Cassie Cage General Discussion Thread

[Espio]

Cassie doesn't lose to Jade especially not yas queen. Cassie is uniquely equipped to check Jade on block unlike some characters since she has a ten frame shadow kick that reaches at round start, 11 frame advancing mid with safe options. Cassie bullies her up close with her superior offense/9 frame 0 on block mid. Shoulder is really strong against Jade too and makes zoning at a lot of ranges hazardous since shoulder can outright punish her low spark for example and if she scouts an air glaive she can go under it and punish. If Cassie opens her up she can keep restanding her and negate the oki game entirely.

This is big against a character that needs space to compete with you. All she needs to do is block a single staff normal and she can come in and start her game. Every staff normal or string is negative enough that she can't throw them out and just do whatever when she can't. Back 2 is -13 on block AND HIGH. Back 1, 2 is -19 on block so you can actually use your shadow kick normal to punish that. Forward 2,1 is -13 so come on in. Her safe staff attacks her off of things like 1,2,4 which is -6 and leaves you right in her face so it's time to guess whether Cassie is going to throw, forward 4, back 2,4 etc. Her forward walk speed is superb too.


I just picked up Cassie so in a couple weeks when I get solid with her, I'm gonna look into recording some Jade matches. Don't get me wrong, Jade does great against her but it's not like what people type of it being some unfair struggle. Gotta think outside the box and up that neutral.


Did you guys see Vienality where Biohazard lost to a Cassie player I think Shark Teeth who placed high there? I only mention this because it's not just people talking, it's players actually DOING IT in high level offline matches. Picking Jade versus Cassie isn't the struggle bus as advertised. People need to stop pretending like Cassie can't hang with her. The mu is 5-5.

 

[Vengeance135]

Cassie doesn't lose to Jade especially not yas queen. Cassie is uniquely equipped to check Jade on block unlike some characters since she has a ten frame shadow kick that reaches at round start, 11 frame advancing mid with safe options. Cassie bullies her up close with her superior offense/9 frame 0 on block mid. Shoulder is really strong against Jade too and makes zoning at a lot of ranges hazardous since shoulder can outright punish her low spark for example and if she scouts an air glaive she can go under it and punish. If Cassie opens her up she can keep restanding her and negate the oki game entirely.

This is big against a character that needs space to compete with you. All she needs to do is block a single staff normal and she can come in and start her game. Every staff normal or string is negative enough that she can't throw them out and just do whatever when she can't. Back 2 is -13 on block AND HIGH. Back 1, 2 is -19 on block so you can actually use your shadow kick normal to punish that. Forward 2,1 is -13 so come on in. Her safe staff attacks her off of things like 1,2,4 which is -6 and leaves you right in her face so it's time to guess whether Cassie is going to throw, forward 4, back 2,4 etc.


I just picked up Cassie so in a couple weeks when I get solid with her, I'm gonna look into recording some Jade matches. Don't get me wrong, Jade does great against her but it's not like what people type of it being some unfair struggle. Gotta think outside the box and up that neutral.


Did you guys see Vienality where Biohazard lost to a Cassie player I think Shark Teeth who placed high there? I only mention this because it's not just people talking, it's players actually DOING IT in high level offline matches. Picking Jade versus Cassie isn't the struggle bus as advertised. People need to stop pretending like Cassie can't hang with her. The mu is 5-5.

Hey Espio, are you on PSN? I'd like to run some games vs you and maybe even lab if you're up for it. It'd be a big help.

 

[Espio]

Hey Espio, are you on PSN? I'd like to run some games vs you and maybe even lab if you're up for it. It'd be a big help.

Add Espio872. This is gonna sound like a bullshit OS, but I am gonna be in Lansing for the next five days.

I'll play you in a lengthy set on Friday or Saturday afternoon, if you want we can mic up and talk about core strategies, solutions and everything else it takes. I'm very keen on that if you're down. I want everyone to grow and level up cause the better we all are, the more stimulating the game is.

 

[Vengeance135]

Add Espio872. This is gonna sound like a bullshit OS, but I am gonna be in Lansing for the next five days.

I'll play you in a lengthy set on Friday or Saturday afternoon, if you want we can mic up and talk about core strategies, solutions and everything else it takes. I'm very keen on that if you're down. I want everyone to grow and level up cause the better we all are, the more stimulating the game is.

I 110% agree with you. Bouncing tech and ideas with some one is always great and 110% helpful! I'll add you and I have off on Friday so I'm totally down to do both a set and lab time.

 

[Vengeance135]

Add Espio872. This is gonna sound like a bullshit OS, but I am gonna be in Lansing for the next five days.

I'll play you in a lengthy set on Friday or Saturday afternoon, if you want we can mic up and talk about core strategies, solutions and everything else it takes. I'm very keen on that if you're down. I want everyone to grow and level up cause the better we all are, the more stimulating the game is.

I just added and we have 19 mutual friends. How are you not on my friends list!?!?

 

[Espio]

I just added and we have 19 mutual friends. How are you not on my friends list!?!?

I played Hawkgirl in Injustice 1 and Blue Beetle in Injustice 2, I gotta like you a lot if I felt like being that kind and not subjecting you to that huh lul.

Being serious, I haven't a clue.

 

[Vengeance135]

I played Hawkgirl in Injustice 1 and Blue Beetle in Injustice 2, I gotta like you a lot if I felt like being that kind and not subjecting you to that huh lul.

Being serious, I haven't a clue.

I REMEMBER YOUR HAWKGIRL! Playing you is the reason I labbed that Match up with Joker. The first time we played, you straight bodied me! I was like... what just happened... do people even use her? I don't recall your blue beetle though. I bought this game for Joker, I hope he gets released

 

[vegeta]

2:26

bro this is THE most ignorant Sh** LOLOL

 

[Hor_PeT]

I'm sure you've seen it already but just in case here:

Thx. Yeah maybe I did not remember.
Flawless block gap is only good idea if the normal kick is safe if opponent tries to FB.
If you can FB and punish regular it is not good.

 

[lordlosh]

REO hate Cassie and Erron Black. His nerf suggestion are just bad as hell.
Cassie is pretty okay character and if anything she needs better KB and FB. Cause right now she has only 1 viable KB, that`s sucks.
Cassie already have bad matches, if they nerf it, she will sucks big time.

 

[Vslayer]

Thx. Yeah maybe I did not remember.
Flawless block gap is only good idea if the normal kick is safe if opponent tries to FB.
If you can FB and punish regular it is not good.

Yeah, that's a weird nerf idea, I would say just make the amp unsafe.

REO hate Cassie and Erron Black. His nerf suggestion are just bad as hell.
Cassie is pretty okay character and if anything she needs better KB and FB. Cause right now she has only 1 viable KB, that`s sucks.
Cassie already have bad matches, if they nerf it, she will sucks big time.

Dude, the nerfs he suggested for Cassie are nothing compared to what people came here to complain about. Those nerfs would not make her suck, at all, she's an amazing character.

 

[lordlosh]

She is amazing at the hands of SonicFox. Every character looks amazing in his hands.
Cassie is the most balanced character in the game. He doesnt have overpowering stuff. His FB sucks hard, she have just 1 viable KB.
If they nerf her even a bit, she would become unusable at pro levels.
Dare to tell me who at pro scene are good with her?

I can show you like 10 videos and Tier List, before SonicFox starting to use her and that she was in the bottom of most tier lists.
Yet SonicFox shows how to play one character and everyone is nerf this on its imba.

Reo suggestion is to nerf Cassie Cage, while her FB sucks, her KB sucks, her combo damage is not big, it`s making absolutely no sense at all.

 

[Hor_PeT]

REO hate Cassie and Erron Black. His nerf suggestion are just bad as hell.
Cassie is pretty okay character and if anything she needs better KB and FB. Cause right now she has only 1 viable KB, that`s sucks.
Cassie already have bad matches, if they nerf it, she will sucks big time.

I do not think REO hates Erron Black as he mains him (at least I see many many Erron match videos).
I do think he made the lot of counter-Erron videos to prove he is not broken and no big nerf needed. But I am not REO and irrelevant for this topic just I shared my oppinion.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

this is amazing!
low key wanna change my avatar to this

View attachment 15176

Would have been a way better choice than your current one...

shudders

Erron is for sure #1. Does he even have any weaknesses?

Disagree. And I fucking hate erron black. He doesn't have many, if any, weaknesses, I agree. But neither does the ACTUAL number 1 character, Sonya. And actually, judging from Viennality, Sonya does really well vs him and can actually outzone the unzonable erron black due to drone drop and the speed of her rings.

He is kinda weak to jump ins according to REO and from my own experience vs him.

 

[Vslayer]

Would have been a way better choice than your current one...

shudders

Rack off

 

[Hor_PeT]

Would have been a way better choice than your current one...

shudders



Disagree. And I fucking hate erron black. He doesn't have many, if any, weaknesses, I agree. But neither does the ACTUAL number 1 character, Sonya. And actually, judging from Viennality, Sonya does really well vs him and can actually outzone the unzonable erron black due to drone drop and the speed of her rings.

He is kinda weak to jump ins according to REO and from my own experience vs him.

I saw Hayateii spammed jump kick and cross ups in Viennality. It even looked bullshit but never anti aired.
Ops I misread sry. Weak against Jump in. Hm I dunno I could easily D2 with Erron most of the time but compared to Cassie he is much weaker of course.

I think there is no point arguing about ordering top tiers.
Especially because match up can varies.

E.g. Erron is good against both Scorpion/Cassie which is a bad news to me however I do not feel me bad against Sonya with both Scorpion/Cassie.
So to me Erron is the No.1 nemesis.

 

[lordlosh]

I do not think REO hates Erron Black as he mains him (at least I see many many Erron match videos).
I do think he made the lot of counter-Erron videos to prove he is not broken and no big nerf needed. But I am not REO and irrelevant for this topic just I shared my oppinion.

Is Reo playing competive in MK11 ? I see him plays many character and explain things a lot, but thats it. I dont see him main Erron Black.
And the nerfs he want for Erron Black is equal to just delete the character. And he probably hates it, because of SonicFox and their feud in MK10.
like 90% of his videos are Erron Black that, Erron Black this. Obviously biased.

And by his tier list you can clearly see he hates Erron and Cassie.
Sorry but you have to be mad biased to place Erron and Cassie infront of Sonya and Geras.
And he have Liu Kang in number 13, really? Liu Kang is top tier for sure. I want talk about all of his strenght but will just mention how easy he won matches with his imba easy 23828372326 KB and his insane FB. Just put him in the zone of his FB and just like that you lose the game.


And how should i take someone opinion seriously with all this tier list crap, when the game so far hasnt recieve any balance patch, yet every months everyone TIER is changing. What that exactly tell you.
Like 2 months ago Reo has completely different tier list, than he have right now.

And last for me on this topic is this:
If you want to balance you can`t just nerf a characters. You will completely shut them that way. The right way is to change things. Nerf this combo/abilities/move but buff others and make others viable.
Geras and Sonya is the easiest characters to balance. With them you just need to remove some of their KB and lower Sonya combo damage. Sonya projectile KB needs to be gone and that is it.
They are perfectly fine.

 

[vegeta]

Would have been a way better choice than your current one...

shudders



Disagree. And I fucking hate erron black. He doesn't have many, if any, weaknesses, I agree. But neither does the ACTUAL number 1 character, Sonya. And actually, judging from Viennality, Sonya does really well vs him and can actually outzone the unzonable erron black due to drone drop and the speed of her rings.

He is kinda weak to jump ins according to REO and from my own experience vs him.

I hate Sonya. She’s straight up BS. After fighting two last night in KL, the first some random talking nonsense like he’s good while I’m guessing wrong in a corner twice and dying for it and the second guy I outplayed the entire match until again I get cornered and die. F*** all of that mkx stuff. I respect no Sonya players atm. She’s too stupid and allows button pressing

EB no opinion yet though he’s a bit annoying I’ve not fought many. The other top tiers have good stuff but are pretty manageable to me though at times I do walk on egg shells against them. Not a geras fan either but Sonya got put on my sh** list for real last night

 

[sars]

She is amazing at the hands of SonicFox. Every character looks amazing in his hands.
Cassie is the most balanced character in the game. He doesnt have overpowering stuff. His FB sucks hard, she have just 1 viable KB.
If they nerf her even a bit, she would become unusable at pro levels.
Dare to tell me who at pro scene are good with her?

I can show you like 10 videos and Tier List, before SonicFox starting to use her and that she was in the bottom of most tier lists.
Yet SonicFox shows how to play one character and everyone is nerf this on its imba.

Reo suggestion is to nerf Cassie Cage, while her FB sucks, her KB sucks, her combo damage is not big, it`s making absolutely no sense at all.

Even if sonic fox didn’t play her, she still top 3 character in the game.

 

[lordlosh]

So who is the other guy that is so good with her and place in top 8, 16 or 32 with her?
Explain how she was at the bottom before SonicFox use it, and after that suddenly she became top tier. Esp. Yaas Queen which everyones was saying s*** so hard, and no one was playing that variation. The moment SonicFox defeats ninjakilla with Yaas Queen i started seeing Cassie is OP, top tier and so on.
Geras, Sonya, Erron all better then her.

 

[sars]

So who is the other guy that is so good with her and place in top 8, 16 or 32 with her?
Explain how she was at the bottom before SonicFox use it, and after that suddenly she became top tier. Esp. Yaas Queen which everyones was saying s*** so hard, and no one was playing that variation. The moment SonicFox defeats ninjakilla with Yaas Queen i started seeing Cassie is OP, top tier and so on.
Geras, Sonya, Erron all better then her.

I mean we only have one person doing good with Erron Black, does that make him not high tier. Can’t go by top 8 placements. Pros are good enough to make there favorite character work in there favor cause they put in the time. Cassie does everything good, she doesn’t have a weakness, she doesn’t have bad matchups. She is honest and takes a smart person to use, but that doesn’t not mean she is not one of the best in the game.

The 7 of us posting in the Cassie forum on day one thought she was mid tier at best, but once you understand all her tools, I think most of us realized how good she was

 

[SubZeroIce]

So who is the other guy that is so good with her and place in top 8, 16 or 32 with her?
Explain how she was at the bottom before SonicFox use it, and after that suddenly she became top tier. Esp. Yaas Queen which everyones was saying s*** so hard, and no one was playing that variation. The moment SonicFox defeats ninjakilla with Yaas Queen i started seeing Cassie is OP, top tier and so on.
Geras, Sonya, Erron all better then her.

"suddenly"

People been saying Cassie is top tier broken and has been a staple for online users since as long as I played online. You can go through this thread or other balance related threads to see. CEO was a week ago too.

Yass Queen definitely seems more viable now after Sonic Fox, I'll give you that but I still don't think the character's problems are variation specific. It's her staggers, some strings and shadow kick I think are OD.

 

[lordlosh]

I mean we only have one person doing good with Erron Black, does that make him not high tier. Can’t go by top 8 placements. Pros are good enough to make there favorite character work in there favor cause they put in the time. Cassie does everything good, she doesn’t have a weakness, she doesn’t have bad matchups. She is honest and takes a smart person to use, but that doesn’t not mean she is not one of the best in the game.

The 7 of us posting in the Cassie forum on day one thought she was mid tier at best, but once you understand all her tools, I think most of us realized how good she was

I can name you few weakness of her right away. Just 1 viable KB, her FB sucks hard. Even when on combo you can miss her FB, SonicFox missed one.
KB and FB are a huge advantage and match decider in a lot of case.

This is a tier list voted by the fans, and this tier list is from 5/14/19
1- Erron Black
2- Noob Saibot
3- Geras
4- Scorpion
5- Sub-Zero
6- Liu Kang
7- Sonya
8- Kung Lao
9- Skarlet
10- Kano
11- Jade
12- Kollector
13- Kabal
14- Jax
15- Raiden
16- Jacqui
17- Cetrion
18- Cassie Cage
19- Johnny Cage
20- Baraka
21- Kitana
22- Frost
23- Shao Kahn
24- Kotal Kahn
25- D'Vorah
This one:

Mortal Kombat 11 Tier List

Ranking the best and worst characters in Mortal Kombat 11

primagames.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/MortalKombat/comments/bjj8p0 Link its from reddit.
1 month later, without balance patch he have completely different Tier list and Cassie Cage is on top.

MK11 Tier List for Best Characters in Aftermath DLC | Official List | Tierlist.gg

The best characters to pick in MK11. Official tier list of TierlistGG. Highest winrates and pickrates. - Created with TierlistGG's Tier Maker

mk11.tierlist.gg

Mortal Kombat 11 - Tier List

Find out how each character ranks and what the best characters are to play with our Mortal Kombat 11 tier list!

allgamers.com

Mortal Kombat 11 Tier List, May 2019: The Best Fighters According To Top Players

With Mortal Kombat 11's first big tournament coming up, the pros have weighed in on which fighters seem especially top tier.

www.thegamer.com

And plenty more. Now if you check july tier list by most Cassie is suddenly at the top 6 of most of them. SonicFox decided to switch to Cassie and suddenly she became in almost everyone top tier list.
They maybe a people that were saying she is top tier in the begining, but that was pretty minor, compare to people that think she was "garbage".

I dont see anything broken in her, instead i see almost perfectly balanced character.
And i do think she had bad match ups.

 

[wsj515]

Cassie forum, this is an important moment. Self regulate like @sars has been doing, or get lumped in with this ^

 

[Vslayer]

You’re not my moma