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General/Other KILLER FROST - General Discussion Thread

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Yep, it won't work against everyone, but I noticed that you can catch at least some people with it.
Air dash into the 3 crossup helped me more against the heavy turtlers.

And the good old "Street Fighter" style, crouching jab (1), jab (1) -> throw. I noticed it helps a lot even in this game.




I'm doing pretty ok with her online but I agree about plucking birdies, it's not an easy task for her. My other characters I use are Harley Quinn, Catwoman and Bane and I feel like they all have better anti air options.

After a blocked slide I usually try to do crouching 1, 1 > throw or I try to mix it up and do her overhead with armor (F+3 MB).
You shouldn't d1 after a slide because you are at -4. This is online tech if it is working for you because of the delay. If you are d1'ing and your opponent reads it they should be able to d1 into a full combo.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Ugh... this again.

Go into training mode and have him do a blockstring into trait and block it 100x watching the animation each time.

Now you know exactly what to look for and can react to seeing it. Parry is ONE FRAME.
Yeah, I agree you can react to it if you lab it up enough. Just record Grundy's inputs and practice
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
GGA 16 Bit Ninj Konqrr
I've been learning Frost lately and I was curious as to if there was a "trick" to landing her 22~Command Grab, after her series of U3's like there is for numerous other characters (like with Catwoman, doing B12D3~Cat Stance you can just hit down 3 once as opposed to the normal Down Down 3) because I'm having a hard time landing the reset...it's probably my execution because I find it tricky since the character is bouncing back and forth and I have to remember which way is back and forward etc., etc.,
Intuitively I started with rolling the d pad from d to b to f in a smooth motion, and I was getting that pretty consistently (80-90%), but I think it is worth challenging yourself to get the timing right to do the d b f input so it comes out every single time. Honestly, I wish I started out doing the d b f method because even after retaining myself every now and then I will slip into the old method which is definitely less consistent.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
A little bit of knowledge from my compadre KF mainers, please. This is going to sound scrubby, but I can't figure this one out very well. How do you guys deal with turtles? No, I'm not talking about zoners, I'm talking about walking shields who hold down back more often than not. Those who can anti-air KF for free if you jump, and obviously daggers aren't likely to hit them, nor glacier. Against these types, I often purposefully put myself into the parry-or-not 50/50 after a blocked slide just because I don't know a better way to open them up. KF's mid-range game is non-existent, and her use of interactables is often limited to defense.

I've tried dashing up and throwing, and dashing up and MB f+3, but let's be real here, that's an online tactic. What can I use against solid players with her? What gets her offense flowing outside of 50/50?
If people are going to turtle and not do anything then I am going to build enough meter to work my way in and 50-50 safely. On your way in you should be looking out for any holes you can exploit that would give you opportunities to slide. If they actually let you work your way in so you are in F+3 range, they are idiots because that is where KF is the most deadly and more options are in her favor.
 

G4S Claude VonStroke

@MK_ClaudeVS on twitter
You shouldn't d1 after a slide because you are at -4. This is online tech if it is working for you because of the delay. If you are d1'ing and your opponent reads it they should be able to d1 into a full combo.
Yeah I learned this the hard way against Kt smith in top 8 on Saturday lol. After a blocked slide you can meter burn f3 though right? Even if they do d1?
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Yeah I learned this the hard way against Kt smith in top 8 on Saturday lol. After a blocked slide you can meter burn f3 though right? Even if they do d1?
I remember hearing something about MB f3 and b3 armor not activating until the 8th frame of the move...but even with that said I am actually pretty sure that you can safely F3 MB after a slide. I would just go check it out in training mode to verify it.
 

Neclord

Kombatant
You shouldn't d1 after a slide because you are at -4. This is online tech if it is working for you because of the delay. If you are d1'ing and your opponent reads it they should be able to d1 into a full combo.
Yep, I noticed that after a few more online battles. But F+3 (MB) is pretty good in that situation.
 

G4S Claude VonStroke

@MK_ClaudeVS on twitter
I remember hearing something about MB f3 and b3 armor not activating until the 8th frame of the move...but even with that said I am actually pretty sure that you can safely F3 MB after a slide. I would just go check it out in training mode to verify it.
How do you set the CPU to d1 on reversal?
 

Seapeople

This one's for you
I remember hearing something about MB f3 and b3 armor not activating until the 8th frame of the move...but even with that said I am actually pretty sure that you can safely F3 MB after a slide. I would just go check it out in training mode to verify it.
I've tried using mb f3 a lot and get blown up for it. It might just be my timing but I don't think it works unless they use a really slow attack. D1~slide might be okay if you expect the other person to check you with a high attack or something slower than 10 frames.
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
Elder God
NetherRealm Studios
If they check you with d+1 after a blocked slide you cannot mb f+3 in time. Parry if it's a mid d+1, backdash or just block their d+1.

8 frames is the official number it takes for armor to become active on a mb f+3/b+3 but it's actually a little faster, closer to 5 frames. Still not enough time if their d+1 is timed correctly.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
If they check you with d+1 after a blocked slide you cannot mb f+3 in time. Parry if it's a mid d+1, backdash or just block their d+1.

8 frames is the official number it takes for armor to become active on a mb f+3/b+3 but it's actually a little faster, closer to 5 frames. Still not enough time if their d+1 is timed correctly.
Yeah, it seem instant but I knew I heard somewhere it was 8 frames. If it is closer to 5 frames then you can probably get away with it if they use something other than a quick normal or poke... but definitely not the best practice. I think with Frost, backdash is probably the best option so you can bait a whiffed string/poke and punish with slide.
 

Neclord

Kombatant
Man Superman is just too good against KF.
When he has me in the corner he can just rape me with his superior normals.
 

Primiera

Wonderful Woman
I'm not very experienced against rushdown Superman, but can't Killer Frost parry most of those superior normals? KF has some of the best corner escapes in the game between air dash, parry, slide, and of course push-blocking or MB Interactable or whatnot. If you can slip a d+1 in there you may get out as well, potentially with THEM cornered now.
 

Law Hero

There is a head on a pole behind you
Man Superman is just too good against KF.
When he has me in the corner he can just rape me with his superior normals.
It's definitely hard online, and I do have trouble with talented Superman players. I think he's also very dangerous at range where he can jump to avoid projectiles, then counter with this air heat vision.

In the corner, I try to wake-up parry or slide, but that can be tough depending on how much lag there is.
 

Neclord

Kombatant
I'm not very experienced against rushdown Superman, but can't Killer Frost parry most of those superior normals? KF has some of the best corner escapes in the game between air dash, parry, slide, and of course push-blocking or MB Interactable or whatnot. If you can slip a d+1 in there you may get out as well, potentially with THEM cornered now.
Yea I tried to parry as well but I had no success with it so far. Maybe because of online don't know.

It's definitely hard online, and I do have trouble with talented Superman players. I think he's also very dangerous at range where he can jump to avoid projectiles, then counter with this air heat vision.

In the corner, I try to wake-up parry or slide, but that can be tough depending on how much lag there is.
Yes he is very dangerous at range. I think he is even better at range than KF.
But yea, I feel like all of his normals have higher priority/range than mine, so it's really hard. And the better players know that they have to block low a lot against KF, so slide isn't the get out of jail card most of the time.

When I try to counter his normals with B+3 or F+3 (MB) then he sometimes just air dashes over me for a crossup and my armor move misses. Really hard to deal with imo.
 

Primiera

Wonderful Woman
I'm starting to feel it is more even now. Once you learn to deal with Walking Corpse and learn the wakeup timing after his trait in the corner it becomes easier. You also have to watch for trait during blockstrings and parry it on reaction. I say on reaction because if you just throw it out there and he does a Walking Corpse... he does EX and gets a nearly free Trait grab on your wakeup or if he bounces you off the wall in the corner, say goodbye to at least 57% ;_;
What tips do you have in general?

I HATE to sound like I have a defeatist attitude (if I jump, he Shoryukens! If I block, he Hadoukens!!!), but I just don't get how to play this match-up. I feel like SSF4 Viper vs. Zangief. Zoning him from far away only works as well as it does against anyone, aka very little.

So the zoning comes from the mid-range game, where Frost can't AA him, he can AA her including cross-ups, he can armor through her junk, and the zoning game has a risk of 2% chip vs a jump-in for 60%. I know it's really not so cut and dry, but golly, I'm living on the fact that Parry is a deadly reversal to most of his stuff during his pressure, and I can dash up into stuff (which he has plenty of counters to). I DO NOT like living on the power of a reversal, definitely not the risk vs. reward I'm after. I know I sound like a total scrub here but I'm just not getting it.

Oh, and I think if he holds down-back during oki and mashes MB T, he dodges high and low ...
 

Goatlegs

Noob
Has anyone else used b1~MBf3? It's a pretty quick low into overhead and has yet to fail me in those tight clutch situations. When I say MBf3 I mean when you spend the two bars to cancel into it during a string.
 

Seapeople

This one's for you
Has anyone else used b1~MBf3? It's a pretty quick low into overhead and has yet to fail me in those tight clutch situations. When I say MBf3 I mean when you spend the two bars to cancel into it during a string.
MB f3 hits for me almost everytime after any string since they'll always be respecting the slide. If you're willing to spend the meter it's practically free.
 

G4S Claude VonStroke

@MK_ClaudeVS on twitter
Has anyone else used b1~MBf3? It's a pretty quick low into overhead and has yet to fail me in those tight clutch situations. When I say MBf3 I mean when you spend the two bars to cancel into it during a string.
Can you explain exactly how you are doing it and when and how you are cancelling it? Thanks!
 

Goatlegs

Noob
Can you explain exactly how you are doing it and when and how you are cancelling it? Thanks!
Like for example if you wanted to do 22~MB3, you would input 22 then forward(x2)R2(or the Xbox equivalent). It's the same thing but just with b1. I guess calling it MBf3 is technically wrong because you never actually input 3, but it's the same animation/attack.
 

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
Has anyone else used b1~MBf3? It's a pretty quick low into overhead and has yet to fail me in those tight clutch situations. When I say MBf3 I mean when you spend the two bars to cancel into it during a string.
Been using it since week 1 :D so dirty lol
 

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
OK so I was testing f112 4 as an ender last night against a human Grundy using his armored grabs. The follow up slide CANNOT be armored/jumped/backdashed. In order to avoid the armor tho, that is very hard, as you have tto literally slide as soon as you recover from 4. Its easier to buffer slide during the recovery time of 4, so get used to that.

F113 dagger is still the prefered ender IMO, but alot of people, including me, either mistime the follow option or we've had people jump/dash/armor it. f112 4 grants more hitstun and definitely catches jumpers/backdashers and the slide follow cannot be armored.