General/Other KILLER FROST - General Discussion Thread

[Bolton]

So how are you guys doing online? I'm having a lot of unforeseen trouble against jump happy Batmans and Superman's air game. There's nothing I can seem to do against their approaches except ducking under with BD3 which doesn't actually solve the problem because Kfrost has a hard time plucking birdies out of the sky from what I've seen. I can't seem to time d2 as an anti air against specifically those guys online, and cross ups are almost always have to be avoided or blocked.

Also, I'm wondering how you guys approach people? I play Harley as well as KFrost, and comparing their j2, KFrost's hitbox seems a lot smaller and weirder to land than hers. Her j3 is amazing for cross ups, but not for closing in on someone. I hear a lot about how slide is super safe to approach with.. But more often than not, I find myself being beat by projectiles (there is a lot in this game), other dash attack moves that have a further extending and higher hitbox (e.g. Luthor, Shazam, Flash), and sometimes even low normals. Most of the time I'm blocked, though, so what should I do after a blocked slide?

Zoning is a little weird too. Even though you do have daggers and iceberg, iceberg does almost no chip damage, and daggers can be ducked. So often more than not, people understand that just by blocking low and dashing they can approach me until midrange when they just spam jump ins. I'm not so sure if she's as good as everyone says she is.. At least for online, I hate seeing my BD3 or my U3 not come out when I know I inputted them correctly, leading to a dropped combo..

 

[Rickyraws]

She absolutely has problems plucking birds, Hawks especially, from the sky. How do you guys handle NightWing?

 

[Tom2356]

So how are you guys doing online? I'm having a lot of unforeseen trouble against jump happy Batmans and Superman's air game. There's nothing I can seem to do against their approaches except ducking under with BD3 which doesn't actually solve the problem because Kfrost has a hard time plucking birdies out of the sky from what I've seen. I can't seem to time d2 as an anti air against specifically those guys online, and cross ups are almost always have to be avoided or blocked.

Also, I'm wondering how you guys approach people? I play Harley as well as KFrost, and comparing their j2, KFrost's hitbox seems a lot smaller and weirder to land than hers. Her j3 is amazing for cross ups, but not for closing in on someone. I hear a lot about how slide is super safe to approach with.. But more often than not, I find myself being beat by projectiles (there is a lot in this game), other dash attack moves that have a further extending and higher hitbox (e.g. Luthor, Shazam, Flash), and sometimes even low normals. Most of the time I'm blocked, though, so what should I do after a blocked slide?

Zoning is a little weird too. Even though you do have daggers and iceberg, iceberg does almost no chip damage, and daggers can be ducked. So often more than not, people understand that just by blocking low and dashing they can approach me until midrange when they just spam jump ins. I'm not so sure if she's as good as everyone says she is.. At least for online, I hate seeing my BD3 or my U3 not come out when I know I inputted them correctly, leading to a dropped combo..

For the forward jumpers I have been using a well timed slide as they are landing to either punish or make them crouch block and then mixing that up with a forward dash into a string or F3 or D1 Slide or D1 MB F3. If they are being supper predictive with their jumps then you can use nutral jump 2 or forward jump 2 to meet them in the air and then combo for a slide. If they are beating you in the air then they are pressing their attack early and you should be able to use D2 to beat that.

Supermans air lasers have quite a lot of recovery so you can just block and then slide as he's landing or dash up and do a mix up or string.

Another thing i like to do against people who are jumping over daggers to get in is to just tap trait before throwing the daggers, it probably wouldent work offline but online people think its the daggers and jump to early so the daggers knock them out of the air and can be combo'd with MB Iceberg, Iceberg.

I hear you can F3 MB to beat jumpins but I dont use it myself

 

[CY MasterHavik]

any good ways to fill up the trait bar. I can get 30% with her without using meter.

 

[Neclord]

I think this is very situational based on who your opponent is. Aquaman is a great example of an opponent to NOT do that against because he has a great lame out game and will punish a blocked Iceberg with his own ground spike. Now you haven't gained any space and took some damage. Same thing with another KF except if your close enough she'll just slide you then gg.

Of course that's not to say it would never work. If you notice your opponent is trying to get a reversal on a blocked dagger every time, then hell yeah do your Iceberg right after, but don't get comfortable because they will reversal it eventually. Once people figure out how to deal with Iceberg I don't think KF players will just be throwing it out like some are now.

Now the topic of getting in. Like Konqrr said, I don't think KF should be forcing her way all the time. Just watch your opponent closely. If your fighting a pesky Deathstroke who won't lay off the gunfire, air dash in at an appropriate height. If an Aquaman puts his water shield up you'll at least get a forward dash. There's ways around laming as KF but they just require more patience.

Yep, it won't work against everyone, but I noticed that you can catch at least some people with it.
Air dash into the 3 crossup helped me more against the heavy turtlers.

And the good old "Street Fighter" style, crouching jab (1), jab (1) -> throw. I noticed it helps a lot even in this game.

So how are you guys doing online? I'm having a lot of unforeseen trouble against jump happy Batmans and Superman's air game. There's nothing I can seem to do against their approaches except ducking under with BD3 which doesn't actually solve the problem because Kfrost has a hard time plucking birdies out of the sky from what I've seen. I can't seem to time d2 as an anti air against specifically those guys online, and cross ups are almost always have to be avoided or blocked.

Also, I'm wondering how you guys approach people? I play Harley as well as KFrost, and comparing their j2, KFrost's hitbox seems a lot smaller and weirder to land than hers. Her j3 is amazing for cross ups, but not for closing in on someone. I hear a lot about how slide is super safe to approach with.. But more often than not, I find myself being beat by projectiles (there is a lot in this game), other dash attack moves that have a further extending and higher hitbox (e.g. Luthor, Shazam, Flash), and sometimes even low normals. Most of the time I'm blocked, though, so what should I do after a blocked slide?

Zoning is a little weird too. Even though you do have daggers and iceberg, iceberg does almost no chip damage, and daggers can be ducked. So often more than not, people understand that just by blocking low and dashing they can approach me until midrange when they just spam jump ins. I'm not so sure if she's as good as everyone says she is.. At least for online, I hate seeing my BD3 or my U3 not come out when I know I inputted them correctly, leading to a dropped combo..

I'm doing pretty ok with her online but I agree about plucking birdies, it's not an easy task for her. My other characters I use are Harley Quinn, Catwoman and Bane and I feel like they all have better anti air options.

After a blocked slide I usually try to do crouching 1, 1 > throw or I try to mix it up and do her overhead with armor (F+3 MB).

 

[csquared587]

I have a ton of problems with jumpers and people like nightwing that can just d1 all day and crouch block. How are you guys opening up people that are crouch blocking and poking all day?

 

[Primiera]

I have a ton of problems with jumpers and people like nightwing that can just d1 all day and crouch block. How are you guys opening up people that are crouch blocking and poking all day?

d+2 is about her only true AA, quite a few characters can blow it up for free so don't count on being able to stop every jump with it. If you keep getting jumped in on, try MB b+3, going air-to-air, or backdashing when in jump range and reset the situation. Slide and Glacier for pokes - if they're up close and have insane frame advantage like Nightwing, try parrying or if you inevitably have to, push-blocking.

If they're playing turtle style, I've come to realize you have a few options.

1. Keep playing the zoning game, it's not great but it's enough to get them to do SOMETHING that can open them up eventually, like jumping, poking, counter zoning, whatever. You can think of this stage as meter/trait building at the least.

2. Try jumping to a spot where you can air-dash into J3 and it will be very hard to AA or ambiguous. Some d+2s will beat this, some will whiff entirely. This can be countered by back-dashing and whiff punishing you.

3. Try dash up throw, or dash up MB f+3. Hard to counter both at once.

4. Just slide anyway, and try to guess if they'll attack you back. MB Parry is downright deadly. If they don't press buttons, you can try to get in a d+1 xx another slide, or MB f+3.

 

[Rickyraws]

Turtling Nightwings and sometimes Shazams can be a problem. Is there any reason to block low for Shazaam outside of pokes and avoiding his grab?

 

[EternityInBlack]

I'm having a tough time with executing her command grab on my PS3 DualShock. Currently, I'm just sliding my thumb across all the directions, but it's not coming out reliably. Do I have to tap the direction? That way seems unintuitive for me, especially in a clutch situation.

 

[Neclord]

I'm having a tough time with executing her command grab on my PS3 DualShock. Currently, I'm just sliding my thumb across all the directions, but it's not coming out reliably. Do I have to tap the direction? That way seems unintuitive for me, especially in a clutch situation.

Try to do it without sliding. Just press down, back, forward, 2 very fast and you should be fine.

 

[RunwayMafia]

GGA 16 Bit Ninj Konqrr
I've been learning Frost lately and I was curious as to if there was a "trick" to landing her 22~Command Grab, after her series of U3's like there is for numerous other characters (like with Catwoman, doing B12D3~Cat Stance you can just hit down 3 once as opposed to the normal Down Down 3) because I'm having a hard time landing the reset...it's probably my execution because I find it tricky since the character is bouncing back and forth and I have to remember which way is back and forward etc., etc.,

 

[Konqrr]

GGA 16 Bit Ninj Konqrr
I've been learning Frost lately and I was curious as to if there was a "trick" to landing her 22~Command Grab, after her series of U3's like there is for numerous other characters (like with Catwoman, doing B12D3~Cat Stance you can just hit down 3 once as opposed to the normal Down Down 3) because I'm having a hard time landing the reset...it's probably my execution because I find it tricky since the character is bouncing back and forth and I have to remember which way is back and forward etc., etc.,

Dial in the 22 then start doing the motion for the grab. If you do the motion early or during the 22 input, you will get Iceberg.

Try getting it off of a single 2 or 1 haha

 

[RunwayMafia]

Dial in the 22 then start doing the motion for the grab. If you do the motion early or during the 22 input, you will get Iceberg.

Try getting it off of a single 2 or 1 haha

Oh so I shouldn't be doing 22 or are you suggesting practicing with the single 2 and/or 1?

 

[Konqrr]

Oh so I shouldn't be doing 22 or are you suggesting practicing with the single 2 and/or 1?

No use 22... but I was jokingly saying to try it with a single and see how hard it is lol ... it's doable and required for specific combos.

 

[RunwayMafia]

No use 22... but I was jokingly saying to try it with a single and see how hard it is lol ... it's doable and required for specific combos.

lol ok cool cool. I think it's the constant position change within the combo itself that is throwing me off...

 

[Primiera]

GGA 16 Bit Ninj Konqrr
I've been learning Frost lately and I was curious as to if there was a "trick" to landing her 22~Command Grab, after her series of U3's like there is for numerous other characters (like with Catwoman, doing B12D3~Cat Stance you can just hit down 3 once as opposed to the normal Down Down 3) because I'm having a hard time landing the reset...it's probably my execution because I find it tricky since the character is bouncing back and forth and I have to remember which way is back and forward etc., etc.,

I had a lot of trouble with this until I grinded it out. Probably the best advice is to just make sure you're doing it fast enough; hit 22, don't start the motion until you've inputted, then get going. If you're hitting all the inputs but not getting it, do it faster, you have time but you shouldn't delay. Turn off negative edge or you might get Glacier occasionally while going for the cancel.

 

[RunwayMafia]

I had a lot of trouble with this until I grinded it out. Probably the best advice is to just make sure you're doing it fast enough; hit 22, don't start the motion until you've inputted, then get going. If you're hitting all the inputs but not getting it, do it faster, you have time but you shouldn't delay. Turn off negative edge or you might get Glacier occasionally while going for the cancel.

Thank you She's the third character I'm really focusing on and since Catowoman had some "tricks" or other ways to input certain commands , I was curious if there was a special way to get that command grab to come out more smoothly. Oh, and yes, negative edge was turned off the second I bought the game

 

[Primiera]

Ugh, just found out about Grundy's b+1 > Trait Grab unavoidable reset on hit ... turns all his strings, anti-airs, overheads etc into 50-60% for one bar. If it wasn't for parry being such a good option against most of his offense I'd have the view this match-up were 7-3. Definitely a shitty one regardless.

 

[Konqrr]

Ugh, just found out about Grundy's b+1 > Trait Grab unavoidable reset on hit ... turns all his strings, anti-airs, overheads etc into 50-60% for one bar. If it wasn't for parry being such a good option against most of his offense I'd have the view this match-up were 7-3. Definitely a shitty one regardless.

I'm starting to feel it is more even now. Once you learn to deal with Walking Corpse and learn the wakeup timing after his trait in the corner it becomes easier. You also have to watch for trait during blockstrings and parry it on reaction. I say on reaction because if you just throw it out there and he does a Walking Corpse... he does EX and gets a nearly free Trait grab on your wakeup or if he bounces you off the wall in the corner, say goodbye to at least 57% ;_;

 

[Primiera]

You also have to watch for trait during blockstrings and parry it on reaction. I say on reaction because if you just throw it out there and he does a Walking Corpse... he does EX and gets a nearly free Trait grab on your wakeup or if he bounces you off the wall in the corner, say goodbye to at least 57% ;_;

I don't really see reacting to his trait grab as feasible, his grab is 18F.

 

[Konqrr]

I don't really see reacting to his trait grab as feasible, his grab is 18F.

Ugh... this again.

Go into training mode and have him do a blockstring into trait and block it 100x watching the animation each time.

Now you know exactly what to look for and can react to seeing it. Parry is ONE FRAME.

 

[Lord Beef]

So, apparently slide can avoid some interactsbles. Seems like any stage interactable that gets picked up and thrown at you from above can be avoided this way. Anyone else played with this? Could be a possible way to punish them from the right distance

 

[1man3letters]

Ugh... this again.

Go into training mode and have him do a blockstring into trait and block it 100x watching the animation each time.

Now you know exactly what to look for and can react to seeing it. Parry is ONE FRAME.

you can parry grundy's cleaver aswell,which takes away another block string ender for him

 

[Konqrr]

Just found out that if you end a combo with a sweep, but the sweep hits them a bit off the ground, your opponent will have more standing frames when they get up which really opens up her MB Command Grab after.

The best setups I've found for this are:

J3, d1 or 2 into Slide, U3, Sweep, MB Grab them on wakeup

Ground combo or naked Slide, U3, U3, Sweep, MB Grab them on wakeup

NOTE: If the MB Grab is timed correctly, the only way out is to use a wakeup attack.

 

[16 Bit]

A little bit of knowledge from my compadre KF mainers, please. This is going to sound scrubby, but I can't figure this one out very well. How do you guys deal with turtles? No, I'm not talking about zoners, I'm talking about walking shields who hold down back more often than not. Those who can anti-air KF for free if you jump, and obviously daggers aren't likely to hit them, nor glacier. Against these types, I often purposefully put myself into the parry-or-not 50/50 after a blocked slide just because I don't know a better way to open them up. KF's mid-range game is non-existent, and her use of interactables is often limited to defense.

I've tried dashing up and throwing, and dashing up and MB f+3, but let's be real here, that's an online tactic. What can I use against solid players with her? What gets her offense flowing outside of 50/50?

Why do you need more than 50/50?

Play footsies with walking. Walking is slow but you say they're sitting there crouch blocking. So walk up and do f+3.

Now how do they deal with this? If they went to stand block you could have slide. If they mash an attack that beats out f+3 because it's slow you could have faked walking in, let them whiff and then punished the whiff. Also who said dash up throw or mb f+3 is an online tactic? I do dash up throw, dash up d+1~slide and dash up f+3 MB all the time against our best offline players here. It works. No one can deal with jump ins, slide, dash up and threaten them with walking up all at once.