Characters Who Carry Garbage Players and Play

[mrapchem]

There are very few, if any characters that carry bad players in this game. Really, it's online that carries bad players, making reactable moves unreactable, killing characters' plus frames, barely allowing characters the ability to jail into highs from their pokes on hit, making punishable moves 'safe', etc...

Even with that being said, the same people that have the most wins offline are dominating the online leaderboards as well, so even with an online that distorts the reality of the game, players with good fundamentals and neutral still dominate.

As for Jade and Sub, they both can be beaten quite regularly if the proper time is taken to lab against them - especially if the people using them are actually bad.

 

[xKhaoTik]

As for Jade and Sub, they both can be beaten quite regularly if the proper time is taken to lab against them - especially if the people using them are actually bad.

Na bruh jade carries. You didn’t hear?
Also, sub has this unavoidable win button called mix. 7 pages in and no proof of what it is but it’s there bruh. Level up

 

[mrapchem]

Na bruh jade carries. You didn’t hear?
Also, sub has this unavoidable win button called mix. 7 pages in and no proof of what it is but it’s there bruh. Level up

Sheeeiiiiit, next we're gonna hear that Kitana carries people too. I will get popcorn to see that debacle.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I think SonicFox has the best take on SZ. He considers him mid tier at best, but top 5 for online play. This is a perfect example of just how different offline/online are and how they shouldnt be viewed in the same manner whatsoever. As others have already said, online just isnt a good litmus test for balance because of just how much shit some characters can get away with online that they'd get blown up for offline.

I dont see any character carrying a player. I do see online connectivity shenanigans carrying some players. I would know that more intimately than just about everyone here, honestly.

Well.. It's amazing that you could have a Top 5 online character with a number of good players who represent him, that consistently struggles to make Top 8 in online tournaments with good players

There are definitely more than 4 characters that are better than Subby online. Not to say he isn't good, but I think this is a pretty big exaggeration. We've had almost nothing but online events since March and the results are still pretty consistent.

 

[Demon_0]

Yes, his slide is unreactable unless it's full screen, yes his overhead is unreactable online. Everyone knows this, and everyone is so up in arms about sub when Sonya can do the same shit to you online and do much more damage. Point is, you can't judge a character by how they perform online because it's not a good judge of skill and never will be. And no one cares about online records, no one cares. If you care, then pick up Subzero and get to Elder God.

I'm not saying I don't get mad playing mixup heavy Subs who sneeze and get combos because f2 amp ice ball and oop I guessed wrong, but it doesn't matter because your online wins do not matter, and playing KL will NOT make you a good player.

You can't judge a character by how they perform online? Why the hell not? Lol. I only play this game online, online is the only place I meet these characters.

Look, its really not that hard. Jade, for example, is a bad character on paper. Yes, in tournament/offline play she is garbage. But there's a big difference in playing online and offline, like even-though-I-reacted-to-that-overhead-properly-I-got-hit-cause-of-input-delay different. Its frustrating when you react properly to her overhead FB and get hit for it anyway and loose the entire fucking match. That doesn't happen offline.

People here are acting like Jade (Variation 1) is the same character both online and offline and thats just not true. Her Variation 1 is just a bad character design for the online in this game. There's a reason the majority of players I face in Europe (by far) are Jade players - even more so than Scorpion players - and its because the character carries skilless players to a certain extent. Players who can't play neutral and rely on playing a repeat-the-same-2-moves keepaway game and get away with oh/low's when you manage to get in cause of their shitty wifi connections.

 

[LaidbackOne]

@xKhaoTik , it baffles me that you always try to teach these kind of people some common sense. Stamps, they obviously know better

 

[Pyrosis]

You can't judge a character by how they perform online? Why the hell not? Lol. I only play this game online, online is the only place I meet these characters.

Look, its really not that hard. Jade, for example, is a bad character on paper. Yes, in tournament/offline play she is garbage. But there's a big difference in playing online and offline, like even-though-I-reacted-to-that-overhead-properly-I-got-hit-cause-of-input-delay different. Its frustrating when you react properly to her overhead FB and get hit for it anyway and loose the entire fucking match. That doesn't happen offline.

People here are acting like Jade (Variation 1) is the same character both online and offline and thats just not true. Her Variation 1 is just a bad character design for the online in this game. There's a reason the majority of players I face in Europe (by far) are Jade players - even more so than Scorpion players - and its because the character carries skilless players to a certain extent. Players who can't play neutral and rely on playing a repeat-the-same-2-moves keepaway game and get away with oh/low's when you manage to get in cause of their shitty wifi connections.

Don't try it. They're just going to tell you that you're scrubby and you need to lab unreactable shit.

 

[GeoffBedlam]

Character: Cetrion and Shinnok
Player: Me lol

 

[Vslayer]

You can't judge a character by how they perform online? Why the hell not? Lol. I only play this game online, online is the only place I meet these characters.

Look, its really not that hard. Jade, for example, is a bad character on paper. Yes, in tournament/offline play she is garbage. But there's a big difference in playing online and offline, like even-though-I-reacted-to-that-overhead-properly-I-got-hit-cause-of-input-delay different. Its frustrating when you react properly to her overhead FB and get hit for it anyway and loose the entire fucking match. That doesn't happen offline.

People here are acting like Jade (Variation 1) is the same character both online and offline and thats just not true. Her Variation 1 is just a bad character design for the online in this game. There's a reason the majority of players I face in Europe (by far) are Jade players - even more so than Scorpion players - and its because the character carries skilless players to a certain extent. Players who can't play neutral and rely on playing a repeat-the-same-2-moves keepaway game and get away with oh/low's when you manage to get in cause of their shitty wifi connections.

Who’s worse, the player who spams the same moves or the player who can’t adapt to it and punish them?

 

[xenogorgeous]

Who’s worse, the player who spams the same moves or the player who can’t adapt to it and punish them?

sure, the second one .... the spammer is playing fair , just doing his thing, and the other dude, must adapt and be able to overcome the spamming tactic, since, is very predictable after some time ....

so, the player that falls for the spammer is the idiot one, the worse one, hehe

 

[zerosebaz]

sure, the second one .... the spammer is playing fair , just doing his thing, and the other dude, must adapt and be able to overcome the spamming tactic, since, is very predictable after some time ....

so, the player that falls for the spammer is the idiot one, the worse one, hehe

I remember having this discussion with my ex a long time ago. He didn't play fighting games at all, but bought Injustice 1 and we played it one night with his friends. I beat him with WW only using her B2 during the entire match, and then with Lex using only his jump 3. He claimed I was terrible because I was only using one move, to which I responded that, if I was only using one move, and he knew it was coming, yet still got hit by it, maybe he was the bad one. There are some people that are just incapable of understanding this.

 

[Pyrosis]

I remember having this discussion with my ex a long time ago. He didn't play fighting games at all, but bought Injustice 1 and we played it one night with his friends. I beat him with WW only using her B2 during the entire match, and then with Lex using only his jump 3. He claimed I was terrible because I was only using one move, to which I responded that, if I was only using one move, and he knew it was coming, yet still got hit by it, maybe he was the bad one. There are some people that are just incapable of understanding this.

This group think you three are doing is not even the point the thread is making.

 

[Pyrosis]

But like... uhh.. I don't even give a fuck about this anymore. I'm ignoring this thread tbh. Not responding any more.

 

[Demon_0]

Who’s worse, the player who spams the same moves or the player who can’t adapt to it and punish them?

I guess you didn't really read what I said. Spamming is a smaller part of the problem but you're missing the bigger picture. Let me explain.

The Jade player V.1 (as they all do) is spamming air glaves and her ground (low) projectile thingy from full screen, while invincible to projectiles. You play a character with no teleport and have to get in and that's fine. As you get closer (while coming out of blockstun to her projectiles mostly), you have to guess if she goes for her overhead/low combo, low/low, or low/oh FB (if she has it). Offline, this would be no problem as I can react to her slow overhead/FB. Online, it doesn't fucking matter how well I react, I get hit cause of the connection and/or input delay more often than not.

Her character design is bad in this variation where online is concerned and needs an overhaul. I'm not saying she should be nerfed, hell, give her buffs - but get rid of V1 as it is.

 

[Demon_0]

This group think you three are doing is not even the point the thread is making.

Yeah, some people have a difficult time reading what is being said apparently.

 

[zerosebaz]

This group think you three are doing is not even the point the thread is making.

Oh yeah, to be on point. You are just as free to play any character, be it Jade, Sub-zero or whoever. If you lost it's because you got outplayed. Crying "His combos are easier!" "Her zoning requires no skill" is just an excuse, and the truth is you are NOT better than them, you have different skills and just got outplayed. The worst part is that all of this is about online play...god, I wont even get into that. You are completely free to pick Jade, Sub-zero and whoever else you think carries people and see how you do.

But like... uhh.. I don't even give a fuck about this anymore. I'm ignoring this thread tbh. Not responding any more.

You already said this. And yet here you are.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Well, this was fun. We try to make room here for players of all skill levels -- but if they don't want to listen or learn, there's not much we can gain from it. Everyone gave it their best effort though, so thanks to everybody who tried to help (@xKhaoTik, @Vslayer, @Dankster Morgan etc).

Fortnite is calling

 

[Vslayer]

I guess you didn't really read what I said. Spamming is a smaller part of the problem but you're missing the bigger picture. Let me explain.

The Jade player V.1 (as they all do) is spamming air glaves and her ground (low) projectile thingy from full screen, while invincible to projectiles. You play a character with no teleport and have to get in and that's fine. As you get closer (while coming out of blockstun to her projectiles mostly), you have to guess if she goes for her overhead/low combo, low/low, or low/oh FB (if she has it). Offline, this would be no problem as I can react to her slow overhead/FB. Online, it doesn't fucking matter how well I react, I get hit cause of the connection and/or input delay more often than not.

Her character design is bad in this variation where online is concerned and needs an overhaul. I'm not saying she should be nerfed, hell, give her buffs - but get rid of V1 as it is.

If you’re playing against ED why are you not blocking standing? It’s not like she has a low combo starter or any combo starter or any damage anyways, what are you gonna take? Her slow ass low kick string into nitro kick? Or her overhead combo starter for good damage (that you can punish if you block it)? Use ya brain. Block standing.

Again, it’s about adapting. If you’re getting beat by a Jade constantly then you’re not improving and thus, they are the better player.