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Tier List through my eyes

JaredL

JaredL

Aww shit <REDACTED DUE TO FEELINGS> its Shapzam
Doombawkz said:
f.23 is longer range than Bane's d.1, as is Bane's b.23.

And I'm counting both hits, as both f.23 and b.23 travel the same distance, or a close enough distance as to where its negligible at best.
Click to expand...

So.. I'm superman and I'm at your magic 'B23 distance', and I'm walking backwards. You do B23, B2 wiffs and now I simply need to do an F23 on reaction and you lose a nice healthy chunk of your life.

GGs.
 
Z

ZalliX

Noob
RIF said:
Uhm...Not salty about her. Just left her off by accident.



Overreact much?

S: Superman
S-: Wonder Woman
A+: Aquaman, Flash, Black Adam, Killer Frost
A: Batman, Green Lantern, Batgirl, Catwoman, Nightwing, Raven, Harley Quinn
A- : Doomsday, Green Arrow, Sinestro, Hawkgirl, Ares, Bane, Grundy, Cyborg, Deathstroke, Shazam
B: Joker, Lex Luthor, Lobo
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Why didn't you place Sinestro higher in your tier list?
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JaredL said:
So.. I'm superman and I'm at your magic 'B23 distance', and I'm walking backwards. You do B23, B2 wiffs and now I simply need to do an F23 on reaction and you lose a nice healthy chunk of your life.

GGs.
Click to expand...
If only you could, but even from neutral starting position you can't get away from the b.23 without backdashing. You can't avoid f.23 either, but assuming you decide to f.23 on reaction, you better have some darn good ones because I can stop my b.2 and backdash before an f.2 comes out from supes (this is in the gap of more than half a second). Then its a matter of "oh hey, free command grab/double punch/ combo starter of my choice"
 
JaredL

JaredL

Aww shit <REDACTED DUE TO FEELINGS> its Shapzam
Doombawkz said:
If only you could, but even from neutral starting position you can't get away from the b.23 without backdashing. You can't avoid f.23 either, but assuming you decide to f.23 on reaction, you better have some darn good ones because I can stop my b.2 and backdash before an f.2 comes out from supes (this is in the gap of more than half a second). Then its a matter of "oh hey, free command grab/double punch/ combo starter of my choice"
Click to expand...

Yes indeed, you can fake someone out. But the fact remains, B23 has a gap in the middle. This isn't a case where you can measure sinestros F2D1 as being long range, because that has the hitbox of the D1 as separate from Sinestro. However with Bane, he moves along with the B2. Meaning that its just plain worse.

You can sort of argue that they are the same range, but you can't argue that they are equal, or even similar in terms of utility. F23 is simply miles ahead, you keep bringing it up but the fact is, you can backdash the thing. You can punish the thing because its only the second hit that gives it range.
 
doomfarmer

doomfarmer

unorthodox
Lex Luthor II said:
Is Flash good now? I've literally lost the Flash maybe once? He's so easy to beat with WW or Superman or AM??? But I've always wanted to use him.
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He's great BUT... I don't think he should be grouped in with the likes of superman, WW, aquaman, black adam, killer frost.

Flash, Batman, Lantern... I feel are like in the upper of A tier. They're awesome but those top 5 characters in S tier just edge out the rest of the cast IMO.

shrug
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JaredL said:
Yes indeed, you can fake someone out. But the fact remains, B23 has a gap in the middle. This isn't a case where you can measure sinestros F2D1 as being long range, because that has the hitbox of the D1 as separate from Sinestro. However with Bane, he moves along with the B2. Meaning that its just plain worse.

You can sort of argue that they are the same range, but you can't argue that they are equal, or even similar in terms of utility. F23 is simply miles ahead, you keep bringing it up but the fact is, you can backdash the thing. You can punish the thing because its only the second hit that gives it range.
Click to expand...
However, you can jump back from f.23 on reaction and punish it. You can't do that to b.23. Also f.23 has a gap in the front, and with both f.2 and f.23 being pretty bad on whiff if someone happens to backdash you in the beginning "on reaction" as you would put it, then you are shafted since your backdash won't let you get away from the rebuttal.

Me on the other hand? I can backdash out of most anything I need to, or if I feel ballsy I can let b.23 ride since I'm advantaged on block. Followed up by my +17 d.1 which would be at about 6 frames? Or my d.2 which sets up oki and comes out at 8? I can use mine to trap, b.2 has its advantages on block as well being able to cancel cleanly into command grab, overhead, charge... However, I never argued their utility since the characters are different. They are built to utilize their tools in different ways.

Only the range, to which its well noted to be equal or different to a minimal degree.
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
STB CharlieMurphy said:
If you're the AI maybe

If you're reacting to 8 frame moves... then you're def. plugged into the matrix.
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Everything Bane does depends on 1 or 2 frames, so 8 frames? Its like watching the turtle migrations in Holland :cool:
But more to the point, he was talking about f.23-ing b.2 for a punish, to which I was noting a comparable scenario, being someone jumping back from the f.23 on reaction. The timing to hit the b.23 for a punish without risking a backdash or the move stuffing your attack is reacting to it in less than half a second, when my move is taking up about .3 seconds of that half second. If this is a 60fps game, then I guess it would be comparable to reacting in about... 8 frames, give or take, since you'd be reacting to something in which only a .2 second window is open.

My math might be wrong, but
.2 = 1/5 second = 1/5 * x = y
x = (0.5)*60 (A half second) = 30
y = 8 frames
 
JaredL

JaredL

Aww shit <REDACTED DUE TO FEELINGS> its Shapzam
Doombawkz said:
Everything Bane does depends on 1 or 2 frames, so 8 frames? Its like watching the turtle migrations in Holland :cool:
But more to the point, he was talking about f.23-ing b.2 for a punish, to which I was noting a comparable scenario, being someone jumping back from the f.23 on reaction. The timing to hit the b.23 for a punish without risking a backdash or the move stuffing your attack is reacting to it in less than half a second, when my move is taking up about .3 seconds of that half second. If this is a 60fps game, then I guess it would be comparable to reacting in about... 8 frames, give or take, since you'd be reacting to something in which only a .2 second window is open.

My math might be wrong, but
.2 = 1/5 second = 1/5 * x = y
x = (0.5)*60 (A half second) = 30
y = 8 frames
Click to expand...

The 3 in the B23 is 19 frames. That's enough reaction time for a backdash.
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
JaredL said:
The 3 in the B23 is 19 frames. That's enough reaction time for a backdash.
Click to expand...
I never said it wasn't. Simply that they are the same range.
Also that trying to stuff the b.2 part of b.23 without risking me backdashing is what I listed.
 
R

RIF

Noob
ZalliX said:
Why didn't you place Sinestro higher in your tier list?
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I think Sinestro is the best character in the tier I grouped him in and could very well be up one more level.

Characters above Sinestro:

S: Superman
S-: Wonder Woman
A+: Aquaman, Flash, Black Adam, Killer Frost
A: Batman, Green Lantern, Batgirl, Catwoman, Nightwing, Raven, Harley Quinn

Superman and WW being above him are self-explanatory.

Aquaman is a terrible match-up for Sinestro. Flash with his increased dash speed and 50/50 mix-up game will give Sinestro major problems up close. Black Adam has become more manageable now, but I still feel he's on another level. Killer Frost is still superior to Sinestro despite the recent patch.

I feel like Batman, GL, Raven, NW, Harley, and Raven are all 5-5 against Sinestro, IF you take into account Trait. I feel like Catwoman and Batgirl are superior characters and counter Sinestro very well. However, I feel like ALL of them fight the characters above THEM better than Sinestro currently does.

The recent patch improved D2 for a number of characters. Sinestro's was NOT improved. I feel like this hurt his overall placing. His D2 WAS one of the best, and was a real benefit over other characters. This is no longer the case. The vertical hitbox is lacking. The improved D2's also impacted one of Sinestro's best tools: Air Axe of Terror. Prior to the patch, you could pressure people with it and not worry about being anti-aired. Now you're taking a risk. It's still strong when used in his Vortex.

FB is too negative on hit. Arachnid is a solid wake-up, but it's very baitable & punishable if you don't have trait out. His regular combo damage is below average without trait. This is a key reason why I put him below the "A" list characters. If Sinestro makes one mistake, he's eating a big combo from the characters above him. When Sinestro punishes you, it's around 29%. His F2D1 and B213 are solid strings, but his buttons lose to those above him fairly regularly. His B2 & D1 are some of his best pokes, but they lack range.

WoundCowboy plays Sinestro the way he needs to be played. He makes him look like a legitimate top 10 character. If he feels like Sinestro has him higher than where I have him, I would defer to his opinion.

Konqrr said:
Yeah... Sinestro with his trait out is one of, if not THE best in the game.
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He's not the best with trait out. It does make him MUCH, MUCH better, but not top 3.
 
Pig Of The Hut

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Perfect Legend said:
I have to put m2dave on blast.

Was only a threat in MK when he used Kano with a safe upball and knives the instantly recovered. Skarlet when she had instant dagger cancels and of course with Freddy whos zoning is top notch but unfortunately dave has to fight up close eventually and up close he is pringles.

All you want to do is sit full screen and toss projectiles all day much like your other pals who advocate with you on your views. I could put them on blast too.

Stop ruining this game.
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Am I one of these people ?
 
Doombawkz

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
Relaxedstate said:
Cyborg is S-Tier.
He lacks decent normals/spacing and good footsie tools
But he has enough. And is zoning is OP as hell.

Beats half the cast 7-3 or 8-2

Does have some bad MUS though
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Bain iz SS+ Tire guy. eh ignors armer and doesn't afraid of projectiles
 
Perfect Legend

Perfect Legend

Noob
AK Pig Of The Hut said:
Wow

If i were an asshole id say what id want to say but this is all i needed
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I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings but were you not following behind dave on that podcast and threatening NRS you would quit the game cause you don't like how the char plays. Also were you not asking for sinestro buffs when the game first came out? And weren't you one of the doomsday complainers when the game first came out too.

I mean correct me if I'm wrong.

Also did you not say without Scorpion I'm not good but I placed higher than both you and Dave in UFGT and CEO? At UFGT Scorpion wasn't even out.

Don't say something and then get called out on it and get upset.
 
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