What is the learning curve for Tekken.

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

MK9 is far from a steep learning curve. If you know basic math you already are at an above average level. The movelists are so limited... thats why its so shallow.

Tekken has tons of moves that allow each character to .. as Slips would say ..... "have their own brand of bullshit". There are no Kano's... every character has stuff that make them good and frustrating to face.

Leo is considered higher in the tier list ... probably because of her red life draino and her wall carry combo's. Her and Lars are a stupid combo. Thier matches always end on the wall... no exceptions.

I hope the xbl guys on here do join in on the rooms. I missed last night... but won't miss very many. I get bored playing the bad players and I always seem to lose my "rank up" matches

 

[Pikachu]

3 hardest things to learn in Tekken are movement oki and punishment. Combos take 4min to learn.

 

[Espio]

Espio is correct. When people (including me) say Tekken is "hard," it means hard to pick up. The learning curve is steep. Of course, ANY good competitive game is difficult to win at high level... MK9, TTT2, SF4, MVC3, etc etc etc.

Tekken is actually much like MK9 in that execution, outside of a select few characters, is quite simple. Honestly, the combos most players will ever need in TTT2 are straight braindead for the majority of the cast.

Espio, Leo isnt as hard to learn as the others. Raven has a LOT of options available to him so he'll require some serious play time to excel with. Xiaoyu has always been very difficult to use well due to the insanely number of options and transitions available.

Zafina isn't quite as bad as the others. I've been playing her since T6. Yes, she has 3 different stances, but only a small handful of moves from each stance are really useful, so you can start small. Her biggest asset is that her sidestep and backdash are both BIG and FAST. You can honestly just spend the majority of a match dancing around and whiff punishing. You barely need her (very mediocre) offense. You can find videos of UNCONKABLE playing Zafina/Jinpachi that should give you some ideas.

You have this game on PS3? We should play!

That's actually a nice blend, depth and accesibilty, which is what I always liked about Tekken. I'm glad my memory serves me well in regards to Leo lol, very fun character.


The more depth and options, the better, I love taking a character to the lab and finding tons of little nuances, I'm okay with putting in a lot of time for Raven as long as he's a fun character to learn. Your description actually has me more excited to pick him up then I originally was this time through .

I might take Xiao for a spin..but she just seems so awkward for me, which is probably just cause I suck at the game lol, I like that she semi-trolls it seems.


Zafina sounds like how I play Jade in MK....yay <3. I love defensive spacing these days, a radical departure from my rushdown heavy mode.
I wasn't too savvy with Zafina, but she was a ton of fun in T6, and I heard they buffed her too so that should be good times.

Is Raven a more defensive or aggressive character? I only ask because my team is probably just going to be him and Zafina as I don't have time these days to explore the roster as heavily as I would like and I think an aggressive character would compliment a more defensive based character quite nicely(if that's what Zafina is based on your explanation).

I'll check out his youtube videos soon, I've never seen high level Zafina in Tekken, love the series, but rarely get to watch matches, I'm excited .




No, I don't have TTT2 right now, I only have Tekken 6 lol . I won't be getting it for a while. I was trying to get into P4A too, but have been neglecting that a lot due to school this semester, but I'll get it at some point and we can play .

 

[Skkra]

No, I don't have TTT2 right now, I only have Tekken 6 lol . I won't be getting it for a while. I was trying to get into P4A too, but have been neglecting that a lot due to school this semester, but I'll get it at some point and we can play .

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. I just came back from a big night of drinking and I'm ready to throw down hahaha. Definitely pick up Raven. If you have fun, thats the most important thing.

I've been playing P4A, but completely unseriously. I ONLY ever play with one of my friends on Sunday mornings, before football, while we're drinking to pre-game. So, extremely unseriously, but holy shit is that game really fun, even when I barely know anything about it!!!

 

[THTB]

Zafina is basically Jade on crack.

 

[Skkra]

As someone who has played Zafina for quite a while... she's definitely better now than in T6. Tekken is a framey game, and her frames still suck, but she is all about mindgames. She also has crazy mid/low mixups that basically mean you can go for a 50/50 and cross your fingers.

In a game where movement, sidestepping and spacing are king, having a GIANT backdash and a solid sidestep are INCREDIBLE ASSETS.

When I'm using Zafina, I feel like I'm flying around the screen. I can beat most mid-level players literally by never attacking with Zaf and just spacing and punishing. Her backdash is that good. There's a reason a ton of guys in California are using her now despite bad frames on block.

 

[~NAKM~]

Zafina sucks.

 

[Skkra]

Zafina sucks.

You used to be on my friends list during DR... you seem gone now. I'll readd you on PSN later. I don't think we've played since back in DR! Been a long time! =)

I've been saying Zafina is not that good for a while, but there's a reason a ton of people in Cali have picked her up. Her backdash is gigantic and fast, and her sidestep is deep, too. I'm pretty sure people are just playing as safe as possible with her and using her movement to whiff punish.

I'm no pro with her but I'm decent enough to annoy you I imagine =P

 

[Clayman]

I've been saying Zafina is not that good for a while, but there's a reason a ton of people in Cali have picked her up. Her backdash is gigantic and fast, and her sidestep is deep, too. I'm pretty sure people are just playing as safe as possible with her and using her movement to whiff punish.

Then play alisa/lili. Zafina is just unsafe piece of shit with no decent mids.

 

[Skkra]

Then play alisa/lili. Zafina is just unsafe piece of shit with no decent mids.

There's only one problem - Alisa is fucking stupid. I pretty much hated everyone they introduced in T6: Leo, Bob, Miguel, Lars, and Alisa. Zafina is the only character I thought was cool and interesting.

I say screw how good a character is, I play this game for fun. If I wanted to pick good characters I wouldn't be playing Lili in this game hahaha.

 

[Clayman]

There's only one problem - Alisa is fucking stupid. I pretty much hated everyone they introduced in T6: Leo, Bob, Miguel, Lars, and Alisa. Zafina is the only character I thought was cool and interesting.

I say screw how good a character is, I play this game for fun. If I wanted to pick good characters I wouldn't be playing Lili in this game hahaha.

Agreed man. All new characters in T6 were clearly made for scrubs with their easy-ass execution and bullshit moves like lars uf+3 and bob's whatever his dumbshit is called.

 

[~NAKM~]

You used to be on my friends list during DR... you seem gone now. I'll readd you on PSN later. I don't think we've played since back in DR! Been a long time! =)

I've been saying Zafina is not that good for a while, but there's a reason a ton of people in Cali have picked her up. Her backdash is gigantic and fast, and her sidestep is deep, too. I'm pretty sure people are just playing as safe as possible with her and using her movement to whiff punish.

I'm no pro with her but I'm decent enough to annoy you I imagine =P

I've been around on T6 as well. It's just I changed gamertags cuz I forgot the email and password to my old one.

As for Zafina, yeah she did get upgrades from her T6 counterpart, but she doesn't seem much safer than she was in T6 which is what killed her.

 

[Via_Negativa]

The learning curve for this game is overstated.

Yes movement is harder than most games, yes for a lot of character's you have to have good execution. There are easy characters however.

Start with Paul, this will get you started.
Advanced movement stuff is not nessesary to begin with and will come with time.
I know plenty of casual's locally that love tekken and think they are good but have never even heard of Korean back dash cancelling and the like.

I actually think it's easier to play than SFIV for example. Scrub's just have the illusion they are good at that game.

 

[Skkra]

The learning curve for this game is overstated.

I actually think it's easier to play than SFIV for example. Scrub's just have the illusion they are good at that game.

I don't think so. Sure, there is a lot to learn in EVERY fighting game, of course, but as 16bit said in the reunion show, playing this game seriously can feel like a second job.

I'm retired from competitive play, so I don't really give a shit anymore, but the game requires a LOT of study and playtime just to get decent. Don't know all of the moves of a character you're fighting against? You're pretty much dead. So you need to go into practice and learn all 150 moves, memorizing the animations, hit ranges, which strings are delayable, and which create escapable stuns. When you're done that, you can start learning and memorizing your max-damage punishment for each unsafe move. Etc etc. Very different from MK or SF4 where characters have a small handful of moves to learn.

The game just has a lot to memorize. It's no coincidence that the people who have several free hours to play this game every day are the top players. It takes a very large time commitment.

 

[Tom Brady]

Tekken has a HUGE legacy learning curve. There are many players who have been playing tekken at this level for over 10 years. Tekken has a lot to learn.. movement, walls and all the crazy angles that you can end up on them, knowing how to punish everything to its fullest, huge move lists to learn and defend vs, etc..

MK, although it has changes a lot, still keeps a certain learning legacy curve for those who came in during the 3D MK era. What kills MK's overall learning curve are the 9-1 MU characters. You can put someone in a handicap match thats so bad that the avg player has a chance. Minus those situations, MK's learning curve is pretty good.

 

[Big Pampering]

if they changed and added a few things to mk it would be by far the best game. adding focus attacks to the game would help deepen the game. execution for some characters could be turned up a bit like the ninja characters for example. and imo the reason why mk has so many bad matchups is because all these characters have so many unique specials or playstyle and 1 or 2 reads cant make you win the match because there is a breaker. like in games like street fighter there is a lot of universal stuff as well making it less possible to have 7-3 matchups or worse.

 

[Skkra]

imo the reason why mk has so many bad matchups is because all these characters have so many unique specials or playstyle and 1 or 2 reads cant make you win the match because there is a breaker. like in games like street fighter there is a lot of universal stuff as well making it less possible to have 7-3 matchups or worse.

MK9 having horrific matchups is due to several factors, though in the end it all comes down to tool availability. The top tier characters that currently dominate the game have insanely powerful tools within the game system. The overall balance is a symptom of this being the first game NRS has made in ages that is geared toward high-level play. They'll probably do a better job in the future.

Kabal has the best projectile in the game and an armored move that can start a juggle from full screen. Kenshi utterly dominates footsie range with a lightning fast attack that is unpunishable by a majority of the cast... oh, and he has loads of armor. Take a look at, say, Ermac in comparison. He's a well-made character, but he lacks armor, which is a gigantic problem for a character who is supposed to be a zoner, and his pressure is mediocre at best since 3,1 only jails if you land a JIP and doesn't give any +frames on block. He falls along with a majority of the cast: they're great characters, but compared to the god tier characters who have every tool imaginable given to them, you need to completely outplay your opponent to achieve the same result.

My two cents, anyways.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

Kenshi utterly dominates footsie range with a lightning fast attack that is unpunishable by a majority of the cast... oh, and he has loads of armor.

Yeah. They need to rid the Sissy Charge in the next game.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

if they changed and added a few things to mk it would be by far the best game. adding focus attacks to the game would help deepen the game. execution for some characters could be turned up a bit like the ninja characters for example. and imo the reason why mk has so many bad matchups is because all these characters have so many unique specials or playstyle and 1 or 2 reads cant make you win the match because there is a breaker. like in games like street fighter there is a lot of universal stuff as well making it less possible to have 7-3 matchups or worse.

focus attacks made SF not as fun. True story.

 

[Skkra]

focus attacks made SF not as fun. True story.

Whaaaat? I thought it's one of the best mechanics they put into the game. Instead of the reaction-based parry-fest that is Third Strike, I think the idea of absorbing a single hit on a read (and it can't even absorb all moves, unlike 3S parry) adds a lot of depth.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Whaaaat? I thought it's one of the best mechanics they put into the game. Instead of the reaction-based parry-fest that is Third Strike, I think the idea of absorbing a single hit on a read (and it can't even absorb all moves, unlike 3S parry) adds a lot of depth.

it makes the game too slow and takes emphasis off of footsie. I mean..... its super armor that gives a combo. c'mon.
Tekken doesn't need armor. No game needs armor.

 

[Skkra]

it makes the game too slow and takes emphasis off of footsie. I mean..... its super armor that gives a combo. c'mon.
Tekken doesn't need armor. No game needs armor.

I think it's just another footsie tool. A lot of games have had super/hyper armor for a long time now, and I think it can be a valuable balancing tool. Heck, look how poor armor application affected MK9 - characters without good armor struggle to be competitive.

In SF4, focus attacks are a universal mechanic, which allows some characters like Hakan, THawk, tons more, to handle some otherwise brutal matchups. I dont think absorbing a single hit is gamebreaking for anyone.

I do completely agree of course that Tekken doesn't need armor, but it wouldn't make any sense in that fighting system. I personally think it works for SF4.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

I think it's just another footsie tool. A lot of games have had super/hyper armor for a long time now, and I think it can be a valuable balancing tool. Heck, look how poor armor application affected MK9 - characters without good armor struggle to be competitive.

In SF4, focus attacks are a universal mechanic, which allows some characters like Hakan, THawk, tons more, to handle some otherwise brutal matchups. I dont think absorbing a single hit is gamebreaking for anyone.

I do completely agree of course that Tekken doesn't need armor, but it wouldn't make any sense in that fighting system. I personally think it works for SF4.

sf x tekken doesn't have the universal armor... but SF has always had the frames of invincibility on certain moves. I think the fact that those moves are typically unsafe helps a ton.

Having armor is kinda a lazy way to keep lower skill levels "equal" to high skill level.

To each his own... I see what you're saying and agree with you. I'm not going to hate on ya because you like that mechanic.
I think it is poorly done in MK9. The way projectiles work... armor should be beneficial for getting around them... and not lead to combo's. Ex Shadow kick is a good example... except it should leave the opponent within dash distance... not full screen. That to me is a perfect armor move. Its unsafe on a bad read. But it will give you oki options if landed... and it can get you out of pressure.
i'm off topic.... BACK ON TOPIC!!!

I wish they would tone down SOME of the Tekken characters natural crush abilities (i'm looking at you capos). They are SO hard to hit sometimes....

I'm getting a ps3..... eff sexbox. I need to play people who want to learn or people that can help me learn.

 

[Skkra]

I think it is poorly done in MK9. The way projectiles work... armor should be beneficial for getting around them... and not lead to combo's. Ex Shadow kick is a good example... except it should leave the opponent within dash distance... not full screen. That to me is a perfect armor move. Its unsafe on a bad read. But it will give you oki options if landed... and it can get you out of pressure.

OFF TOPIC: Agree with the above. Armor is a mess in MK9. Armor should be used to make a read. Meter should be sacrificed as a result of a bad read (focus canceling an unsafe move in SF4, using breaker after a risky read in MK9). In MK9 though, too many moves don't obey a risk/reward. Sonya's jugglestarting EX cartwheel is frigging safe... no consequence to throwing it out whatsoever. A ton of Kenshi's armored moves that SHOULD be used to escape pressure from people who get in on him instead leave him in POSITIVE situations when blocked! Get outta here.

ON TOPIC: Yes, play Tekken on PS3 =) It's the way to go.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

Whaaaat? I thought it's one of the best mechanics they put into the game. Instead of the reaction-based parry-fest that is Third Strike, I think the idea of absorbing a single hit on a read (and it can't even absorb all moves, unlike 3S parry) adds a lot of depth.

Ew. I do not like to think of how MK would be with focus attacks in the game...