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Juicy IV: Which reportedly 3-7 or worse match ups are a bill?

i dispute this, gl zatanna is 4-6 at worst, no way its 7-3
edit: im not saying you said its 7-3, but that seems to be the consensus on the mu for some reason
U going to have to produce some solid arguments sir, cuz almost everyone has that as 7 3+. I for one am always open to hearing others arguments tho.
 

kevkopdx

Noob
U going to have to produce some solid arguments sir, cuz almost everyone has that as 7 3+. I for one am always open to hearing others arguments tho.
his projectiles are faster, he can mb on hit to bring z into lift distance, his footsies are better, his combo damage is higher, z only has the advantage at full screen... what on earth makes it 7-3?
 

Amplified$hotz

Done with MK1. Stop supporting a scam company
his projectiles are faster, he can mb on hit to bring z into lift distance, his footsies are better, his combo damage is higher, z only has the advantage at full screen... what on earth makes it 7-3?
She rapes him on knockdown and he can't oki on knockdown cause teleport so he has to use an extra bar for OTG while you have a lot due to chip. And trans trade with rocket might be in her favor. Not sure. Doesn't help that his dash is so slow. I hope a dash like that never exists in another fighting game ever again.
 
his projectiles are faster, he can mb on hit to bring z into lift distance, his footsies are better, his combo damage is higher, z only has the advantage at full screen... what on earth makes it 7-3?
His horrible mobility, he gets hella outzoned. She can tele out of his oki. She has a vortex that makes up for damage, she can backdash b1,3. I could go on but I will have to tag @deg222 and @gross since I know they have played this I am pretty sure.
 

kevkopdx

Noob
She rapes him on knockdown and he can't oki on knockdown cause teleport so he has to use an extra bar for OTG while you have a lot due to chip. And trans trade with rocket might be in her favor. Not sure. Doesn't help that his dash is so slow. I hope a dash like that never exists in another fighting game ever again.
but z can really do nothing at sweep range or half screen, gl's footsies are just better and at half screen anything gl blocks can be punished with lift... yes his dash is slow but you do have air missiles, which help a ton
 
Here's the thing about zatanna vs gl that i hear why its bad. Gl's main footsie tool. B13. Its good for getting in but the post b13 meta....zatanna doesn't give a fuck about it. You do b13 minigun. She's gonna block, teleport away and just continue zoning. She massively outzones him. Trading puppet master vs rockets is not a good trade lol also the fact his oki game is non existent against her makes it worse too lol
 

Amplified$hotz

Done with MK1. Stop supporting a scam company
but z can really do nothing at sweep range or half screen, gl's footsies are just better and at half screen anything gl blocks can be punished with lift... yes his dash is slow but you do have air missiles, which help a ton
How do I get into sweep range when you run away? Then if you read an air missile you can throw an up ring and reward my efforts with a nice vortex.
 

kevkopdx

Noob
His horrible mobility, he gets hella outzoned. She can tele out of his oki. She has a vortex that makes up for damage, she can backdash b1,3. I could go on but I will have to tag @deg222 and @gross since I know they have played this I am pretty sure.
deg came up with that number a long time ago and no one has disputed it since, for z to get a vortex, she has to get in on him, if her full screen zoning is her advantage, why would she approach him? tele us so unsafe its not even funny, full combo punish
 

kevkopdx

Noob
How do I get into sweep range when you run away? Then if you read an air missile you can throw an up ring and reward my efforts with a nice vortex.
because if i misread an air missle u should be punishing with an mbmissile...im not saying it isnt in her favor but 7-3 is too much
 
deg came up with that number a long time ago and no one has disputed it since, for z to get a vortex, she has to get in on him, if her full screen zoning is her advantage, why would she approach him? tele us so unsafe its not even funny, full combo punish
Deg still agrees with that number and so do all the top GL players and zatanna players. Like I said, u are open to debate it without a doubt. Maybe there is someone else that agrees with you. But so far, everything u have said has a counter to it (also if she lands a ex trance, she can get a vortex off of it and when she gets trait out, GGs GL as well).
 

Amplified$hotz

Done with MK1. Stop supporting a scam company
because if i misread an air missle u should be punishing with an mb missle
The start up for the air one and the regular one look similar. By the time a realize It went up, I can't punish. Maybe I can dash in. It's up for discussion cause really not many ppl know the zat matchup inside out.
 

ForeverKing

Patreon.com/MK_ForeverKing
:( poor GL I remember you said you played gross at nec with Martian. Was it bad?
He refuses to play that matchup with me more then 2 or 3 games, he immediately goes Aquaman. I don't think he's ever beaten my Martian one single game with Martian lmao. Trust me bro that matchup is hard, Green Lantern gets zoned out pretty harsh. He has better footsies then Martian when he gets in though, except when Martian is in trait. But Martian can just zone and run away until he gets his trait
 

kevkopdx

Noob
Deg still agrees with that number and so do all the top GL players and zatanna players. Like I said, u are open to debate it without a doubt. Maybe there is someone else that agrees with you. But so far, everything u have said has a counter to it (also if she lands a ex trance, she can get a vortex off of it and when she gets trait out, GGs GL as well).
well then i would love to see some recent high level play of zatanna obliterating gl, until then ill just agree to disagree, ive played the mu a ton and i just dont see it as that big of a disadvantage
 
well then i would love to see some recent high level play of zatanna obliterating gl, until then ill just agree to disagree, ive played the mu a ton and i just dont see it as that big of a disadvantage
I mean u brought it up, might as well state ur full argument. People are bound to see it and give their opinions as I haven't heard an opinion like yours on the GL v Zatanna matchup. Tbh, it is interesting and different and that is a good thing since it sparks discussion.
 

Amplified$hotz

Done with MK1. Stop supporting a scam company
well then i would love to see some recent high level play of zatanna obliterating gl, until then ill just agree to disagree, ive played the mu a ton and i just dont see it as that big of a disadvantage
I would love to see it too. As I said not many people know Zatanna too well so I wouldn't be too surprised if people just aren't playing it right.
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Honestly you up play Bane. I think he loses to Batgirl Martian Zod Flash Zatanna and possibly Lex

Although I heard this was also 7-3 Lex's favor because trait and lazers or something.
If so, props to Max for succeeding at a 3-7 and not even being considered a "good Bane player" and stuff.

So I mean if we do lose some MUs, its against characters that really aren't common. We only really lose one semi-badly.

If you don't count like... Superman, everyone with a 2 hit normal, and everyone that has access to MB b.3.
I heard all of those things counter Bane. He might not even be top 10.