I'm hype. Mainly because there are a couple of doom pairings floating out there for some characters and I was hoping so badly to avoid a garbage set for one of the two variations. I didn't think they would use Water Geyser, and I thought they would have auras in both variations which I am strongly against. If we end up with these two we'll have dodged a bullet.

 

[PLAYING TO WIN]

I’ll be on the cetrion wagon to start. One of the ones that I like.

 

[PLAYING TO WIN]

Also the wind variation could be super strong vs low mobility characters.

Jade worries me. I hope the rock is a physical attack and hits it like skarlet tentacle.

 

[SaltShaker]

I’ll be on the cetrion wagon to start. One of the ones that I like.

Oh hell yea! Let's get it!!

Also the wind variation could be super strong vs low mobility characters.

Jade worries me. I hope the rock is a physical attack and hits it like skarlet tentacle.

Yea I agree, it'll be vicious in some of those MUs. Can likely cause lots of frustration and high risks trying to get in.

Same on Jade. Or at least the Vine Grab or Water Geyser. Since both Tentacle and Siphon both hit her in glow I'm hoping one of these is a check.

 

[StormGoddess]

Spoiler: SKINS-alts

 

[Obly]

Spoiler: SKINS-alts

Whew... smoking hot (some of them literally)! She looks great. Not sure exactly the difference between 'mortal', 'elder', and 'mythic' skins--but I assume that has to do with rarity (and how much it'll cost me to buy one). Oh NRS, always gotta up-sell us on the style points...

EDIT: Do we know what her three customizable gear pieces are? Definitely crown and halo, but not sure about the third?

 

[SaltShaker]

So we have the official Tournament Mode variations-

Cetrion

1. Force of Nature: Earthquake, Delay Boulder Bash, Shattering Boulder
2. Spring Cleaning: H2 POrt, Geyser (2)

Not a fan of Teleport, love Geyser. Shattering Boulder is the move that is like MMH Orb, where it comes out and then explodes in proximity. I'll know a lot very soon so I'll be able to add some details to this stuff and test some things. Very interesting that they decided to go with these. What are your thoughts?

@PLAYING TO WIN @Obly @Baconlord @AnyoneElse

 

[PLAYING TO WIN]

So we have the official Tournament Mode variations-

Cetrion

1. Force of Nature: Earthquake, Delay Boulder Bash, Shattering Boulder
2. Spring Cleaning: H2 POrt, Geyser (2)

Not a fan of Teleport, love Geyser. Shattering Boulder is the move that is like MMH Orb, where it comes out and then explodes in proximity. I'll know a lot very soon so I'll be able to add some details to this stuff and test some things. Very interesting that they decided to go with these. What are your thoughts?

@PLAYING TO WIN @Obly @Baconlord @AnyoneElse

will reserve all judgement until i see it. but if the tele is like skarlet's (free get out of the corner, MB for an away teleport thats more than dash distance) then it could be very strong vs low mobility characters.

so it appears the day 1 patch changed the variations? i though she had one with the wind thing and tornado

 

[JBeezYBabY]

She's my style of character but im worried her cool moves are locked out of the 2 variations. She will be one of the first I try. Sadly....people are already saying she's looking hella low tier. Until then, I am reserving my judgement and anticipation of this character until then.

 

[SaltShaker]

will reserve all judgement until i see it. but if the tele is like skarlet's (free get out of the corner, MB for an away teleport thats more than dash distance) then it could be very strong vs low mobility characters.

so it appears the day 1 patch changed the variations? i though she had one with the wind thing and tornado

Yea the Day 1 patch launched, probably because the game went out to the reviewers now, and updated the variations and variation names. Didn't think about a MB Tele, that would definitely be nice with her setup.

R.I.P. Cyclone, it was never allowed to live...

She's my style of character but im worried her cool moves are locked out of the 2 variations. She will be one of the first I try. Sadly....people are already saying she's looking hella low tier. Until then, I am reserving my judgement and anticipation of this character until then.

Never let anyone say a character is any tier this early. It's all a wash until we've actually played a considerable amount of time. Countless times characters are "low tier" but then appear to be one of the best, and vice versa. Don't let it sway you this early.

 

[Baconlord]

Fun fact. People who got mkx early said raiden was low tier. Just putting that out there

 

[Baconlord]

So we have the official Tournament Mode variations-

Cetrion

1. Force of Nature: Earthquake, Delay Boulder Bash, Shattering Boulder
2. Spring Cleaning: H2 POrt, Geyser (2)

Not a fan of Teleport, love Geyser. Shattering Boulder is the move that is like MMH Orb, where it comes out and then explodes in proximity. I'll know a lot very soon so I'll be able to add some details to this stuff and test some things. Very interesting that they decided to go with these. What are your thoughts?

@PLAYING TO WIN @Obly @Baconlord @AnyoneElse

I'm really glad that the variations aren't just built around the buffs. I'd much rather have extra utility over a wind tunnel that burns my meter

 

[SaltShaker]

I'm really glad that the variations aren't just built around the buffs. I'd much rather have extra utility over a wind tunnel that burns my meter

Yea I think we lucked out. With only two variations to work with, it would have been a bummer for one of them to be restricted like that. At least this way we have more options for sure.

 

[JBeezYBabY]

Yea the Day 1 patch launched, probably because the game went out to the reviewers now, and updated the variations and variation names. Didn't think about a MB Tele, that would definitely be nice with her setup.

R.I.P. Cyclone, it was never allowed to live...



Never let anyone say a character is any tier this early. It's all a wash until we've actually played a considerable amount of time. Countless times characters are "low tier" but then appear to be one of the best, and vice versa. Don't let it sway you this early.

Oh i know that part. Just saying other ppl's speculations. But that cyclone move.....i knew that move didnt seem tournament viable.

 

[Obly]

So we have the official Tournament Mode variations-

Cetrion

1. Force of Nature: Earthquake, Delay Boulder Bash, Shattering Boulder
2. Spring Cleaning: H2 POrt, Geyser (2)

Not a fan of Teleport, love Geyser. Shattering Boulder is the move that is like MMH Orb, where it comes out and then explodes in proximity. I'll know a lot very soon so I'll be able to add some details to this stuff and test some things. Very interesting that they decided to go with these. What are your thoughts?

Hmmm... interesting! Well, for one thing, I'm pretty happy to see none of the auras. That suggests that maybe NRS's own testing showed they weren't viable at their current cost, and they want to take some time to re-evaluate and make changes (hope, hope).

1. Very happy to see her ground pound, as I think she needs that low since they turned vine grab into a mid, and it's probably her best move against standing teleporters. Don't know anything about the delay move yet.

And ok, I remember seeing a pop-up shattering boulder move in her trailer. I assume it's got a close, medium, and far version? It's got to have something unique about it... pop-up for combo on MB, maybe? Good size hitbox (for AAs)?

2. I'm pretty happy to see her teleport as well. Like Raiden's, it looks quite fast and I think you can burn defensive meter to change where you go (far from the opponent, right in front of them, in place). I think it can help her escape some nasty pressure or setups. And definitely interested to play with that geyser.

But yeah, I'm bummed to lose the Cyclone... it looked really good. Hopefully it won't be long until we get a third variant.

She's my style of character but im worried her cool moves are locked out of the 2 variations. She will be one of the first I try. Sadly....people are already saying she's looking hella low tier. Until then, I am reserving my judgement and anticipation of this character until then.

People like to offer their opinions about all sorts of things, even when they have no friggin' clue what they're talking about. There's no way anyone can know if she's low-tier yet--no one's had any time to learn how to play her. I'm going to stay cautiously optimistic for now. The signs are hopeful!

 

[BowTheDeceitful]

Surprised nobody put this in here yet.

Got it early, anything you wanna know? (Non story related)

Are you charging for combos like the fuckwad of TYM is doing ?Question mark?

testyourmight.com

 

[SaltShaker]

@esports1452 thanks for taking the time to respond man!! Since pretty much no one is covering her anywhere, the main questions we have for Cetrion were-

-What are the frames on her special moves, and if possible strings and pokes (though if that takes too long specials will do, a quick comment on if her strings look very negative or not).
-What does "Shattering Boulder" and "Delay Boulder Dash" do? Do they have MB versions that do something? Can you MB teleport?
-Does the Fire Beam move recover quickly on block?
-Do any of her specials hit Jade during her glow?
-What are her Krushing Blows?

If you can help with these questions I'd (we'd) be super appreciative!!!

Tagging for visibility @PLAYING TO WIN @Baconlord @Obly

 

[esports1452]

edits:
Clarified the Boulder Bash section to highlight that the default (non-cancellable, non-delayable) rock throws are not variation specific.
Added answers to some follow-up questions.


db1 (2 directions), Natural Barrier, mid
12s 25a 12r +15 -15
Krushing Blow: projectile destroyed while summoning wall
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

df1 (3 directions on ground and 3 in air), Hell's Wrath (what you call "Fire Beam"), mid
24 6 33 +18 -12
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

db4, Tendril Pull (Vine Grab), mid
28 11 41 +11 (kd) -35
Krushing Blow: opponent blocks late
DOES hit during Dodging Shadows

db2, Bouncing Boulder (diagonally down), mid
48 +38 +3
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

bf2, Boulder Bash (horizontal), unblockable (in air)
46 +65 (kd)
Krushing Blow: projectile hits by itself
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows in the air

There is some discrepancy with the frame data and the numbers displayed by the built-in frame data tool but this should give a decent first impression.
Here are the block advantages of all her default strings: -2 -8 -12 -4 -11 -1 -5 -9 -10 -9 -5. Not sure how much that tells you, considering that even the character specific tutorial modes are not consistent in what is considered "safe" or not but there is not a single 0 or better string in there, so ...

other Krushing Blows:
d2, counter/punish high attack
toward throw, opponent failed throw escape during previous throw
213 (h,m,o +35 -9), counter/punish

Tournament variation 1 ("Force of Nature"):
Shattering Boulder replaces Natural Barrier and summons a rock at head level instead. Launches on hit. Amplify to shatter boulder for a wider horizontal hitbox.
Delayed Boulder Bash allows the default rock throws (horizontally above head level and diagonally down) to be delayed, cancelled and switched horizontally/diagonally after inputting one or the other (they have different inputs, bf2/db2). Cannot be amplified.

Tournament variation 2 ("Spring Cleaning"):
The teleport ("H2 P0rt"), du (behind), dub (in front), dud (in place), duf (far) can be done in air, cannot be amplified.

I will update the original tournament variation post with a link to this comment:
https://testyourmight.com/threads/spoiler-thread-people-officially-have-the-game-already-no-story-spoilers.69013/page-45#post-2481068

 

[SaltShaker]

db1 (2 directions), Natural Barrier, mid
12s 25a 12r +15 -15
Krushing Blow: projectile destroyed while summoning wall
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

df1 (3 directions on ground and 3 in air), Hell's Wrath (what you call "Fire Beam"), mid
24 6 33 +18 -12
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

db4, Tendril Pull, mid
28 11 41 +11 (kd) -35
Krushing Blow: opponent blocks late
DOES hit during Dodging Shadows

There is some discrepancy with the frame data and the numbers displayed by the built-in frame data tool but this should give a decent first impression.
Here are the block advantages of all her default strings: -2 -8 -12 -4 -11 -1 -5 -9 -10 -9 -5. Not sure how much that tells you, considering that even the character specific tutorial modes are not consistent in what is considered "safe" or not but there is not a single 0 or better string in there, so ...

other Krushing Blows:
d2, counter/punish high attack
toward throw, opponent failed throw escape during previous throw
213 (h,m,o +35 -9), counter/punish

Tournament variation 1 ("Force of Nature"):
Shattering Boulder replaces Natural Barrier and summons a rock at head level instead. Launches on hit. Amplify to shatter boulder for a wider horizontal hitbox.
Delayed Boulder Bash gives access to the rock throw, horizontally above head level and diagonally down. Different inputs (bf2, db2) but ability to cancel, delay and switch horizontally/diagonally after inputting. Cannot be amplified.

Tournament variation 2 ("Spring Cleaning"):
The teleport ("H2 P0rt"), du (behind), dub (in front), dud (in place), duf (far) can be done in air, cannot be amplified.

I will update the original tournament variation post with a link to this comment:
https://testyourmight.com/threads/spoiler-thread-people-officially-have-the-game-already-no-story-spoilers.69013/page-45#post-2481068

You're doing the Elder Gods work, thank you!!!

Dang, these frames don't look too encouraging lol. Hopefully she doesn't end up too unsafe or too high risk to compete. Seems like you can get full combo punished for some things a bit easier than most characters with lots of slower start up.. Her D4 might be a good low profile so hopefully that can play as a good dictator with those low negative numbers and walk back options. Gonna need something up close if those are the frames.

At least the Vine Grab hits Jade's Glow, might be able to catch her on a good read or recovery if she doesn't block right away. Wonder if Water Geyser hits it too then, likely. That placement teleport without having to AMP and also in the air was a very pleasant surprise. Shattering Boulder sounds like some real MMH stuff. If it's something they have to respect it can help open up the other spacing tools much better. Going to do a lot of testing with that. That is exactly what I was hoping Delay Boulder would do, and how it would work so another good surprise there.

All in all this makes me feel a bit better, and gives me tons of ideas to theorycraft in my head.

 

[bigmiracle]

Surprised that the boulder is not baseline. Those frames don't look good at all, but i hope her zoning is really strong.

 

[SaltShaker]

Surprised that the boulder is not baseline. Those frames don't look good at all, but i hope her zoning is really strong.

Yea regular boulders are base moves. Delay Boulder is the buffed version that is in one of the variations.

I agree with you on the frames though, everything I have heard/seen about them isn't too awe-inspiring, but hoping her game can compensate it.

 

[PLAYING TO WIN]

db1 (2 directions), Natural Barrier, mid
12s 25a 12r +15 -15
Krushing Blow: projectile destroyed while summoning wall
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

df1 (3 directions on ground and 3 in air), Hell's Wrath (what you call "Fire Beam"), mid
24 6 33 +18 -12
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

db4, Tendril Pull, mid
28 11 41 +11 (kd) -35
Krushing Blow: opponent blocks late
DOES hit during Dodging Shadows

There is some discrepancy with the frame data and the numbers displayed by the built-in frame data tool but this should give a decent first impression.
Here are the block advantages of all her default strings: -2 -8 -12 -4 -11 -1 -5 -9 -10 -9 -5. Not sure how much that tells you, considering that even the character specific tutorial modes are not consistent in what is considered "safe" or not but there is not a single 0 or better string in there, so ...

other Krushing Blows:
d2, counter/punish high attack
toward throw, opponent failed throw escape during previous throw
213 (h,m,o +35 -9), counter/punish

Tournament variation 1 ("Force of Nature"):
Shattering Boulder replaces Natural Barrier and summons a rock at head level instead. Launches on hit. Amplify to shatter boulder for a wider horizontal hitbox.
Delayed Boulder Bash allows the default rock throws (horizontally above head level and diagonally down) to be delayed, cancelled and switched horizontally/diagonally after inputting one or the other (they have different inputs, bf2/db2). Cannot be amplified.

Tournament variation 2 ("Spring Cleaning"):
The teleport ("H2 P0rt"), du (behind), dub (in front), dud (in place), duf (far) can be done in air, cannot be amplified.

I will update the original tournament variation post with a link to this comment:
https://testyourmight.com/threads/spoiler-thread-people-officially-have-the-game-already-no-story-spoilers.69013/page-45#post-2481068

edits:
Clarified the Boulder Bash section to highlight that the default (non-cancellable, non-delayable) rock throws are not variation specific

Awesome stuff!

How about her tracking vine grab or boulder toss? Do either of those hit jade out of dodging shadows?

 

[legion666]

edits:
Clarified the Boulder Bash section to highlight that the default (non-cancellable, non-delayable) rock throws are not variation specific.
Added answers to some follow-up questions.


db1 (2 directions), Natural Barrier, mid
12s 25a 12r +15 -15
Krushing Blow: projectile destroyed while summoning wall
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

df1 (3 directions on ground and 3 in air), Hell's Wrath (what you call "Fire Beam"), mid
24 6 33 +18 -12
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

db4, Tendril Pull (Vine Grab), mid
28 11 41 +11 (kd) -35
Krushing Blow: opponent blocks late
DOES hit during Dodging Shadows

db2, Bouncing Boulder (diagonally down), mid
48 +38 +3
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows

bf2, Boulder Bash (horizontal), unblockable (in air)
46 +65 (kd)
Krushing Blow: projectile hits by itself
does NOT hit Jade during Dodging Shadows in the air

There is some discrepancy with the frame data and the numbers displayed by the built-in frame data tool but this should give a decent first impression.
Here are the block advantages of all her default strings: -2 -8 -12 -4 -11 -1 -5 -9 -10 -9 -5. Not sure how much that tells you, considering that even the character specific tutorial modes are not consistent in what is considered "safe" or not but there is not a single 0 or better string in there, so ...

other Krushing Blows:
d2, counter/punish high attack
toward throw, opponent failed throw escape during previous throw
213 (h,m,o +35 -9), counter/punish

Tournament variation 1 ("Force of Nature"):
Shattering Boulder replaces Natural Barrier and summons a rock at head level instead. Launches on hit. Amplify to shatter boulder for a wider horizontal hitbox.
Delayed Boulder Bash allows the default rock throws (horizontally above head level and diagonally down) to be delayed, cancelled and switched horizontally/diagonally after inputting one or the other (they have different inputs, bf2/db2). Cannot be amplified.

Tournament variation 2 ("Spring Cleaning"):
The teleport ("H2 P0rt"), du (behind), dub (in front), dud (in place), duf (far) can be done in air, cannot be amplified.

I will update the original tournament variation post with a link to this comment:
https://testyourmight.com/threads/spoiler-thread-people-officially-have-the-game-already-no-story-spoilers.69013/page-45#post-2481068

There is an air tele?!? That’s awesome! I will probably try the second variation. Is there any information about the standard ground boulder’s frame data?!