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Question What makes MK9 stand out?

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Mike, I love you and all but this is insane. Wondering what Kabal would be like in MKX if you just teleported him into the game without making him suitable for it is a moot point and proves nothing. What matters is what he was like in the game he was in... As an overall character, he was no doubt more OP/broke than anything in MKX. Yes, maybe not as straightforward, required more execution/reads, and was more fun to watch/play (until everyone picked him up and it got tedious), but that character didn't even have a single 5/5 match-up.

I really think people are talking about this with some serious revisionist history. That wasn't the narrative in 2012/2013 at all. Kabal was fucked up and almost ruined the game.
well..my point was based on a what if. A made up point that will never exist. In my opinion, if kabal was to be teleported into MKX, he wouldn't be top tier.
 

Soul Bound X

Kombatant
Mike, I love you and all but this is insane. Wondering what Kabal would be like in MKX if you just teleported him into the game without making him suitable for it is a moot point and proves nothing. What matters is what he was like in the game he was in... As an overall character, he was no doubt more OP/broke than anything in MKX. Yes, maybe not as straightforward, required more execution/reads, and was more fun to watch/play (until everyone picked him up and it got tedious), but that character didn't even have a single 5/5 match-up.

I really think people are talking about this with some serious revisionist history. That wasn't the narrative in 2012/2013 at all. Kabal was fucked up and almost ruined the game.
Not almost, he succeeded in ruining the game. At least for me. He is the reason why a lot of people were so ready for injustice, and the reason we will never go back despite all of the praises mk9 is getting in this thread. Kabal makes mk9 not fun.
 

coolwhip

Master
well..my point was based on a what if. A made up point that will never exist. In my opinion, if kabal was to be teleported into MKX, he wouldn't be top tier.
I mean probably, yeah. But if he were to be adjusted to be just as broke as he was in mk9 he'd be the best in the game by far.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
Why is everyone focusing on $ when I clearly listed

$
Evo
Esl
MLG

Things that are bigger than local and majors
If the community wanted to run a side tournament at EVO, it could happen. The community has to love the game enough to make that happen. Also, if people are dropping MKX because no ESL or no EVO, they probably didn't like the game as much as they claim. Only so many games can be on the main stage at EVO. It's kind of irrational to base what games you play off that, but I know some people do. The point is, you can build up a competitive scene for a game without big cash prizes, or the hype of EVO main stage. There needs to be a large community and some organization by that community to make it happen.

Super Turbo has a series of events called X-Mania. It's all community driven and has players travelling worldwide to compete. They had some finals at EVO last year but Evo didn't give them a lot of attention like they should have. Now, I think the finals are held in Japan.
 

YoloRoll1stHit

Publicly Educated
This kabal super plus block advantage was another lie, aside from 2ndc which was +9, very dificult to jail consistently and only jailed because he had an 8f jab that was high, REO has proved that it was nearly impossible to jail people forever, aside from that all his NDC options were +1 and +2 on block, tops. and there were always gaps in between followups going from 5 to 12 frames of gap.

B12~NDC was +2 with a gap in between b1 and 2. F32~hooks and B12~hooks had a gap
People didn't explored much but the saw at point blank range was -14 or -15 sadly this was discovered later in the end of the lifspan of the game, character with 13 frames moves or under could punish the saw for days at point blank.


And he was the best character in the game.
Because too many characters don't have armors at all, and there are only a few armored launchers, back dash wasn't a defensive option in MK9. Kabal only needs a few plus frame to rape people with his mids
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
I mean probably, yeah. But if he were to be adjusted to be just as broke as he was in mk9 he'd be the best in the game by far.
Sure. But that wasn't my point. I know they are different games but defense is defense. Defense against Kabal was tough but in MKX that wouldn't even be the worst of it cause he wouldn't even be top tier.
 

coolwhip

Master
Sure. But that wasn't my point. I know they are different games but defense is defense. Defense against Kabal was tough but in MKX that wouldn't even be the worst of it cause he wouldn't even be top tier.
Sure, but the problem is, in MK9, if you play just about anyone other than Kung Lao, Sonya and maybe a couple of other characters, you're fucked against Kabal. At least in MKX, due to better character balance, your offensive options might compensate.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
the thing about kabal is, it was almost never your turn, anywhere on the screen. Fullscreen? your playing kabals game. Midscreen? your playin kabals game. Close up? Your playing Kabals game. There was no part of the screen in which Kabal did not dictate the pace of the match. No character in Mkx comes anywhere close to the overall opressiveness that is Mk9 Kabal.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
the thing about kabal is, it was almost never your turn, anywhere on the screen. Fullscreen? your playing kabals game. Midscreen? your playin kabals game. Close up? Your playing Kabals game. There was no part of the screen in which Kabal did not dictate the pace of the match. No character in Mkx comes anywhere close to the overall opressiveness that is Mk9 Kabal.
Kabal was dominant because he was a overall good character he excels at all ranges for sure, but it wasn't against everyone in the cast, the reason he ended up being dominant was due the fact he could zone character who were stronger than him up close and mid range, and rushdown characters who were stronger against him in zoning.

Some of these characters either lacked a good armor or a good 10f starter to interrupt his gaps.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
EVO, FR, NWM, various majors & events all over
That's what I thought


So you're telling me these guys all ONLY came and ONLY signed up for this? Dude ..... Honestly and no offense but are we joking around now?

If I looked it up I bet these people also signed up for sfv sfv4 mvc or something
 

coolwhip

Master
I also think because we're so far removed from playing MK9, some of its fucked up aspects is being sort of swept under the rug. Like, it's easy to say, "yeah, the game needed another patch because the balance was terrible" and leave it at that. But go back and play it, get touched by Cyrax once, lose the round, then come back here... Let me know how that feels, and if it's not worse than MKX's 50/50's.

I think MK9's characters were more fun, unique and diverse on average. And I do prefer the game's neutral game to MKX's neutral game. But honestly it's about the only things MK9 did better over MKX. In a perfect world where every glitch is removed and the balance wasn't shit, would MK9 be fantastic? Sure. The problem is, these are not minor issues. It's dumb to say "if only the balance and the glitches were fixed," as if these are some two minor issues. MK9 needed far more than just "another patch," honestly. And I'm saying this as someone who considers it my favorite fighting game of all time.
 

RTM2004

Revenant Jade
Somehow MK9 people failed to mention MK9 Smoke?

Have you forgotten 70% Smoke Bomb Resets? Smoke's safe B2 OH that leads into resets?

Smoke's D3 for counterpokes and D4 poke which opens up Throw and B2 opportunities

Let alone, Smoke's S2 gdlk AA which countered all types of jump in attacks even far range jump kicks. S2 AA or as a punish lead to Smoke Bomb resets. Hell even, D1 anti-cross up lead to Smoke Bomb resets.

Smoke also had EX Smoke Away with invincible wake ups (which MKX does not have)

Smoke was designed to ruin zoning characters (SHAKE). Poor Freddy, Noob, Sindel, especially poor Shang Tsung.

Very few characters can punish safe Smoke Bomb.

No one mentioned MK9 Jax's broken corner reset.

Can we not pretend that MK9 was this fabulous perfect game? It had very deep issues and we all know it.

If you didn't main Top/High tier in MK9 then you would have no results
1.) Kabal 2.) Kenshi 3.) Sonya 4.) Cyrax 5.) Freddy Krueger 6.) Smoke 7.) Kung Lao 8.) Johnny 9.) Kitana

Picking Low Tier is not an option Baraka, Cyber Sub-Zero, Sheeva, Kano, Jade, Sindel, Nightwolf, Raiden

Even picking high Mid to low Mid Tier won't cut it in MK9 Sektor, Shang Tsung, Liu Kang, Mileena, Reptile, Quan Chi

Observing MKX I can only describe it as an Injustice Flash & Batgirl type of game. Very offensive play which favors the aggressor, heavy mix up play, 50/50 mind guessing but with an option to make it SAFE (which shouldn't exist), steroid movement with run feature, there's no invincible wake ups which makes the corner game overpowering like Injustice Wonder Woman 50/50 or Doomsday smothering which also reminded us of MK9 corner game Kenshi Johnny Cage, Sonya and Jax.

MK9 was both offensive and defensive rewarding except some characters ruined it (Kabal zoning and NDC, Kenshi loaded with armor and Spirit Charge, Sonya's safe EX Cartwheel, Johnny's F3 suffocating normal, Cyrax death resets and Smoke's pressure anti-zoning resets, Bird Lao). Overpowered D4s like Mileena/Sonya.

Injustice was too defensive, Zod's back dash, run away game, control all interactables, Zod balls and lasers. Sinestro B12, trait and his own 50/50 vortex, Martian controlled the entire screen presence which is what Kabal did. Then there was Batgirl and Flash who dominated the aggressive 50/50 offense department. Aquaman was outrageous and carried an extremely broke trait.

MKX looks good and be thankful it has been supported longer than what MK9 and Injustice received from NRS. It just needs better balancing among the roster. Also, finding the balance between rush down characters and defensive characters, it's too much Flash-Batgirl type at this stage. Don't over-nerf characters like what Tremor and Tanya received EXCEPT MK9 Kano and Jade received the worst nerfs historically ever to being useless.

Removing the SAFE mix up option would be better, MK9 Scorpion & Quan Chi vortex mix up is what it should be, either commit to it and opponent guess right, you deserve punishment but if it worked you get rewarded similar in gimmicks that of MK9 Mileena commits to B3~EX Roll.

MKX CAN be fixed as not all hope is lost. #KP3orPatch

MK9 could NOT be fixed or saved whatsoever (engine, input bugs, meter drain, glitches, character design/balance).
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
That's what I thought


So you're telling me these guys all ONLY came and ONLY signed up for this? Dude ..... Honestly and no offense but are we joking around now?

If I looked it up I bet these people also signed up for sfv sfv4 mvc or something
That doesn't matter. Who says you can't play multiple games, including the one you like the most? It doesn't matter if they signed up for every game at EVO. They showed up and supported their non-EVO circuit game as well. There's no reason people couldn't run more than one NRS game at a major. Instead of all these talking heads going on about the ye old days of yore about MK9, why not run it side by side everything else from within the community?

Also, relevant: https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=Tj0IeXaGf5s

That's from NCR 2016.

https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=eZbbAt8Cqhk

Super Turbo 2 Grand Finals 2016 at Combo Breaker

https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=5-ltvXEYsKM

That's from EVO 2016
 
mk9's story mode was dope. Kabal was fun. Eric Warda and REO made him ruin the game for some people. Shame the US never saw enough of Skarlet to realize how trully broken she was.
 

IrishMantis

Most humble shit talker ever!!!
A lot of good mentions already, but I thought the dash/dash blocking system was going to be the new MK stardard because it felt amazing. They need to go with an improved MK9 with MK11...off with it's head when it comes to the MKX run system and stamina.
This I definitely disagree with

The block dash was the most clunky looking thing I ever seen .

IMO the run looks much better, if they balanced the run it could work much better in future games or hell even have no run.

The dash cancel system was one of the reasons the game got shat on by how ugly it looked
 

Biggs

FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
Sonya didn't win shit.
Evo 2014 ring any bells? Your argument that a character is irrelevant because they don't have as many tournament wins is lazy at best. You really have to ask yourself one question: Really how many "Top" Sonya players were there? Your other argument that since you don't seem to lose vs Sonya with Cage means she isn't as good as people say is also very flawed too. Sonya does beat Cage...
@xKhaoTik
@RM AtK!
 

NKZero

Warrior
Many people have answered OP's question already so I'll refrain from that.

What I will say is how I think MKX can improve, and the answer I thought most agreeable was m2dave's.

- give characters greater variety in gameplay: we knew that each character can fulfil a function in MK9 e.g. Smoke was the anti-zoner, Kenshi was mid-range zoning, Sektor was footsies and oki and so on...and I think to accomplish this, variations need to be removed. It was a good idea on paper and a way to incentivise people into playing their favourite character across the spectrum rather than resorting to changing character for match-up counters, but it hasn't really panned out as well as it should. Give a character all the tools instead of dividing him/her into 3 parts.

- tone down the 50/50s: it's ok if a character has an overhead/low mix-up but don't let both lead to full combos or don't make both of them safe options. If a character generally lacks in footsie tools or space control etc., then you can make him that epic vortex comeback character. MK9 had Scorpion and Quan Chi for that purpose. Otherwise make one of the options knockdown. Maybe only give the character either a low/overhead combo starter and compensate the lack of the other by giving strong mid stagger strings and good space controlling pokes and specials.

- control the run button: it's very OP atm. I like it because of the added mobility it gave, and MKX surely plays better than MK9 in that regard. But either tone it down or amend it for different characters more than it is already, or just flat out remove it and find an alternative way to make movement more fluid. Run makes rushing down the only real strategy in this game, which results in the lack of variety I alluded to above.

Those are the 3 main things that would make what's already a great game in MKX infinitely better. MK9 had the ideas but bad execution and some bug issues that couldn't be resolved. MKX should have built off that.
 

SHAOLIN

内部冲突
Read some of the recent posts last night and I thought if I get some sleep my opinion would change or I will feel differently about. . . nope.

Pig I am appalled, shame & worry that you think that is not OK or somethings wrong if a group of people still play a fighting game that has lost its spotlight.

From your recent posts can tell that you consider playing Netherrealm Studio games as more of a business than a hobby. I don't know if you've ever considered fighting games as a hobby or like it in the first place but yeah I can't tell anymore LOL

Since you are considered a leader in our community, talk like that could easily trickle down to lower levels but I feel like that's another topic for another day.

NEWS FLASH! Not every competitor play for medals and money, they play for the competition, they play because they found the game fun. You might play for the fame and money but at the end of the day, where's that gonna get you?

And the reason why we got MLG, EVO & got other Majors its because they saw how tight the community was, how we was organizing and all that stuff. They saw that we were able to take care of our own and not bitch& whine about not getting what we want , we just play the game.

One more thing, if it wasn't for Smash getting all the Heat we will be next in line or we will be next in line I once to Smash dies down...think about that.
 

zabugi

The only Real Master
There was more competition in mk9 whixh made it more exciting. Now its just one player dominance.
 

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
Read some of the recent posts last night and I thought if I get some sleep my opinion would change or I will feel differently about. . . nope.

Pig I am appalled, shame & worry that you think that is not OK or somethings wrong if a group of people still play a fighting game that has lost its spotlight.

From your recent posts can tell that you consider playing Netherrealm Studio games as more of a business than a hobby. I don't know if you've ever considered fighting games as a hobby or like it in the first place but yeah I can't tell anymore LOL

Since you are considered a leader in our community, talk like that could easily trickle down to lower levels but I feel like that's another topic for another day.

NEWS FLASH! Not every competitor play for medals and money, they play for the competition, they play because they found the game fun. You might play for the fame and money but at the end of the day, where's that gonna get you?

And the reason why we got MLG, EVO & got other Majors its because they saw how tight the community was, how we was organizing and all that stuff. They saw that we were able to take care of our own and not bitch& whine about not getting what we want , we just play the game.

One more thing, if it wasn't for Smash getting all the Heat we will be next in line or we will be next in line I once to Smash dies down...think about that.
At the end of the day what is the fame and money gonna get you?... Fame and money.
 

SHAOLIN

内部冲突
At the end of the day what is the fame and money gonna get you?... Fame and money.
Lol didn't phrase right I guess. Its just that I feel like people(of today) pursue fighting games or a competitive video games for the wrong reason.

Most people aren't going to make a living off this stuff, that 15 minute of fame is not going to last that long. If you play fighting games let it be for the competition not the money & fame, they could potentially lead you the wrong way in life.