Question Ask Smoke Thread - Have Any Question? Post It Here!

[smokey]

I'll just type it out, too lazy to search.

YOU MUST BE EXACTLY 3 DASHES AWAY FROM THE CORNER

jip 3d12 > quarter dash xx uppercut > 32 > 32 > 32 > 21 xx bomb > 214 xx ender. Or you can backdash > f4 > reset.

This combo is hilariously useless.

Nice and i beg you to pull that off in a real match while armouring through someone with your xray.

 

[FrothyOmen]

hey hey hey I use his xray in oki with great success! Especially vs. sonyas that herp derp EX cartwheels on wakeup, xray that bitch lol. Then again i just posted videos of me playing last night and they are absolutely awful, so maybe that sheds light on why this works for me lol

 

[smokey]

hey hey hey I use his xray in oki with great success! Especially vs. sonyas that herp derp EX cartwheels on wakeup, xray that bitch lol. Then again i just posted videos of me playing last night and they are absolutely awful, so maybe that sheds light on why this works for me lol

Its cool, i dont deny that you can get it working, but at the end of the day you might have just blew through sonyas cartwheel on wakeup, but next time she wakes up your gonna eat that combo into MS pressure, you wont have shit to your name for meter, and you cant breaker, drift away, shake her off, and you will regret using all your meter for a silly gimmick.
Meter in this game is very important and one bad use of meter can spill a whole game for you, so to recklessly throw it all away like that isnt good.

 

[NB Semi Evil Ryu]

New Smoke player here with a quick question:

When you guys decide to end a combo with 214 xx Invis. in the corner, what do you like to do following going invisible? Is there anything that you've noticed that tends to work well or have you just developed your own playstyle with your own preference of what you do post-invis?

 

[Faded Dreams V]

Invisibility is a parlor trick. It may mess up the opponent's spacing. There's no reason to do it, and no reason not to. So you might as well. But there's no fancy tricks to do after invisibility. If the opponent panics, they may create an opening, and you can counter as you wish. That's all.

 

[G4S KT]

IMO invis is the best bait in the game.

And smokey X-ray combos totally have a use. If you're opponent has 40% health or less but almost has a breaker and you score a launch, if you do b23 > SB > x-ray, guess what they won't be doing: winning

 

[RiBBz22]

Invisibility is a parlor trick. It may mess up the opponent's spacing. There's no reason to do it, and no reason not to. So you might as well. But there's no fancy tricks to do after invisibility. If the opponent panics, they may create an opening, and you can counter as you wish. That's all.

lol you say it is a parlor trick but the situation you described it creating totally makes it incredibly useful.

 

[NB Semi Evil Ryu]

Hypothesis:

If I'm on the receiving end of that 214 xx Invis. and I'm waking up to find Smoke invisible, I am going to do one of two things:

- Wake-up attack to get him visible again. If wake-up is blocked, then Smoke's gonna get a free punish.
- I sit there a moment blocking, just to ascertain where Smoke is and what he's doing. During that moment of pause, Smoke might be able to sneak in a quick throw or overhead if Smoke's opponent is blocking low.

Does this sound feasible to you guys?

 

[FrothyOmen]

Well, that's about all that could happen lol. Unless the opponent decides to stay grounded, in which case smoke can 3d12 on reaction for, at minimum, chip damage.

 

[G4S KT]

Also, when you're playing runaway Smoke (which should be a lot) you can get invis for free 99% of the time. Why would you not do it?

My motto is: There's no reason to not be invisible

 

[Big Pampering]

In a word? yes

Characters with fast special mids (JC, Kabal, Shang, etc.) can straight up full-combo punish d1 on block if they're scouting it and have god like reactions (it's like a 2 frame window that happens instantly as the d1 connects on block). This isn't normally how it happens in practice, however.

This isn't due to any special characteristic of Smoke, though. Universally, the game mechanic is that d1 and d3 have (essentially) 0 block stun giving the entirety of the recovery of the move in advantage to the opponent. Smoke has the "good" set of pokes where d1/d3/d4 are 6f/7f/12f in execution, +1/+3/+15 on hit and -13/-7/0 on block. There are slight variations in this set of "good" pokes across the cast but you get the idea.

Then there are characters like mileena and scorpion who's pokes suck; Mileena's d1 and Scorp's d4 are -6 and 0 (respectively) on hit

Normally, the way this mechanic is applied is that when you block a d1 you can punish it easily with your own d1 or d3

so to more fully answer Death 's question, Smoke's d1 looks like this:

execution: 6f
hit advantage: +1
block advantage: -13

I can't tell you what the cancel advantage is on hit/block; we need someone like Somberness for that.

punishing d1 on block is extremely hard, a lot of people mistake punishing d1 because people attempt another d1 even though the first one was blocked. I went to training mode with kung lao and even with the spin you wont be able to punish it that often.

 

[RiBBz22]

Also, when you're playing runaway Smoke (which should be a lot) you can get invis for free 99% of the time. Why would you not do it?

My motto is: There's no reason to not be invisible

I know you don't use it but it's all about that sweet mop o hair he has

 

[Bearserker]

d1 ff d1b2. All I can really say about that; go into practice mode and set a dummy to jump and just practice. It's gotta be muscle memory.

Thx for the njp tip. It helps me a lot !
I understand what I'm doing (very stupidly) wrong with d1. I usually keep d pushed while hitting 1,1,1. I have to release d after the first d1 and do a quick d1b2.

f4 xx EX bomb: yeah, that's a known problem. Usually when that happens you are hitting them with the f4 too early, try holding off for a few more frames and you should hopefully connect. Smoke's reset ain't easy.

Once again thank you for the advice. I just spent some time training midscreen strings with f4 as a finisher and it seems there are fairly reliable ways to get a reset. I even got (too) easily lots of double-resets and 100+% strings. Will it be fixed soon ? (I sincerely hope so...)

Also d1 is amazing if you're in a situation where the enemy *could* go airborne. If you 3d12 > d1 and that's it, alot of times people will try to jump out and get blown up. But if you just blindly commit to 3d12 > d1 > d1 xx bomb you have the OPPORTUNITY to combo somebody for trying to jump out.

OK, I better identifies the role of d1. But according to KT Smith's post, on 14th page of this thread, d1 has a -13 block advantage where d3 has a -7 block advantage. So if the opponent blocks standing, he can punish the d1 (or at least reverse the pressure) where he would eat the d3. Even if he blocks crouching, he should have difficulties to take advantage of a blocked d3, shouldn't he ?
Actually, I've some trouble dealing with standing turtlers (I don't know what to do) and I search any alternative to a basic throw. Making useful for them to block lows in order to mix lows with b2 is my aim.

About the "X-Ray" polemic, don't worry, I'm indeed a noob, but I've my own free will. And I try to evaluate before testing whatever I read, so I prefer some moot proposals than no proposal at all !

 

[FrothyOmen]

Bearserker

I like you.

I've heard that all resets are patched in MK Vita, and that they should all be taken out once komplete edition drops. I have no facts behind this other than "some guy told me", though.

I like d3 dash d3 dash d3 pressure. You have to mix in d1's when you think they will try to jump out, though (if you think they will attempt that at all).

 

[smokey]

IMO invis is the best bait in the game.

And smokey X-ray combos totally have a use. If you're opponent has 40% health or less but almost has a breaker and you score a launch, if you do b23 > SB > x-ray, guess what they won't be doing: winning

I understand the use of xray in combo, i think i got you mixed up, using xray to cancel for the armour is not a good use, but yeah using xrays to deny breaker is always good.

also invisibility is probably one of the better moves for baiting in the game, without the ability to see you they panic and try to get that hit on you, and at the same time cant see whats coming at them.

SemiEvilRyu
The advantage you are on after invis in the corner doesnt leave all that much time for you to space out, so just block ready for a wake up attack, and if it doesnt come then begin pressuring, and if you still dont find that opening then go for a throw, off a string usually like 3d1~throw or 11~throw. If you get hit or poked out of your invisibility when they get up then next time try for an NJP or cross up if your sure they wont wake up attack.

if you are playing from full screen and someone is trying to dodge a flurry of smoke bombs then you can more often than not grab a free invisibility, and that also creates panic and openings.

 

[G4S KT]

using xray to cancel for the armour is not a good use

X-ray cancels are good if you like HYYYYYYYYYPE

I'm gonna do one on stream thursday. whoever I'm playing is getting an x-ray cancel > throw.

exposed?

 

[Faded Dreams V]

I had no idea I could anti-air Cyrax out of his teleport with a standing 2.

That is all.

 

[Faded Dreams V]

Questions:

1. I heard Slips say in a podcast that online Smoke is a load of shit because he can 3 D1, interrupt the string, and then grab. I've used this strategy because people tend to not expect it. Apparently, offline this is not a viable strategy because people can easily react to it even if they don't expect it?

2. I also heard, online, D1 pressure is bs because of lag. I always thought the opposite was true because people can cross over freely and not be AA'd. Apparently, offline, if someone blocks D1, they can cross you over instantly?

I don't mind abusing resets, but the thought of me abusing lag to win, just like Reptile players, irks me.

 

[smokey]

Faded Dreams V

1: 3d1 tick throws are good, but very easy to react to offline (doesnt matter online, it isnt competitive) If it works once it probably wont again, and thats if it works once.

2: Blocked d1 i think is -12 or -15, but confirming a block, releasing, and following up on reaction with such a small window would make it really hard to significantly and consistantly punish.

 

[G4S KT]

Saying Smoke is bullshit online because he can 3d1 tick throw you is one of the most ignorant things I've heard from a top player if what Faded Dreams V said is true and slips meant it seriously. Almost the entirety of the rest of the cast can do stagger string > tick throw with greater effectiveness than 3d1.

That isn't even Smoke's good tick throw string, 112 is.

EDIT: I don't even consider online to be a part of this game, honestly.

 

[smokey]

Saying Smoke is bullshit online because he can 3d1 tick throw you is one of the most ignorant things I've heard from a top player if what Faded Dreams V said is true and slips meant it seriously. Almost the entirety of the rest of the cast can do stagger string > tick throw with greater effectiveness than 3d1.

That isn't even Smoke's good tick throw string, 112 is.

EDIT: I don't even consider online to be a part of this game, honestly.

11 , 112, 112 smoke bomb, 112 ex smoke bomb, and any variation of these with tick throws instead, is a complete mind fuck to get out of and pretty much covers every possible counter attempt. my flavour of the month string right now by far

 

[Faded Dreams V]

EDIT: I don't even consider online to be a part of this game, honestly.

You know you loved playing online during that Final Round trip tourney. ;D

 

[G4S KT]

You know you loved playing online during that Final Round trip tourney. ;D

 

[Enenra]

How do you counter Mileena's dumb D4? It really stops everything I have.

 

[Faded Dreams V]

How do you counter Mileena's dumb D4? It really stops everything I have.

If you're ballsy and expect it, back away and throw a blank Smoke Bomb. You can also cross her over and jump kick + aerial grab, but you can be punished for this (she may reverse the input of her spin dash bs). Finally, you can counterpoke with D3 and D1, but be careful of the roll.

Honestly, the only way her D4 can be stopping everything you have is if you're trying to do everything after jumping in. =P