Just saying, people are mentioning his d1 being -9 is like so bad, while half the cast has the same thing. It's certainly not an uncommon thing at all.
Ikr? That's why I used the big font, so people won't miss it.
his b1 is a common talked about topic. The whining about his pokes is because I think the general consensus is he's good but just bad/predictable in neutral with minimal ability to get going. (Outside of Thunder God)
Definitely not the end of the world but each character you named has a reliable mid (except tremor).Also why are people talking about Raiden's d1 being -9 is like the end of the world? Let me list you how many characters have fast pokes that are that negative on block:
1- Cassie's d1, 7f, -8
2- Ermac's d1, 6f, -10
3- Jason's d3, 11f, -8 (lmao?)
4- Kano's d1 is 9f, -9, and his d4 is 8f, -7
5- Kitana's d1, 8f, -9
6- Kotal's d4, 6f, -10
7- Predator's d4, 8f, -13
8- Need I talk about Quan's?
9- Scorpion's d1, 6f, -9
10- Shinnok's d1, 6f, -9
11- Subzero's fastest pokes are d1 and d4, both 9f and -6 on block (NotLikeThis)
12- Tremor's d4, 12f, -8
d1 were outright punishable back then, every single one.
Yeah, especially on a whiff. Especially in a game where you can extend KD invulnerability for free.
People talk about "fixing mids" even more. That won't make him neither good nor interesting though.
Yeah, and good luck confirming within 10 frames whether you blocked a d1 or d3, especially when so many characters had low profile or hurtbox lowering d3s.
Nobody said it could be reliably done on reaction, although -13 was enough for some characters to go with default mids without giving a shit whether it was d1, d3 or whether it was a blocked poke at all.
And good players knew that so they blocked. That's how you start mixups.
Did Raidens ever actually punish everything? I barely see or hear about things that leave you next to your opponent and being -7 to -9 (anything more then that it doesn't really matter).
f1 is the best normal punisher in game paired with jax's 1.
I think TG's damage is fair considering his insane meter building. You might sacrifice a slight amount of midscreen damage, but you basically always have armor or a breaker ready to go. I also really wouldn't say his other variations are pure shit. Yes, they have their problems, and as much as I love Raiden it's impossible not to acknowledge his place in the community and tournament scene, but there's a lot going on there. I think it would only take very small changes to make MoS and Displacer worlds better. If all you did was reduce the startup and recovery frames of orbs and teleports just a little bit more he'd be scary.
34% off a f1 punish using a bar of meter is not that good i'd say...its not unfair to have 37%-40% 1 bar bnbs...
I almost never play TG (I like Displacer and MoS myself), so maybe somebody can correct me if I'm wrong. Can't he get more damage off of f1 than 34%? And even if he can't, 34% for a bar isn't bad considering it's your fastest punish. I know for a fact he can get into the 37-40% range you mentioned midscreen. All that aside though, there are two things that make this all a none issue. The first, as I mentioned earlier, is meter. TG can spend meter like there's no tomorrow because he builds it like crazy with those lightning strings. Using a bar for less than optimal damage or even wasting it entirely doesn't hurt him the way it does his other variations. Secondly, Raiden flourishes in the corner and TG does that exceptionally well. Even if these combos did less damage they'd still have that corner carry that puts them in the 50/50 hell where Raiden shines.
he can get 37%-40% dmg from standing 2(9 frame if i m not mmistaken).
if f1 is changed to a 9 frame mid i pretty sure raiden will become top tier again(don't know tho if anyone wants that...)
I didn't mean that f1 didn't punish anything but that it wasn't a major threat. Most of the stuff done in this game is generally safe. How many characters would have to alter their game plan so they don't get hit by f1 everytime raiden blocks some thing?
few but still,it makes punishing much easier...
in your opinion, would it be too much or just made punishing things easier?
a 6 frame mid is too much,a 6 frame high with that hitbox is a perfect punisher.
No offense dude, but I'm confused by this entire paragraph. Why would they need to respect a 9 frame mid when they could just poke out of it? Shocker builds half a bar? I'm not trying to be a dick or anything but I'm just not seeing what you're trying to say at all.
i mean,lets say that in any given situation that raiden is +3 or more frames,the opponent whould not be able to poke cause even a 6 frame poke whould be stuffed by a 9 frame mid.