Characters Who Carry Garbage Players and Play

[Vslayer]

Yes, his slide is unreactable unless it's full screen, yes his overhead is unreactable online. Everyone knows this, and everyone is so up in arms about sub when Sonya can do the same shit to you online and do much more damage. Point is, you can't judge a character by how they perform online because it's not a good judge of skill and never will be. And no one cares about online records, no one cares. If you care, then pick up Subzero and get to Elder God.

I'm not saying I don't get mad playing mixup heavy Subs who sneeze and get combos because f2 amp ice ball and oop I guessed wrong, but it doesn't matter because your online wins do not matter, and playing KL will NOT make you a good player.

 

[MK Dragon]

There's some skilled ones among them, but so far these characters have been used by garbage players just spamming the same move over and over: Scorpion, Sheeva, Joker, Kung Lao and #1 by far is Erron Black (divekick). In general I hate players who just wait for you to make a move and just sit there trying to block everything, but this is in large due to how MK11 works. The blocking system is heavily flawed and to me there should only be a handful of moves able to break through, which are the overhead combos, low sliding moves like Reptile's for ST and most if not all heavy weapon moves.

 

[Pyrosis]

I'm out of this thread. Like I said I can't clarify what my point any more and it's still getting misconstrued. All these characters still have busted online shit that carry, no amount of son talk is changing my mind so kinda pointless to keep talking about it. I've been to at least God rank every KL with Shao Kahn, people still in here telling me I just need to lab unreactable mix in a game that's mix precedent is being reactable, like I'm saying I lose to every single Sub player I match with

Yes, his slide is unreactable unless it's full screen, yes his overhead is unreactable online. Everyone knows this, but you can't bring up an issue and not offer a solution. Everyone is so up in arms about sub when Sonya can do the same shit to you online and do much more damage. Point is, you can't judge a character by how they perform online because it's not a good judge of skill and never will be. And no one cares about online records, no one cares. If you care, then pick up Subzero and get to Elder God.

I'm not saying I don't get mad playing mixup heavy Subs who sneeze and get combos because f2 amp ice ball and oop I guessed wrong, but it doesn't matter because your online wins do not matter, and playing KL will NOT make you a good player.

When did I ever say anything that contradicts the points you've made here? Like... we literally agree and you're disagreeing AT me lol

 

[Vslayer]

I'm out of this thread. Like I said I can't clarify what my point any more and it's still getting misconstrued. All these characters still have busted online shit that carry, no amount of son talk is changing my mind so kinda pointless to keep talking about it. I've been to at least God rank every KL with Shao Kahn, people still in here telling me I just need to lab unreactable mix in a game that's mix precedent is being reactable, like I'm saying I lose to every single Sub player I match with


When did I ever say anything that contradicts the points you've made here? Like... we literally agree and you're disagreeing AT me lol

Cool, then we agree, my bad then.

People get defensive when their mains are mentioned, some of them physically can't agree that online some of their tools are unreactable. But hey, it is what it is.

People will never say D'vorah has crazy-ass range and can hit you from full screen and good luck whiff punishing her. People will never say that if she has two bugs out you have to block forever and there's literally nothing you can do, but it's true.

 

[Pyrosis]

I do be out of this thread now though. I'm not interested in defending AKA clarifying my point for 20 more pages. If any of you want to discuss it further without hopping on the unthinking "just get good" group mentality bandwagon, my PMs are open.

 

[VSC_Supreme]

Lol. I'm confused on the point of this thread though, are we supposed to offer tips? Or just shake our heads in agreement that these characters are carrying 'bad' players and any loss to them isn't a real loss, cause Reddit is a better echo chamber for that.

 

[Marlow]

I understand the point you're making, I just don't understand what you want done about it.

 

[MK9]

Jade will always get the most salt, it amazes me after over a year. Yes her d4 and d2 are godlike, stop using characters that her d4 and own u.

the salt in here is unreal.

 

[xKhaoTik]

In general I hate players who just wait for you to make a move and just sit there trying to block everything, but this is in large due to how MK11 works.

Lmao hold on. Lemme get this straight
In a fighting game, you hate when someone is on the defense and waits for you to make a move?
So if I have the life lead, and decide to sit back and let you come to me, I’m wrong?
If I’m blocking, that’s wrong? So what am I supposed to do, sit there and let you beat me up?

Omg lmao it’s the nonsense for me

 

[MK Dragon]

Lmao hold on. Lemme get this straight
In a fighting game, you hate when someone is on the defense and waits for you to make a move?
So if I have the life lead, and decide to sit back and let you come to me, I’m wrong?
If I’m blocking, that’s wrong? So what am I supposed to do, sit there and let you beat me up?

Omg lmao it’s the nonsense for me

When someone starts off the match just standing back, blocking, refusing to make a move.

 

[Zviko]

When someone starts off the match just standing back, blocking, refusing to make a move.

Grab?

 

[Marlow]

The blocking system is heavily flawed and to me there should only be a handful of moves able to break through, which are the overhead combos, low sliding moves like Reptile's for ST and most if not all heavy weapon moves.

What does this even mean?

 

[MK9]

Well least I know what members are sending me hate mail on Xbox now, Blocking is bad now.. y’all need to go back to fortnight , fighting games are clearly to hard to comprehend for you.

 

[xKhaoTik]

When someone starts off the match just standing back, blocking, refusing to make a move.

It’s called defense. Damn man this is fighting game 101. There’s defensive characters and there’s offensive characters. How do you not understand that lol

So let’s say I’m Kitana and you’re Scorpion. I have the life lead. You’re not a threat at all from afar, but I can’t zone, so I just sit back and let you come to me because you have no other option but to do that. You would take that as me playing the game wrong?

 

[Obly]

I'm out of this thread. Like I said I can't clarify what my point any more and it's still getting misconstrued. All these characters still have busted online shit that carry, no amount of son talk is changing my mind so kinda pointless to keep talking about it. I've been to at least God rank every KL with Shao Kahn, people still in here telling me I just need to lab unreactable mix in a game that's mix precedent is being reactable, like I'm saying I lose to every single Sub player I match with

FWIW, I'm not seeing any major disagreement with your premises. I wonder if the confusion (and seeming misconstruing) is that it's not clear what conclusion you're drawing from those premises.

Premise 1: Sub's 50/50 mix is unreactable online. -- I think everyone accepts this as true; haven't seen anyone strongly dispute this.

Premise 2: Because of this, Sub's mix takes very little skill or game knowledge to use, but nevertheless is difficult for the defender to deal with, even if he/she is skillful and has a lot of game knowledge. -- Again, most people seem to agree with this; I don't see this being disputed.

Premise 3: Therefore, Sub (and other characters with tools like this) has a certain built-in advantage, allowing the Sub player to occasionally win against someone they probably couldn't beat if they were using a more 'honest' character. -- Again, by my read, it seems most people would agree with this.

The hanging question is, what comes next? If this is the set-up, it's not clear what the punchline is. And I think that might be why folks are grasping at straws in their responses.

Are you asking for nerfs? Throw your ideas out there. Folks may disagree, but at least it would be clear what the crux of the debate is about. Were you mostly just needing to vent about online jankiness (i.e., premise 3 is the conclusion)? That's cool too, and I think everyone gets the need for that, but again, it's not clear if that's what this is.

In either case, I totally understand getting annoyed when people respond with, "Hit the lab", but that's kind of a default helping response (if not always phrased helpfully) when someone posts about something that's giving them trouble, and it's not otherwise clear what you're wanting to talk about.

 

[Pyrosis]

FWIW, I'm not seeing any major disagreement with your premises. I wonder if the confusion (and seeming misconstruing) is that it's not clear what conclusion you're drawing from those premises.

Premise 1: Sub's 50/50 mix is unreactable online. -- I think everyone accepts this as true; haven't seen anyone strongly dispute this.

Premise 2: Because of this, Sub's mix takes very little skill or game knowledge to use, but nevertheless is difficult for the defender to deal with, even if he/she is skillful and has a lot of game knowledge. -- Again, most people seem to agree with this; I don't see this being disputed.

Premise 3: Therefore, Sub (and other characters with tools like this) has a certain built-in advantage, allowing the Sub player to occasionally win against someone they probably couldn't beat if they were using a more 'honest' character. -- Again, by my read, it seems most people would agree with this.

The hanging question is, what comes next? If this is the set-up, it's not clear what the punchline is. And I think that might be why folks are grasping at straws in their responses.

Are you asking for nerfs? Throw your ideas out there. Folks may disagree, but at least it would be clear what the crux of the debate is about. Were you mostly just needing to vent about online jankiness (i.e., premise 3 is the conclusion)? That's cool too, and I think everyone gets the need for that, but again, it's not clear if that's what this is.

In either case, I totally understand getting annoyed when people respond with, "Hit the lab", but that's kind of a default helping response (if not always phrased helpfully) when someone posts about something that's giving them trouble, and it's not otherwise clear what you're wanting to talk about.

Thank you for an actual response.
I'm not asking for nerfs, if I was I would have said them already. I disagree that most people agree with those premises listed here when you have several people saying "Unreactable online overhead is just part of the game deal with it kid, just don't get mixed". I thought it was clear that it was just a thread to have a little crycry and vent about the absolute bullshit that some characters get carried by online.
I would say that SOME people agree, but most are just slobbering an opportunity to blast out LOOKS LIKE YOU NEED TO LAB IM SO GOOD AT THIS GAME, which is really even more silly all things considered.

 

[trufenix]

Tell me what tactic you use to "lab" against Sub-Zero. Who's overhead becomes unreactable online, as said by SONICFOX. Not me. The best MK11 player in the world. What secret tech you hiding from Sonicfox and us that beats people wanting to get carried by Sub-Zero mix online?

Oh no, sonic fox got hit by a mixup! Change the whole fucking character!

The game has about ten wakeup options, if you're getting mixed all day by sub zero online, you suck at all of them.

 

[Pyrosis]

Oh no, sonic fox got hit by a mixup! Change the whole fucking character!

The game has about ten wakeup options, if you're getting mixed all day by sub zero online, you suck at all of them.

Sub-Zero's mix done right doesn't let you use wakeup options at all because you never end up on the ground until you're either dead or extremely far behind in life total. Next.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Sub-Zero's mix done right doesn't let you use wakeup options at all because you never end up on the ground until you're either dead or extremely far behind in life total. Next.

Explain how this mix is done “right”. We don’t have infinite meter so he’s not doing b2 into amp ice ball all the time. I’m genuinely curious on how you let these sub players tear you a new one so badly lol

 

[Pyrosis]

Explain how this mix is done “right”. We don’t have infinite meter so he’s not doing b2 into amp ice ball all the time. I’m genuinely curious on how you let these sub players tear you a new one so badly lol

Yeah buddy. I'll answer you right now. Just wait for it.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Yeah buddy. I'll answer you right now. Just wait for it.

It’s because you don’t have an answer lol. You’re just talking out of your ass. If you were so right, you can correct me right now but you don’t have a clue on what you’re talking about
It’s your thread tho so I’ll let you continue looking like an idiot. I’ll keep playing along tho. I have time today lol. Just let me know!

 

[Pyrosis]

It’s because you don’t have an answer lol. You’re just talking out of your ass. If you were so right, you can correct me right now but you don’t have a clue on what you’re talking about
It’s your thread tho so I’ll let you continue looking like an idiot. I’ll keep playing along tho. I have time today lol. Just let me know!

Depending on when you commit to the overhead and meter, Sub-Zero can easily mix you with UNREACTABLE online mix for anywhere between 30-60% and leave you standing the entire time. And you have to legit guess every single time, unreactable. They prolly have Subs that just cash out for damage and a knockdown off one bar down there in Kombatant where you're at. But up in Demi, God, Elder god ranks Subs know how to squeeze a busted unreactable mix.

 

[Pyrosis]

Y'all are going to come back to this thread and be CRYING abut Sub-Zero's mix SO HARD when the delay wakeup change comes out with KP2 and he can actually meaty you off of forward 2. The tears are going to be absolutely flowing when you can't delay between short, medium, or long delay wakeup and Subs are just mixing you literally to death even on knockdowns. It's going to be absolutely hilarious. Terminator and Sub are about to go up in tier on one wakeup change and y'all will be back to say how busted they are with the meaty mix

 

[Zviko]

Y'all are going to come back to this thread and be CRYING abut Sub-Zero's mix SO HARD when the delay wakeup change comes out with KP2 and he can actually meaty you off of forward 2. The tears are going to be absolutely flowing when you can't delay between short, medium, or long delay wakeup and Subs are just mixing you literally to death even on knockdowns. It's going to be absolutely hilarious. Terminator and Sub are about to go up in tier on one wakeup change and y'all will be back to say how busted they are with the meaty mix

Ooof, good thing I don't use delay wake ups so this doesn't affect me.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Depending on when you commit to the overhead and meter, Sub-Zero can easily mix you with UNREACTABLE online mix for anywhere between 30-60% and leave you standing the entire time. And you have to legit guess every single time, unreactable. They prolly have Subs that just cash out for damage and a knockdown off one bar down there in Kombatant where you're at. But up in Demi, God, Elder god ranks Subs know how to squeeze a busted unreactable mix.

I’ve been a demi god and up almost every season so that was a failed attempt to make you seem cool lol

Sub doesn’t always have meter. So what then? Also how is he getting 60% every time? I’ve never seen a sub do that much damage and leave you standing so I’m not sure what game you’re playing.