Which comic character has the best rogues gallery?

[Compbros]

Because that would be outside the realms of true Justice. Batman is a symbol. He doesn't want to convey that sense of corruptness.

True Justice? Handing them over to the police and going to court is true justice? I'm not saying he kidnaps Joker, I'm saying why doesn't Bruce Wayne talk to the judge about an alternative prison construct for Joker and build it?

 

[TakeAChance]

he's a vigilante, he doesn't need to be a good guy in the public, he needs to be effective and efficient.

Right...but if you want to have a vigilante like that, write your own book about a vigilante like that.

Batman just doesn't kill. He is a Vigilante but it's more about what he represents.

In Batman's mind...if Dick, Jason, Tim or anyone else kill someone that he could directly prevent, he holds himself responsible.

 

[TakeAChance]

True Justice? Handing them over to the police and going to court is true justice? I'm not saying he kidnaps Joker, I'm saying why doesn't Bruce Wayne talk to the judge about an alternative prison construct for Joker and build it?

Because The Joker cannot go to prison. He is insane.

 

[randomdude]

Right...but if you want to have a vigilante like that, write your own book about a vigilante like that.

Batman just doesn't kill. He is a Vigilante but it's more about what he represents.

In Batman's mind...if Dick, Jason, Tim or anyone else kill someone that he could directly prevent, he holds himself responsible.

because he's insane, he doesn't have to kill every thug. the joker deserves it though. and i agree with what compbros said, he could make a prison for him.

Because The Joker cannot go to prison. He is insane.

he has super insanity, which is the same as super bullshit. he wants to be insane.

edit: why stick to the laws if they're flawed?

 

[Compbros]

Because The Joker cannot go to prison. He is insane.

An isolated Psych Ward just for Joker then? One Psychiatrist a week is taken there blindfolded by Bruce Wayne. This prevents the psychiatrist from getting manipulated by Joker.

 

[TakeAChance]

because he's insane, he doesn't have to kill every thug. the joker deserves it though. and i agree with what compbros said, he could make a prison for him.



he has super insanity, which is the same as super bullshit. he wants to be insane.

edit: why stick to the laws if they're flawed?

The same question could be asked about our current society...could you imagine our world without law?

 

[Compbros]

Also, Joker may be insane but he is shown to be more than aware of his actions and more than capable of constructing elaborate plans and executing them. He even gets henchman and such to do work for him. He knows what is needed for the things he wants to do and he gets them. There has to come a point where "insane" can't be used and around the 40th time should be that time.


Two-Face is insane, split personality and no control over his actions at times. He can be sent to Arkham and treated, Joker is something else.

 

[TakeAChance]

An isolated Psych Ward just for Joker then? One Psychiatrist a week is taken there blindfolded by Bruce Wayne. This prevents the psychiatrist from getting manipulated by Joker.

A lawyer would be on that in a heart beat. Segregation as well as undue punishment...as ironic as that is.

A week is probably to much time for corruption

 

[randomdude]

The same question could be asked about our current society...could you imagine our world without law?

uhm... let's not compare worlds. my point is that batman is actually insane, he's not that good of a hero/vigilante. i could live with killing a bad guy way more easily than with letting a TON of people die.

 

[TakeAChance]

Also, Joker may be insane but he is shown to be more than aware of his actions and more than capable of constructing elaborate plans and executing them. He even gets henchman and such to do work for him. He knows what is needed for the things he wants to do and he gets them. There has to come a point where "insane" can't be used and around the 40th time should be that time.


Two-Face is insane, split personality and no control over his actions at times. He can be sent to Arkham and treated, Joker is something else.

Would you try to paint the Joker sane in the court of law as a lawyer?

Two-Face does go to arkham. He is insane.

Most of Batman's villains are insane. That's why I like them.

 

[DuskAlloy]

The same question could be asked about our current society...could you imagine our world without law?

The difference is that our law system does work for the most part, the law system in the DC universe does not work at all

 

[Compbros]

A lawyer would be on that in a heart beat. Segregation as well as undue punishment...as ironic as that is.

A week is probably to much time for corruption

People are segregated in prisons all the time (pedophiles as they would be beaten, possibly to death). Undue Punishment? In what sense? He still gets the "help he needs" and it's not a cruel construct with him having to lick up his own piss with his tongue.



Daily sure isn't doing anything.

 

[TakeAChance]

uhm... let's not compare worlds. my point is that batman is actually insane, he's not that good of a hero/vigilante. i could live with killing a bad guy way more easily than with letting a TON of people die.

You are applying real world interpretations to events tho.

In the Batman universe, Batman IS a really good vigilante. I do agree with you that Batman is infact insane.

A great graphic novel that depicts this is Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth.

I reccomend trying to read that right away.

To us, that decision is made easy. To Batman, he became what he was because someone with that exact mentality (willing to kill people to get what they wanted) took away the two things he loved in life (his parents.)

 

[TakeAChance]

The difference is that our law system does work for the most part, the law system in the DC universe does not work at all

Really? Look at the guy who dressed as the joker and shot out a movie theater in Colorado. Has he been sentenced? I do believe IIRC (which I may not) he was deemed insane. He will face no death penalty...he will remain in a institution.

Same situation with the Joker.

 

[DuskAlloy]

Really? Look at the guy who dressed as the joker and shot out a movie theater in Colorado. Has he been sentenced? I do believe IIRC (which I may not) he was deemed insane. He will face no death penalty...he will remain in a institution.

Same situation with the Joker.

If that man broke out 40 seperate times he would either get enough security on his ass that it wouldnt happen again or he would end up being killed whether by death penalty or just someone getting rid of him

 

[Compbros]

Would you try to paint the Joker sane in the court of law as a lawyer?

Two-Face does go to arkham. He is insane.

Most of Batman's villains are insane. That's why I like them.

Not at all, but, as a judge, I also wouldn't allow a plea of insanity given how elaborate some of the stuff he does is. Even beyond being elaborate, he does things with the express intent of maiming or killing people.

I was using him as an example in contrast to the way Joker is.

Most heroes have insane villains: Spidey has Carnage, Venom, and Norman (as well as JJJ really).

 

[TakeAChance]

People are segregated in prisons all the time (pedophiles as they would be beaten, possibly to death). Undue Punishment? In what sense? He still gets the "help he needs" and it's not a cruel construct with him having to lick up his own piss with his tongue.



Daily sure isn't doing anything.

People are segregated WITHIN prisons, but they are not isolated to their own. All inmates can face solitary confinement. In this case, only the joker would have such "special treatment"

 

[randomdude]

In the Batman universe, Batman IS a really good vigilante.

he's not, maybe he thinks he is. he lets a lot of people die everyday.

 

[Compbros]

People are segregated WITHIN prisons, but they are not isolated to their own. All inmates can face solitary confinement. In this case, only the joker would have such "special treatment"

Special circumstances for a special case. There's never been ANYTHING like Joker, clearly more has to be done at some point.

 

[TakeAChance]

he's not, maybe he thinks he is. he lets a lot of people die everyday.

I don't think a lot of people in Gotham would rather NOT have him.

 

[xWEBSx]

No clue. Daredevil and Elektra were given shots, Superboy was given a shot, Black Panther was given a shot, Static Shock was given a shot, Titans/Young Justice was given a shot. Whim of Hollywood.


Edit: You still didn't answer my question about "Would Batman's Gallery still be great without other media".

I believe it absolutely would.
You have go break down the dynamic (we will choose Batman for the example) and in the end they go hand in hand.. Batman is a human who uses his head to defeat "super" powers and an insane list of bad guys/situations. Many quicker, stronger, has some type of advantage over him. People can relate to this, making him popular (give him the added bells and whistles of a sleek and favorable costume, an arsenal of fun gadgets, and excellent martial arts prowess) people want to see more and more of him... Now a character with all the above cant sustain alone, he needs drama, he needs enemies (Superman's downfall)..as you had mentioned, his top rogues are only worth it and arguably number 4-5, but those 4-5 are SO great and interact with Batman SO well that it just boosts the secondary rogues ad they compliment one another, in turn making them more formidable. (Not to mention his 4-5 top rogues are better than MANY characters entire rogues gallery)

Now add together ALL the above and you get an equation that makes people want more and more, which propels Batman into the limelight and mass media outlet. In turn bringing in more fans and visibility. Batman did not luck out.. He has all the pieces to be where he is, his rogues have a big part to play in this success.

 

[TakeAChance]

Special circumstances for a special case. There's never been ANYTHING like Joker, clearly more has to be done at some point.

I am glad you think so...definitely best villain criteria...am I right?

 

[DuskAlloy]

I am glad you think so...definitely best villain criteria...am I right?

No because the same thing could be said about nearly every super villain, but we are using joker as an example, characters like bane or lex or captain cold should be dead but atleast captain cold and lex have the exscuse of not being average

 

[DuskAlloy]

I believe it absolutely would.
You have go break down the dynamic (we will choose Batman for the example) and in the end they go hand in hand.. Batman is a human who uses his head to defeat "super" powers and an insane list of bad guys/situations. Many quicker, stronger, has some type of advantage over him. People can relate to this, making him popular (give him the added bells and whistles of a sleek and favorable costume, an arsenal of fun gadgets, and excellent martial arts prowess) people want to see more and more of him... Now a character with all the above cant sustain alone, he needs drama, he needs enemies (Superman's downfall)..as you had mentioned, his top rogues are only worth it and arguably number 4-5, but those 4-5 are SO great and interact with Batman SO well that it just boosts the secondary rogues ad they compliment one another, in turn making them more formidable. (Not to mention his 4-5 top rogues are better than MANY characters entire rogues gallery)

Now add together ALL the above and you get an equation that makes people want more and more, which propels Batman into the limelight and mass media outlet. In turn bringing in more fans and visibility. Batman did not luck out.. He has all the pieces to be where he is, his rogues have a big part to play in this success.

Superman has good villains, what do you mean superman's down fall lol

 

[Compbros]

-snip-

OK, if it would be then why would you bring up "popularity" as a criteria when that has nothing to do with how good a character is? Notability does not equal greatness, that's all I was saying.


I may respond to your points anyway though.

I am glad you think so...definitely best villain criteria...am I right?

No, idiotic justice system and DC Universe.



Edit: My main point is that Batman's Gallery is not as great as people think IMO.

Edit 2: Huge thunderstorm is coming so I may be forced outta this convo for a while.

Edit 3: Yeah, I'm definitely responding to this.

Edit 4: When I say there's never been anything like Joker I mean that there's never been someone that has killed so many on several occasions that merely is sent to a place that he has escaped innumerable times before. With Joker it's just a cycle and people refuse to break that cycle.

Carnage is just like Joker: Crazy as hell, funny, takes pleasure in killing, destruction and carnage. But he has been sent to multiple different places for rehabilitation and has rarely escaped these facilities (there's like 5 arcs of Carnage).