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1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
D4rkpump said:
Ya that's what I ended up doing. Originally tagged @pakostevens but just threw your suggestions on too.

It's cost me some tight matches..
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Maybe they'll change the condition finally so i can stop leaping over peoples foward rolls when i read one, so tight that to hit a roll with it
 
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D4rkpump

Noob
Lol. I complain about that constantly. So hard to hit.

Best scenario to go for it is directly after a f4,4 hit. If they forward roll on wake up, it'll hit. So people trying to get back in for pressure I get often.
 
Espio

Espio

Kokomo
I really would like Bone Picker to be reworked, I haven't played it since Berzerker came out, but I'd love that command grab crushing blow changed. As much as I've tried going for it, I've never gotten it versus the other two variations where I can get the variation specific crushing blows fairly regularly. Punish or counter would be a good requirement.

I think my other issue is Bone Picker being the only variation WITHOUT chop-chop is lame because it takes away a great meterless punish for Baraka in a variation that doesn't have gutted or punch walk, you'd think Marauder with its damage would have back spikes instead lol. Just my opinion though of course.



Also on a more casual side of things, I really want Baraka's MK Mobile/MKX skin added with the glowing yellow eyes and stuff, he looks ghastly as fuck. and for some reason the ropes look more primal to me than his primary in 11.

16319

16318
16320
 
Rosie

Rosie

Noob
Alright, lads. What tournament variation is best on Baraka. Just got the game and wanna mess around with him.
 
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ticklebandit!

Apprentice
Damn @Hebrew Negro that is awesome. I was meaning to ask whats a fun custom Baraka set in here for awhile now. I made a variation with war banner charge a while ago and would like quasi zone/anti zone with it for fun but I never realized it had that much armor and was actually pretty fuckin good. I think its unsafe if used point blank but it might have some cool corner stuff too like stuffing wake ups or something.
 
The Ultimate

The Ultimate

aka CommandThrower
What are y'all thinking that Baraka's armor breaking move will be, now that they're a thing in Aftermath?


Chop Chop(and Spine Burst, technically)? B2? F44? Maybe his D2?

Chop Chop might be the most useful, since I think you might be able to do something like F4 into Chop Chop and still have it work on someone who tries breaking away after something like a 122 KB or Gutted Amp. B2 might get the Scorpion property of launching/relaunching armored opponents, but it would have to be faster for it to be useful, I think. F44 would also probably just go into KB if it broke armor, which to me seems the least useful out of the possible options, unless the damage is increased.

That said, the possibility of D2 going into a KB from hitting an armored opponent sounds like it would be great. We'll have to see what our Tarkatan boy gets in just a few days.
 
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Espio

Espio

Kokomo
@The Ultimate I think whatever Baraka gets for his armor break should be universal or help out a weaker variation if it isn't universal. Bone Picker doesn't have chop chop and Marauder is already ahead of it, no need to more heavily enforce the gap between the two variants.

I'd support forward 4 or some other decent speed button though.
 
JJParker

JJParker

Noob
His 2,1+3 string should be his armour breaking move because the move is useless and you never see it used. Give it a damage over time krushing blow if it breaks armour also.
 
1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Espio said:
@The Ultimate I think whatever Baraka gets for his armor break should be universal or help out a weaker variation if it isn't universal. Bone Picker doesn't have chop chop and Marauder is already ahead of it, no need to more heavily enforce the gap between the two variants.

I'd support forward 4 or some other decent speed button though.
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F4 be a bit mental lol

112 gutted breakaway f44kb-fb
Even in the other two variations with 122 kB,
Goodnight lol

Hoping some movement buffs coming our way more than anything else
 
Espio

Espio

Kokomo
1man3letters said:
F4 be a bit mental lol

112 gutted breakaway f44kb-fb
Even in the other two variations with 122 kB,
Goodnight lol

Hoping some movement buffs coming our way more than anything else
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People in their tier lists got him bottom six, he needs it lol :p. I definitely support some movement help too.

Baraka is so fun in this game, I've always loved Baraka but he is easily one of my favorites now and I hope we see him and MK2 roster more consistently going forward. I feel like they did him right in this game overall with his playstyle, looks etc and even in story mode he isn't punked anymore which I love.

I don't play Bone Picker, but I just wanted to not leave it behind as it may struggle the most in the crushing blow department with just the base ones and the really unreliable command grab one. At least with Berzerker, he has leg kebob KB that can punish the opponent for trying to flawless block lol. The damage on that is nice, but I'd also like to see his blade charge KB changed to either being a punish KB or land three. The opponent blocking late ones have always been comical and too situational.
 
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ticklebandit!

Apprentice
So...they gave the armor breaking/anti break away move to the variation with grounded combos because....why exactly??

Am I looking at this wrong? Is there another use for it? I haven't had time to look at anything yet. Did Baraka miss the boat with this new "meta change" stuff?
 
Pakman

Pakman

Lawless Victory!
Played around with v3 in light of the new changes.

Using his kb launchers:

A)

D2 kb - bf2 kb = 458~ damage.
D2 kb - bf2 (no kb) = 292~ Damage.
D2 kb - d2 = 279 damage.


B)

122 kb - bf2 kb = 429 damage
122 kb - bf2 (no kb) = 263 damage
122 kb - d2 (no kb) = 250 damage.

C)

F44kb - bf2 = 435 damage (only connects if they breakaway late, which makes this too unreliable to use)


Whilst the armour break does offer huge burst damage largely in part to the KB (which only triggers once), I am afraid it is poorly implemented.

Firstly, it is on the variation that has no non-kb launchers, so your opponent practically speaking is only going to break away when you land those specific KBs.

So the one or two times you actually land a kb launcher to get extra damage, you have to land the bf2kb - regardless if your opponent has the meter to even trigger their breakaway because you only have 2 real launchers per match - either off the d2 or the 122 kb respectively. There's no thought process involved, there's no counter play involved - just do it because you've only got 2 chances to land it in a match anyway.

Furthermore, its non kb damage on an opponent in a breakaway state isn't that much more than a d2 (a universal option that I have been using since day 1) in the same situation (we are talking about 13~ point difference)...hardly meta changing or meta affecting for that matter.


But wait there is more...

According to the in game move list, Baraka-serker also has armour break properties. Except the move doesn't actually carry an opponent if they are in a breakaway state....but it does carry them if they aren't... :confused:
 
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denuke

Noob
Pakman said:
So the one or two times you actually land a kb launcher to get extra damage, you have to land the bf2kb - regardless if your opponent has the meter to even trigger their breakaway because you only have 2 real launchers per match - either off the d2 or the 122 kb respectively.
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If ur opp doesnt breakaway ur KB will not trigger. So if there is no meter use more damaging options like J2(J1)-112-bf3, or dash 4-db3
Pakman said:
According to the in game move list, Baraka-serker also has armour break properties. Except the move doesn't actually carry an opponent if they are in a breakaway state....but it does carry them if they aren't... :confused:
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And regarding serker move, his amplify is the same charge move. It might work vs FB in some weird scenarios. So everything has sense here.
This var was good but now its even better. Unbreakable damage, corner carry. Charge can punish smth without fl blocking like Fujin b11212. And you sometimes can get 11-bf4 amp KB btw. And of course there is a mix up tools here. On my level no one does fuzzy with 2 frames difference.
 
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ticklebandit!

Apprentice
denuke said:
If ur opp doesnt breakaway ur KB will not trigger. So if there is no meter use more damaging options like J2(J1)-112-bf3, or dash 4-db3


And regarding serker move, his amplify is the same charge move. It might work vs FB in some weird scenarios. So everything has sense here.
This var was good but now its even better. Unbreakable damage, corner carry. Charge can punish smth without fl blocking like Fujin b11212. And you sometimes can get 11-bf4 amp KB btw. And of course there is a mix up tools here. On my level no one does fuzzy with 2 frames difference.
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I'm pretty intoxicated BUT, a lot of the positives you've listed he already had...? And amplified BF3 anti break away KB will not happen in a match. I didn't realize that was a thing but still.

So, in a nutshell, Baraka has been buffed because he gets a 50/50 off of D2 and 122 KB's. Thats my take away. Correct?? Or does delayed break away remove this mix up?? I guess you can also option select bf2 after jump in kicks if your opponent always does break away asap. Like bf2 won't come out on block after a JIK but will on hit for like 18 damage or 36 ish if they break away and you get the KB.

And for sure one of my favorite things in this game is getting the KB off of bf4 amp in berserker vs thirsty peeps trying to flawless block. Like sex in slow motion. Feels great
 
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denuke

Noob
Afler KBs charge will always connect, late or fast. Yea JK OS is a common thing now since one recent patch for many characters like his 2 var. Baraka has maybe one of the best cause it breaks armor. Sindel got same. But people dont break after JK usually. Input error is a thing though:)
I guess you right mostly. Anti break is d2 and you have chop chop in marauder. But they d be scared to break and eat 500. But side switch is a thing too. We have few specialists here. What do you guys think?
Bad thing is his short pokes. Why I prefer 1st. Sometime if I am +3 after blocking and poke doesn't reach.. thats frustrating.
 
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denuke

Noob
Espio said:
but I'd also like to see his blade charge KB changed to either being a punish KB or land three. The opponent blocking late ones have always been comical and too situational.
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You saw it almost right:)
Looks like after 112 and d2 KBs they can break after you jump punch and punish if 112 was inputed or just break if not. So for me its either charge or 4-chop with their meter.
 
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1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Pakman said:
Played around with v3 in light of the new changes.

Using his kb launchers:

A)

D2 kb - bf2 kb = 458~ damage.
D2 kb - bf2 (no kb) = 292~ Damage.
D2 kb - d2 = 279 damage.


B)

122 kb - bf2 kb = 429 damage
122 kb - bf2 (no kb) = 263 damage
122 kb - d2 (no kb) = 250 damage.

C)

F44kb - bf2 = 435 damage (only connects if they breakaway late, which makes this too unreliable to use)


Whilst the armour break does offer huge burst damage largely in part to the KB (which only triggers once), I am afraid it is poorly implemented.

Firstly, it is on the variation that has no non-kb launchers, so your opponent practically speaking is only going to break away when you land those specific KBs.

So the one or two times you actually land a kb launcher to get extra damage, you have to land the bf2kb - regardless if your opponent has the meter to even trigger their breakaway because you only have 2 real launchers per match - either off the d2 or the 122 kb respectively. There's no thought process involved, there's no counter play involved - just do it because you've only got 2 chances to land it in a match anyway.

Furthermore, its non kb damage on an opponent in a breakaway state isn't that much more than a d2 (a universal option that I have been using since day 1) in the same situation (we are talking about 13~ point difference)...hardly meta changing or meta affecting for that matter.


But wait there is more...

According to the in game move list, Baraka-serker also has armour break properties. Except the move doesn't actually carry an opponent if they are in a breakaway state....but it does carry them if they aren't... :confused:
Click to expand...
Jk-blade charge catches break aways.
That's the best of the bunch, and that's saying something.

Maybe if they let f44kb blade charge hit we could use this new mechanic otherwise for reasons you listed already, baraka doesn't really benefit compared to others.

Oh and our command grab still jumps over wakeup rolls!!!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
Adding a alt kB condition to that would been a simple fix to let us use that kB more than when the sun's aline and the 4th moon of Jupiter is a a 45 degree angle to the 2nd
 
Pakman

Pakman

Lawless Victory!
It is too much work for NRS to make F44 kb - blade charge connect. They'd have to increase the f44 kb launch height or shorten the cinematic, opening a whole other can of worms and balance issues.

Command grab whiffing on roll is just another thing to add to the ever growing list of #justnrsthings.


I played around with v3 a bit more

Max damage I can consistently get off a d2 KB

4, db3 (full mash) 361 <more likely to occur>

4, db3 (both bars) 404 <less likely to occur>

It's better to take 361 (or 404) than 458
So if your opponent ever gets launched, mathematically speaking it is now better for them to not use break away so that they avoid the potential 458 (previously the maths said break away was better as they would take 279 off a d2 instead of the 361).

The aim of the breakaway was to get out of damage at the cost of bars.

The armour breaker, at least in this instance, destroys the purpose of breakaway to one where I wouldn't ever breakaway against Baraka in V3.


My closing thoughts:

1) The meta has indeed changed, just not in the way I (and I suspect NRS themselves) originally thought...

2) This "fix" would work if:
A) Fatal blow had it's own Meter, which had to be built by the player getting hit (or hitting an opponent) .That way the player could decide to trigger the breakaway and intentionally put themselves at risk for a longer, more damaging combo in order to build more meter for later use. Consequently the player launching the opponent may alter their combo to prevent their opponent from building too much meter.

B) Breakaway put the player in a temporary state of invulnerability - and only armour breaker or fatal blows could deal damage to them during this time.

C) Armour breakers were in all variations - more opportunities to launch an opponent, which means more opportunities for the opponent to actually breakaway and therefore more opportunities for you to land the counter to it.

D) Armour breakers did less damage than a d2. Otherwise you end up in the same situation as illustrated above.

3) Ultimately, Breakaway didn't need a fix in the first place.
 
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