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Street Fighter V General Discussion

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
You get such little playtime with F.A.N.G that there's almost no point in him having another costume. It's just something that looks different for the first 5-10 seconds of a fight before he is inevitably dragged and beat down in the corner
Generally curious here. If you were to change something about F.A.N.G and/or the game what would it be?
 
You get such little playtime with F.A.N.G that there's almost no point in him having another costume. It's just something that looks different for the first 5-10 seconds of a fight before he is inevitably dragged and beat down in the corner
yeah sorry but the fact your matches last 20-30 seconds probably have more to do with you whining like a bitch instead of hitting the lab. Just an observation since all the other fangs I see at cpt events seem to be doing better than 0-2 in 45 seconds.
 

Aramonde

Noob
You get such little playtime with F.A.N.G that there's almost no point in him having another costume. It's just something that looks different for the first 5-10 seconds of a fight before he is inevitably dragged and beat down in the corner
FANG isn't a bad character. He was my main before Guile came out and i did well with him in ranked. Buyacushun's FANG is really good he was doing sick mixup's setups that were kicking my ass.
 
There are characters in this game, like any other fighting game that are low tier considered, and in order to win you have to play better and have better strategy, speed of thought, etc. than most people need to win with other stronger characters, it's much harder for any Zangief to win a tournament than a Nash or Ryu for example. The only character that I see as bad is Zangief in SF V, Fang I see as having to overwork but still can be in the mix of top spots, having a Fang win first place at a CPT event and placing #5 and #9 at two other main events speaks of potential, granted it was Xian but still top Ryu and chun Li players have yet to win any. Just some food for thought.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
FANG isn't a bad character. He was my main before Guile came out and i did well with him in ranked. Buyacushun's FANG is really good he was doing sick mixup's setups that were kicking my ass.
FANG is pretty bad. At least by context. He's got some things, but they're either gimmicky or things that other characters might do better. He also gets mollywhopped by the throw game, much moreso than any other character.
 

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
Is there a throw tech OS I'm not aware of?

I got matched with a couple of Platinum players on ranked today (I'm a silver lol) and one of them teched absolutely all my throws. I wasn't making it obvious at all. Is there an OS or did he have a crystal ball that told him I was gonna throw?
 

Aramonde

Noob
Anyone interested in some beginner matches? Someone around Rookie to Silver to get some matches in. My Cammy isn't bad (it's bad) but trying to learn Laura and it's pathetic atm
I'd love to play some with ya (im super bronze atm). Some of these guys have been wiping the floor with me lol.

FANG is pretty bad. At least by context. He's got some things, but they're either gimmicky or things that other characters might do better. He also gets mollywhopped by the throw game, much moreso than any other character.
The throwing system in this game is a bitch for me in general but it did seem way harder with FANG than with Guile now that i think about it.
 

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
They were probably delayed teching Braindead. When you're in a tick throw/frametrap situation just make the gap between your two hits bigger and it should counter-hit the throw tech.

@Undeadjim tried to teach me about it all so I might be wrong of course because I'm a dummy lol.
 

buyacushun

Normalize grab immunity.
Generally curious here. If you were to change something about F.A.N.G and/or the game what would it be?
I would be surprised if he had an actual answer for this. Because that would mean he could actually concentrate hard enough to put thought into a post about a fighting game.

FANG isn't a bad character. He was my main before Guile came out and i did well with him in ranked. Buyacushun's FANG is really good he was doing sick mixup's setups that were kicking my ass.
F.A.N.G. Pretty low tier. He needs some slight buffs and imo fixes (like only the first hit of sweep hitting). He's isn't so bad he can't win but it would take some crazy buffs to make him top 5.
 

Paul the Octopus

Slow Starter
I prefer it more than fighting Mika or Nash.
EDIT: Add fucking Birdie to that list.
What does Birdie do that bodies Zangief? I personally don't find Zangief particularly easy at all. Mid screen, can't Zangief can just smack Birdie with a normal (st hp?) on reaction if Birdie tries to v skill? V skill is quite unsafe, at 50-60 frames of startup plus recovery. And Zangiefs knockdown game seems super dangerous given Birdies lack of invincible wake ups. Birdie also doesn't have a 3 frame normal or great low profiling tools. V skill can be a problem if Birdie manages to get away from Zangief and set it up from full screen, but from mid screen it's quite unsafe and I feel like a good Zangief can keep the pressure on pretty well and prevent Birdie from getting enough space to safely v skill. Birdies slow back walk speed and lack of projectiles means he has one of the toughest times maintaining distance from Zangief.

When I fight Zangief as Birdie I feel like I have a moderate advantage in neutral but if Zangief hits me once I could be done. Meanwhile, Birdies midscreen hits don't result in very good follow ups.
 
I'd love to play some with ya (im super bronze atm). Some of these guys have been wiping the floor with me lol.
Couple buddies and myself started a Discord server after i posted a thread on Reddit "Looking for Sparring Partners" and I got about 15-20 replies. (didn't expect that many)

If you're interested in joining us to level up, let me know. we're all at about the same level Bronze>Silver

If anyone is interested, let me know
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Birdie has

better normals

better command grabs

better damage

better buffers

better anti airs

better gimmicks

better armour

better v skill

better v trigger

better oki
 

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
Couple buddies and myself started a Discord server after i posted a thread on Reddit "Looking for Sparring Partners" and I got about 15-20 replies. (didn't expect that many)

If you're interested in joining us to level up, let me know. we're all at about the same level Bronze>Silver

If anyone is interested, let me know
When I get my new internet I'll definitely be up for it!
 

Paul the Octopus

Slow Starter
Birdie has

better normals

better command grabs

better damage

better buffers

better anti airs

better gimmicks

better armour

better v skill

better v trigger

better oki
Have you ever played the matchup from either characters perspective?

Superficially, most of this is true, and that is why Birdie is probably a significantly better character overall. However, on the Birdie / Zangief matchup specifically, it doesn't seem worse than 6-4 to me (in Birdie's favour). It might even be even honestly.

Where you are most wrong is the command grab, and that's a pretty big deal. Birdie's has less advantage on knockdown and throws them further. He gets no meaty setups or mixups that I'm aware of mid screen and even v skill is unsafe. Zangief gets a meaty/command grab mixup anywhere on screen I'm pretty sure. Hence the big difference in reward once you land a hit, which offsets the difference in neutral (which I agree Birdie wins). Zangief is also one of the few characters who can jump in at a certain angle and beat Birdie's normally godlike cr mp anti air. Zangiefs biggest weakness is also probably zoning/runaway. Birdie has no projectiles and poor walk speed so he can't take advantage of this.

Which character has a better v skill is also debateable and matchup specific IMO, having a parry is pretty damn good and some characters can always punish Birdie v skill on reaction anywhere on screen, making it pretty weak if the opponent knows the matchup.
 
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Have you ever played the matchup from either characters perspective?

Superficially, most of this is true, and that is why Birdie is probably a significantly better character overall. However, on the Birdie / Zangief matchup specifically, it doesn't seem worse than 6-4 to me (in Birdie's favour). It might even be even honestly.

Where you are most wrong is the command grab, and that's a pretty big deal. Birdie's has less advantage on knockdown and throws them further. He gets no meaty setups or mixups that I'm aware of mid screen and even v skill is unsafe. Zangief gets a meaty/command grab mixup anywhere on screen I'm pretty sure. Hence the big difference in reward once you land a hit, which offsets the difference in neutral (which I agree Birdie wins). Zangief is also one of the few characters who can jump in at a certain angle and beat Birdie's normally godlike cr mp anti air. Zangiefs biggest weakness is also probably zoning/runaway. Birdie has no projectiles and poor walk speed so he can't take advantage of this.

Which character has a better v skill is also debateable and matchup specific IMO, having a parry is pretty damn good and some characters can always punish Birdie v skill on reaction anywhere on screen, making it pretty weak if the opponent knows the matchup.
Play keep away and throw out the banana. That banana is a massive deal for Gief as he can't jump over it from most angles without landing on it and can't v skill it. Throw out the banana, then chains and pokes. Keep him out. If he gets in, v reversal or ex bull horn, push him away and keep him out again. If you're getting hit out of v skill by s.hp, you're too close. Learn the range and stay outside of it. The armour is only upper body, so throwing out banana (or the can if you're so inclined) will stuff a charging s.hp.
 

Paul the Octopus

Slow Starter
Play keep away and throw out the banana. That banana is a massive deal for Gief as he can't jump over it from most angles without landing on it and can't v skill it. Throw out the banana, then chains and pokes. Keep him out. If he gets in, v reversal or ex bull horn, push him away and keep him out again. If you're getting hit out of v skill by s.hp, you're too close. Learn the range and stay outside of it. The armour is only upper body, so throwing out banana (or the can if you're so inclined) will stuff a charging s.hp.
I'll try it more but I'm very skeptical of this banana abuse advice. I'm super gold by the way (CFN: paultheoctopus06). While I'm not amazing by any means, I think I do understand the game decently. I have found that Birdies v skill bodies scrubs, as they let me get it out a lot more than they should and then they jump on top of it / get hit for no reason. However, better players know it's a 50 frame startup and many characters can punish on reaction. They also know some can setups are gimmicks and they wait out the banana. I honestly can't think of any matchups where I can repeatedly abuse Birdies v skill.

If I were playing Zangief, and Birdie managed to get banana out, I'd walk up to just outside the banana range and wait for it to disappear. The only thing Birdie gets out of that situation is building meter with two whiffed chains. If Birdie tries to set up a second banana afterward, you are now in range to punish on reaction.

Also, comparing tools in an absolute sense is a a terrible way to determine matchup numbers. If you did that for, say Martian Manhunter vs Lex, you'd see that Martian is better at almost everything, and conclude that Martian probably destroys Lex. Yet, Lex's tools happen to work well in *that particular matchup* and it's even/advantage Lex. Sometimes lower tier characters can beat higher tier ones!
 

Undeadjim

Green Lantern Corps.
They were probably delayed teching Braindead. When you're in a tick throw/frametrap situation just make the gap between your two hits bigger and it should counter-hit the throw tech.

@Undeadjim tried to teach me about it all so I might be wrong of course because I'm a dummy lol.
@Braindead If you were not mixing up your frame trap timings to match your opponents tech timings chances are this is why he was able to tech all your stuff. Because you can tech whilst blocking and with a 5 frame start up and 7 frame tech window you can tech and potentially block at the same time.

Its not as OS like crouch teching was but more the use of 7 frame tech window and being able to tech from blocking, the way to blow this up is provide enough gap for the opponents attempted tech to become a stand throw and hit him during the 5 start up frames giving you the counterhit. (Often why you see neutral jumps work point blank because people are teching late to try and cover both options however whiffing a throw is super bad)