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Enter the Bane: General Discussion

UPR_Nova

UPR_Nova

Apprentice
Can someone help me understand what his gameplan is? My issue stems from the fact that he does not have any minimal recovering specials, therefore, the need for the opponent to stay grounded against him is unnecessary, at least in my opinion.

What I've always known for grapplers is that you have an option that is absolute death on whiff, then you have an option that will recover fast enough to keep yourself safe when the opponent reads the more damaging option that recovers slower. An obvious example would be universal throw recovering in time to cover yourself if the opponent reads your command throw and decides to neutral jump, jump back, etc. As you Bane monsters already know, the universal grab recovers MUCH SLOWER than the command grab, which makes no sense to me.

This leads me back around to my initial question. Considering all of his special options are generally unsafe, where does the conditioning come in? Why would I, as Bane, condition with venom uppercut, that I'm pretty sure is unsafe but correct me if I'm wrong. Are there tick setups other than d2 that I'm missing? Why not just play Scarecrow if I'm forced to commit to command grab 24/7? The last question isn't really serious but it kind of has SOME truth to it. Thanks in advance for the help!
 
freerf245

freerf245

11 11 11 11
topper2ath said:
Can someone help me understand what his gameplan is? My issue stems from the fact that he does not have any minimal recovering specials, therefore, the need for the opponent to stay grounded against him is unnecessary, at least in my opinion.

What I've always known for grapplers is that you have an option that is absolute death on whiff, then you have an option that will recover fast enough to keep yourself safe when the opponent reads the more damaging option that recovers slower. An obvious example would be universal throw recovering in time to cover yourself if the opponent reads your command throw and decides to neutral jump, jump back, etc. As you Bane monsters already know, the universal grab recovers MUCH SLOWER than the command grab, which makes no sense to me.

This leads me back around to my initial question. Considering all of his special options are generally unsafe, where does the conditioning come in? Why would I, as Bane, condition with venom uppercut, that I'm pretty sure is unsafe but correct me if I'm wrong. Are there tick setups other than d2 that I'm missing? Why not just play Scarecrow if I'm forced to commit to command grab 24/7? The last question isn't really serious but it kind of has SOME truth to it. Thanks in advance for the help!
Click to expand...
Hes got a shitload of tick throws
 
chief713

chief713

Vertebral Subluxationist
topper2ath said:
Can someone help me understand what his gameplan is? My issue stems from the fact that he does not have any minimal recovering specials, therefore, the need for the opponent to stay grounded against him is unnecessary, at least in my opinion.

What I've always known for grapplers is that you have an option that is absolute death on whiff, then you have an option that will recover fast enough to keep yourself safe when the opponent reads the more damaging option that recovers slower. An obvious example would be universal throw recovering in time to cover yourself if the opponent reads your command throw and decides to neutral jump, jump back, etc. As you Bane monsters already know, the universal grab recovers MUCH SLOWER than the command grab, which makes no sense to me.

This leads me back around to my initial question. Considering all of his special options are generally unsafe, where does the conditioning come in? Why would I, as Bane, condition with venom uppercut, that I'm pretty sure is unsafe but correct me if I'm wrong. Are there tick setups other than d2 that I'm missing? Why not just play Scarecrow if I'm forced to commit to command grab 24/7? The last question isn't really serious but it kind of has SOME truth to it. Thanks in advance for the help!
Click to expand...
He has tick throws off B23, B11, D2, D1, 112D and F2D. Pressure comes mostly off of D1. It's +17 on hit. Command grab is 20f startup, B2, B1 (low) are 18f, 17f, F2D, BF1 (overhead) are 24f, 20f. You can also jail into 112D and make them guess between 112D command grab and 112D2.
 
UPR_Nova

UPR_Nova

Apprentice
freerf245 said:
Hes got a shitload of tick throws
Click to expand...
chief713 said:
He has tick throws off B23, B11, D2, D1, 112D and F2D. Pressure comes mostly off of D1. It's +17 on hit. Command grab is 20f startup, B2, B1 (low) are 18f, 17f, F2D, BF1 (overhead) are 24f, 20f. You can also jail into 112D and make them guess between 112D command grab and 112D2.
Click to expand...
Well, evidently I just had a terrible lab period with him. I'm overlooking a TON it seems. Thanks for the input.
 
El_Rubio

El_Rubio

Mortal
Did u watch Madzin Bane vs Semij Catwoman?

Poor Bane, that was the worst match I saw the entire tournament, and I did watch it all!
 
thlityoursloat

thlityoursloat

kick kick
chief713 said:
He has tick throws off B23, B11, D2, D1, 112D and F2D. Pressure comes mostly off of D1. It's +17 on hit. Command grab is 20f startup, B2, B1 (low) are 18f, 17f, F2D, BF1 (overhead) are 24f, 20f. You can also jail into 112D and make them guess between 112D command grab and 112D2.
Click to expand...
You mean either have the 1 or 11 whiff because their hitboxes are abysmal?
 
chief713

chief713

Vertebral Subluxationist
I mean, the timing is tight, I hate it and hope they rework the hitboxes, but it does work. And it's something you have to use unless you wanna be free to MB B3 and backdashes.
 
jharris

jharris

I'm not surprised, motherfuckers
so what are we getting in the patch? faster s1, more health and increased damage,ex specials? not bad, not bad.
 
24K

24K

Mortal
topper2ath said:
Can someone help me understand what his gameplan is? My issue stems from the fact that he does not have any minimal recovering specials, therefore, the need for the opponent to stay grounded against him is unnecessary, at least in my opinion.

What I've always known for grapplers is that you have an option that is absolute death on whiff, then you have an option that will recover fast enough to keep yourself safe when the opponent reads the more damaging option that recovers slower. An obvious example would be universal throw recovering in time to cover yourself if the opponent reads your command throw and decides to neutral jump, jump back, etc. As you Bane monsters already know, the universal grab recovers MUCH SLOWER than the command grab, which makes no sense to me.

This leads me back around to my initial question. Considering all of his special options are generally unsafe, where does the conditioning come in? Why would I, as Bane, condition with venom uppercut, that I'm pretty sure is unsafe but correct me if I'm wrong. Are there tick setups other than d2 that I'm missing? Why not just play Scarecrow if I'm forced to commit to command grab 24/7? The last question isn't really serious but it kind of has SOME truth to it. Thanks in advance for the help!
Click to expand...

No need to constantly commit to a command throw or his d1 tick. You can 11 combo into a command throw. with no hassle and you can stuff a jump in and convert into an air throw.
 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Posted in discord but will post here again for others. B21 after command grab ender will meaty every option harley has on wake up besides backdash and super. In the corner she can only super. If she blocks the low to overhead we are plus. If she doesnt its a super nice splat knockdown into a whole bunch of set up options. Respek it

 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Also in general; meatying short and long delay wake ups works with both B21 and B23 its just that the B21 is plus if they block. However if you think they might block you can always cancel the B23 into grab for the tick
 
M.D.

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
El_Rubio said:

Minute 3:50
Click to expand...
This is exactly what you get when you remove double punch from the character.
Patch will change nothing, as long as there's no safe low damaging, non combo-able move you can spam in them until they finally understand to stay put, he will still be bullied around.

People go ape shit about him being god tier in inj1 (where he also had the safe uppercut mind you) but I didn't see him wrecking batgirl mmh adam superman aquaman bla bla same old 10 more years characters.
 
thlityoursloat

thlityoursloat

kick kick
M.D. said:
This is exactly what you get when you remove double punch from the character.
Patch will change nothing, as long as there's no safe low damaging, non combo-able move you can spam in them until they finally understand to stay put, he will still be bullied around.

People go ape shit about him being god tier in inj1 (where he also had the safe uppercut mind you) but I didn't see him wrecking batgirl mmh adam superman aquaman bla bla same old 10 more years characters.
Click to expand...
I fucking hate his new elbow move. Most unsafe move in the game for piss poor reward. lmoa hol up while I risk eating 40% damage just so I can do 10% (15% if I MB lmfoa), it has its uses but it has no reason at all to be this unsafe.
 
masuhdunkillyall

masuhdunkillyall

Aht Aht Aht!
Do you guys/gals think these changes will help us much? Because I really don't. I posted this in another thread, but I think everyone is overlooking the fact that they said they're nerfing overall damage in favor of slightly more health and damage on MB moves. Faster S1 is nice, but won't be a game changer.

Only Aquaman and Catwoman really got hit with the nerf hammer in areas that will affect our matchup with them, although we already did well against Aqua, so I don't see these changing much. Meanwhile, a ton of mid to low tier characters received some great buffs, making many matchups even tougher.

We can only really tell once we get our hands on patched Bane and see if there's more there, but I am thankful we at least got something.
 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
So the response to me showing how to beat every option on knockdown except 1 is to complain about how hard it is to condition people to do what you want lol. Not to mentiom the entire point of the buffs was to give us better risk reward on armor and make our safe pressure easier to start...

@16 Bit you better not be listening to these retards, they dont deserve Bane
 
M.D.

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
It's a good thing you deserve him then.

Could you please do an overlay over the video we were discussing about showing exactly where Madzin should have applied your tech and win? Because obviously there's nothing wrong with the character, as he has all the options in the game, it's the people that use him that are retards.

If I would have been a proper elitist TYM'er I would have said:
"Please send us a post card when you get out of pools, anywhere. Like..out of your house pool, that's the most probable one."
 
M.D.

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
Better tag him here quick, apparently he's missing out on tech which would have won him evo.
 
Wetdoba

Wetdoba

All too easy...
I would direct you and any other Banes complaining about his conditioning and safety to this tech instead

https://testyourmight.com/threads/jailing-pressure-off-d1-on-hit.64651/

Gaurunteed safe pressure off D1 on hit. Think you can handle playing footsies for 5 seconds and hitting them with 1 long range low poke before getting gaurunteed armored mix up attempts and plus frames or is that too much to ask? Not to mention the buffs will make this easier to do. Any Bane not doing this is playing the character wrong, period.
 
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