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Why do we get attacked for calling for nerfs?

South

I'd rather SHOW than TELL ~ Poison Ivy
he was very bad at the beginning. and honestly its not that bad at all. i get in just fine and i play arguable one of the characters that gets zoned out the worst..
But its bull these extremely strong zoning characters have plus on block wakes and safe 50/50s when some of us don't even have a fucking wake up..

How can you not see this
DeadShot - knee is -24 that's free push meterburned its -3 your turn to pressure breh. If delayed can be dashed in between mid/overhead and whiff punish... lab it yourself...
Doctor fate - push is -9 punishes meterburned is neutral
Harley : play doctor
Superman : super
Atrocitus : rage charge
Firestorm : fusion charge
Capt cold : Frost field (count because 12.25%) unblockable damage
Gorilla grodd: negates fates wake up
Robin : sword dance
Bane : bane bomb
Flash : time changer
Fate : F2 (Just Frame punish)
DeadShot : B1
Cyborg : techno tackle
Some characters can use normals so he can be punished
Firestorm dash move everyone on roster can punish with a normal
So...
 

DDutchguy

Stand 4'ing airplanes out of the sky
DeadShot - knee is -24 that's free push meterburned its -3 your turn to pressure breh
Depends. I don't know how many frames of startup Deadshot's D1 has (let's assume 7), but if I have a character with a 10-frame mid or slower Deadshot could still trade with a D1. Or he could just backdash instead.
 

South

I'd rather SHOW than TELL ~ Poison Ivy
Depends. I don't know how many frames of startup Deadshot's D1 has (let's assume 7), but if I have a character with a 10-frame mid or slower Deadshot could still trade with a D1. Or he could just backdash instead.
Deadshots d1 = 8F so it becomes 11 F
Most characters have a 7-8F high or 9F mid to punish if he tries to press a button
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
he was very bad at the beginning. and honestly its not that bad at all. i get in just fine and i play arguable one of the characters that gets zoned out the worst..
But its bull these extremely strong zoning characters have plus on block wakes and safe 50/50s when some of us don't even have a fucking wake up..

How can you not see this
In a fighting game's early lifespan, zoning is almost always more powerful than rush down as mastering hit-confirms, max damaging combos, and anti-wake up attack set ups takes time. For example, when Street Fighter V was released, many players, including me, thought Dhalsim was a top tier character in season one. He ended up being low mid tier. I am not suggesting the same will happen to Deadshot, but the community deserves an opportunity to explore anti-zoning strategies before NRS decides to add 15 recovery frames to the wrist shot as they did to Deathstroke's low gunshots.

Besides, you are a hypocrite whose concern is anything but the game's balance. When you used Martian Manhunter in Injustice 1, you could not careless about the game's balance. Now that you use a character you perceive to be "bottom 5", you whine on these forums on a daily basis, demanding that Scarecrow be buffed and Deadshot be normalized.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Examples .. of nerfs
Csz : B13xxice ball nerf
Jax : overhead dash punch gets raped n never fixed
Ferra torr : oct 4th patch look it up
Deathstroke in very first patch i1 has
Kotal : b1 turned high... damage totem nerf... armor removed etc
Johnny cage : every variation

Examples .. buffs
Kitana went from bottom to top 3 in one patch ... TWICE
Mileena went to the best character in the game arguably after her buffs
Kano commando dumb af
Sektor got buffed
Jason got a 6f -2 d1 with armor breaking setups in one patch made him dumb and etc

These example show why patches are (soap bar in my mouth) for this community... I main DeadShot n Doctor Fate ill say Fate is perfectly fine maybetweak his heal to be on him when summoned but other than that he's balanced n fair. DeadShot maybe add on 5-8F of recovery to his WC, and make his low rifle do 2% -5% less chip damage when meterburned maybe even make his WC have 3F added on startup and he'll be fine. But history SHOWS nrs BUTCHERS characters people CRY AND BITCH about after 1 Day of playing NOBODY labs that mu smh I'm beating Deadshots with Dr Fate n BB for Christ sakes. It's not the character by himself it's the person who's IN CONTROL of the character yall lose to, zoning is a art unlike rushdown 50/50 people to death which yall liked. Now that people can zone y'all got pitch forks n torches on day 1... smh that's why this community has all these tym threads saying a character is trash because the mindset of the community as a WHOLE is "if it ain't broke right away I won't use it" or "if it broke nerf instead of labbing it" that why csz got nerfed hella hard in 4 days @REO made a whole VIDEO explaining how to deal with it and y'all still BITCHED like damn.
So you just quoted only examples of changes you didn't like, while ignoring the numerous changes that either improved characters for the better or literally saved the competitive community from rampant brokenness... :rolleyes:

You can't just quote your greatest hits list and say "Patches are bad mmmkay". Patching literally saved the first Injustice from itself pre-October. It also made MKX an ultimately better game.
 

South

I'd rather SHOW than TELL ~ Poison Ivy
So you just quoted only examples of changes you didn't like, while ignoring the numerous changes that either improved characters for the better or literally saved the competitive community from rampant brokenness... :rolleyes:

You can't just quote your greatest hits list and say "Patches are bad mmmkay". Patching literally saved the first Injustice from itself pre-October. It also made MKX an ultimately better game.
These aren't changes "I liked/disliked" these are changes the community disliked as a whole. And this points out the reason but nrs butchers balanced characters mkx kept becoming more n more trash as game went on. I2 nobody really played after first year so how were the games saved? Only reason mk lasted 2 was because of pot bonuses and the splurge of sponsorships for i2...
 

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
reptile gets zoned out the worst? He has an excellent tool for getting in with force ball, he has pounce for more mobility, and he has a full screen, armored, 6f slide that can punish pretty much every projectile on REACTION and all of them on read, often without chinking the armor because of low profile. Reptile does not get zoned out lol
I didn't say anything about him getting zoned out
 

Shaka

Tier Whore.
SAFE 50/50s, POWERFUL ZONING, AND SAFE WAKEUPS ARE FAIR AND BALANCED. LORD PAULO DID NOTHING WRONG.
ITS A SUPER HERO VIDEO FIGHTING GAME!
ITS SUPPOSED TO BE OVER THE TOP!
CAPCOM DOES IT WITH MARVEL VS SERIES AND PEOPLE LOVE IT.

THIS GAME HAS MECHANICS TO DEFEND FROM EVERYTHING!

PUSHBLOCK FOR HEAVY PRESSURE, BACKDASHES, AIR SCAPES FOR LONG DAMAGING COMBOS, YOU CAN EVEN REFILL SOME OF YOUR LIFE BARS IF YOU MANAGE YOUR METER WELL, B3/F3 UNIVERSAL ARMOR, METERLES INVINCIBLE WAKE UP ATTACKS ETC ETC.

MB ROLLS, TPS, AIR DASHES, DOUBLE JUMPS, FLYING, INTERACTABLES, GOOD WAKE SPEED & A WHOLE BUNCH OF ANTI-ZONING TOOLS TO DEAL WITH IT, EVEN MOST PROJECTILES ARE HIGHS UNLIKE MOST 2D FIGHTERS WHICH MOST PROJECTILES ARE MIDS!
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
These aren't changes "I liked/disliked" these are changes the community disliked as a whole. And this points out the reason but nrs butchers balanced characters mkx kept becoming more n more trash as game went on. I2 nobody really played after first year so how were the games saved? Only reason mk lasted 2 was because of pot bonuses and the splurge of sponsorships for i2...
Lol no, you are voicing your individual opinion here. Most people agree that MKX got better over time. The changes to reduce easy armored launchers and cheap plus frames into setplay etc. went a long way towards helping the meta.

I don't see anybody complaining about buffed Jason players taking over tournaments. You just kind of wrote what you were upset about and passed it off as community opinion.
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
As for Deadshot, I get what it's the problem with him in particular, it is that he can just shot the projectiles without the need to get close at all, there is no limit to backdashes like there is in MKX, he can create combos just from his meter-burn Machine Gun alone, and of course he can build all of that meter from the projectiles in addition to chip damage with them, so he can use the meter-burn projectiles even more. I saw @PND_Ketchup and @PND_Mustard playing in a stream against a Deadshot player who just kept back dashing and shot the projectiles, with no real keepaway approach or space control, and when you see these too complain, you know something can be argued. Like I said in the past, I used Reptile in MKX to catch people with Forceballs, and do a full combo to keep them away, and if they did managed to get close to me, or I couldn't zone them at all, I still had some tools from up close to use, and even from full screen I could've use EX Slide at the right moment. Not to be a jerk or anything, but that is a much more respectful way of Zoning and keep away, unlike the braindead approach that this particular Deadshot player used.

Of course it is still too early as the game isn't even one week old, so we need to check things out, and if you can't deal with a certain character, you can pick a different character. as a counter pick Of course you can be a character loyalist (hell I was a character loyalist like 98% of my time in both MK9 and MKX), but if you are gonna do so, you need to take into account the MU's and the issues that they can deal to you. Don't scream for buffs and nerfs just to help your own character, because that is flawed too.

EDIT: Just making myself clear, the issue here is that Deadshot can be used in a very braindead way (which can be said about also about other Zoners and Rushdowners a like), if your opponent use Deadshot in the right way, then that's good. Of course you still need to find a way to overcome this issue too, and like I said earlier, it's still too early.

I didn't say anything about him getting zoned out
So who did you mean to say that wag getting zoned out? Because sure as hell Reptile was never like that, and he was never bad at MKX, he only got better overall, and now he's extremely strong. And not only he doesn't get zoned out, he can zone very well himself.
 
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ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
Answering the op:

You will get attacked, because to be able to ask for buffs/nerfs, you need to know the game at some extent. Game has been out less than one week, ergo, nobody really knows anything about the game deeply enough to talk about balance. Anything besides pointing out obvious bugs (like the one with Aquaman's trait) or infinites, is out of place now.

Balance discussions now, in one direction or another, are full of misinformation and mistakes and, if devs take them seriously, can lead to overnerfs or overbuffs that hurt the game.

In summary: play the damn game before asking for changes.
 

Tweedy

Noob
In a fighting game's early lifespan, zoning is almost always more powerful than rush down as mastering hit-confirms, max damaging combos, and anti-wake up attack set ups takes time. For example, when Street Fighter V was released, many players, including me, thought Dhalsim was a top tier character in season one. He ended up being low mid tier. I am not suggesting the same will happen to Deadshot, but the community deserves an opportunity to explore anti-zoning strategies before NRS decides to add 15 recovery frames to the wrist shot as they did to Deathstroke's low gunshots.

Besides, you are a hypocrite whose concern is anything but the game's balance. When you used Martian Manhunter in Injustice 1, you could not careless about the game's balance. Now that you use a character you perceive to be "bottom 5", you whine on these forums on a daily basis, demanding that Scarecrow be buffed and Deadshot be normalized.
Why is deadshot also a mix monster up close? He's not just a zoner. He's a MKX character + a zoner. I'm not a fan of early patches but can we please stop with acting like people just hate deadshot because he zones?
 

South

I'd rather SHOW than TELL ~ Poison Ivy
Lol no, you are voicing your individual opinion here. Most people agree that MKX got better over time. The changes to reduce easy armored launchers and cheap plus frames into setplay etc. went a long way towards helping the meta.

I don't see anybody complaining about buffed Jason players taking over tournaments. You just kind of wrote what you were upset about and passed it off as community opinion.
Ok buddy I don't want type in this thread anymore pce you got it I'm the only one who feels that way about mkx. Most definitely pce I'm out
 

South

I'd rather SHOW than TELL ~ Poison Ivy
Why is deadshot also a mix monster up close? He's not just a zoner. He's a MKX character + a zoner. I'm not a fan of early patches but can we please stop with acting like people just hate deadshot because he zones?
Character that needs to be "nerfed" surprised you ain't picked him up over one string n trait superman.
 

ismael4790

Stay focused or get Caged
Why is deadshot also a mix monster up close? He's not just a zoner. He's a MKX character + a zoner. I'm not a fan of early patches but can we please stop with acting like people just hate deadshot because he zones?
Even if his f23 turned non special cancelable, even if f2 became a mid, I'm sure people would still complain.

The main problem is simple: many players have no patience to deal with zoners, and less patience to lab, which is needed to deal with zoning.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
I'm ready for anything, I was just curious why people get so upset for people pointing out stuff early on.
...because NRS listens.

They take into account the community's position while looking at actual data from their servers and decide from there what to do.
 
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SadoDragon

PSN: Darksadodragon
ITS A SUPER HERO VIDEO FIGHTING GAME!
ITS SUPPOSED TO BE OVER THE TOP!
CAPCOM DOES IT WITH MARVEL VS SERIES AND PEOPLE LOVE IT.

THIS GAME HAS MECHANICS TO DEFEND FROM EVERYTHING!

PUSHBLOCK FOR HEAVY PRESSURE, BACKDASHES, AIR SCAPES FOR LONG DAMAGING COMBOS, YOU CAN EVEN REFILL SOME OF YOUR LIFE BARS IF YOU MANAGE YOUR METER WELL, B3/F3 UNIVERSAL ARMOR, METERLES INVINCIBLE WAKE UP ATTACKS ETC ETC.

MB ROLLS, TPS, AIR DASHES, DOUBLE JUMPS, FLYING, INTERACTABLES, GOOD WAKE SPEED & A WHOLE BUNCH OF ANTI-ZONING TOOLS TO DEAL WITH IT, EVEN MOST PROJECTILES ARE HIGHS UNLIKE MOST 2D FIGHTERS WHICH MOST PROJECTILES ARE MIDS!
Yea but the people who watch esl hate it and to be honest it was boring watch both people shooting projectiles full screen all day.
 
Reactions: GAV

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Why is deadshot also a mix monster up close? He's not just a zoner. He's a MKX character + a zoner.
This couldn't be further from the truth. I saw your match with Sonic, the best player in the world, using Deadshot. You didn't lose because he "was a mix monster up close". In face, 90% of the times you got in you we pressuring him, dealing heavy damage, putting him in the corner. The only thing he did up close was low damage combos that knocked you away with the exception of that 1 corner combo in 3 games total. So if that's you, against Sonic, playing Superman, imagine how bad a lot of other Deadshots get blown up close. I wouldn't compare this to characters like Captain Cold and Canary who are actual MKX characters on steroids.

I2 in no way resembles Marvel competively.
Just like Inj2 does not resemble MKX competitively.