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This character needs buffs

Lyuben

Lyuben

Sinestro's might!
BajanKing said:
This thread is an EPIC FUCKING FAIL! CSZ is one of the best characters in the game and you think he needs buffs?!! lmao unbelievable! Gamers these days -__-
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He is good but suffers from some pretty bad character design flaws.
 
HurlingDervish

HurlingDervish

Apprentice
xZEPPELIx said:
I do agree with this but at the same time you can work around this by pressing back before doing the kicks. It cancels the bomb.

CSZ doesnt need a fucking buff. Not every character is ment to be like Kung Lao.
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thanks, did not know that. Why not just make the string b34 and b332 then since they'd have to be numb not to see this issue X_X

I agree he needs a buff like skarlet needs bulimia, but that's the most illogical reasoning you could ever give. With that attitude, why even play "non-KL characters"
 
OutlawNightmare

OutlawNightmare

Baneiac
Caraecrika said:
Ummm he has frame traps, bomb traps, good low strings, prob best dive kick in the game, insane pressure, arguably the best rushdown in the game.

AND OMG HE HAS A FRIGGN ICE SWORD HOW COOL IS THAT!!111
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Not to mention its an INESCAPABLE bomb trap and if u do ex bomb followed by ex freeze its a guaranteed freeze from 3/4 screen
 
Ether

Ether

Noob
Subby said:
Its not that he even needs a buff. Its just that other characters need a nerf. I don't even need to explain further.
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Possibility.

OutlawNightmare said:
Not to mention its an INESCAPABLE bomb trap and if u do ex bomb followed by ex freeze its a guaranteed freeze from 3/4 screen
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The only guaranteed bomb trap is off of u+4 against a standing opponent. Not hit confirmable and extremely unsafe.

If they jump over ex bomb, ex freeze will anti-air them. Too bad anti air ex freeze breaks almost instantly, not giving you time to set anything up. You're spending two bars to do piss damage at best.

Anything else?
 
OutlawNightmare

OutlawNightmare

Baneiac
What about his 332 or 34 mix up. Not only is it a true 50/50 that is 100% safe, when 34 is blocked it actually grants advantage. 211+2 is also an insanely good string as it is a totally safe launcher that gives you options on what to do after it gets blocked. I just don't see what he is lacking.

I mean he has 2.5 stuns (ice ball, ex parry, and half a point for bombs) , a parry that makes it difficult to reverse pressure, a slide that goes under most high projectiles, a good comboable x ray, and i am sure there are points i missed.

I guess my big question is what more does he really need?
 
Lyuben

Lyuben

Sinestro's might!
OmegaK said:
In what sense?
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The annoying bombs mainly. Why? They hardly fit into his playstyle. Half the time they do not work properly and the button placement of them means you cannot to something as simple as dash forward and pressing 3.

I would understand if we had no combos that needed to press 3 like reptiles balls. You are not going to catch a reptile player needing to dash backwards and press 1 or 3 but you are going to catch a cyber sub player dashing forward and pressing 3.

And as I've said before, he has very weak pokes.
 
PND OmegaK

PND OmegaK

Drunk and Orderly
Lyuben said:
The annoying bombs mainly. Why? They hardly fit into his playstyle. Half the time they do not work properly and the button placement of them means you cannot to something as simple as dash forward and pressing 3.

I would understand if we had no combos that needed to press 3 like reptiles balls. You are not going to catch a reptile player needing to dash backwards and press 1 or 3 but you are going to catch a cyber sub player dashing forward and pressing 3.

And as I've said before, he has very weak pokes.
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The bombs mapping is a problem, definitely. They dont need any other changes apart from that. I wouldn't call having weak pokes bad design at all though, that's just one of his downsides, it wouldn't make sense for him to be good in every aspect; even though he very nearly is.
 
Y

YougotCaged1

Banned
The only buff i want is for the ice bomb input to be moved to 4 so that way no more random ice bombs come out when I'm trying to get my 332, 34 mixups. So frustrating.
 
The_Riddler

The_Riddler

Mortal
YougotCaged1 said:
The only buff i want is for the ice bomb input to be moved to 4 so that way no more random ice bombs come out when I'm trying to get my 332, 34 mixups. So frustrating.
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They aren't going to change just the medium bomb to ff4. Not saying they shouldn't, but they definitely will not do that.
 
zee

zee

Icy
YougotCaged1 said:
The only buff i want is for the ice bomb input to be moved to 4 so that way no more random ice bombs come out when I'm trying to get my 332, 34 mixups. So frustrating.
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What do you think would happen when you input bbf4 for your far bomb? You'd get a bf4 Slide.

The best fix would be either a strict ff+3 or bf3 etc. input for the mid bomb.
 
Vilén

Vilén

too smart to play MKX
I'd still maintain that the bomb inputs were made what they are to intentionally limit him if it weren't for the fact that I can consistently dash-in~:fk:fk:bp~:l:r:bk / :fk:bk~:l:r:bk without any problems whatsoever so I don't know WTF you people are doing.

If you are having problems with it, why can't any of you be bothered to setup your 50/50? That overhead feels easy to fuzzyguard if you don't set it up from a blocked jump-punch anyway, but that's just what I've gleaned from playing against him.

It's smarter just to do :bp:fp before your mixup string anyway because it creates a mind game. You're at either -1 or 0 after :bp:fp is blocked, so your opponent has options, all of which you get to rape them for. They can jump away, and you answer with dive kick, they can crossover punch and you answer with parry, they can crossover without a punch and you answer with anything you want, they can continue blocking and you answer with your 50/50, and if for some fucked up reason they eat :bp:fp, you confirm into freeze and answer with combo of choice.

And if you're fighting Kung Lao, parry will catch his spin if you expect it. So your only option after a :bp:fp against anyone is pretty much victory.

So yeah, this character could use some buffs; I have to make reads to win. Fuck that.

The only issue I ever had with this dude (which are NOT real problems) were parry not catching Raiden's superman or Mileena's roll. Or Sektor's telepunch. But if I can read those to parry them, I can read them to block and do full combo.
 
Altaire

Altaire

Warrior
Anyone who complains about the bomb mapping needs to realize that you can tap FF U 3 to get a dash into 3 and your followup du jour. The idea is that you input the dash, then tap up before your normal string. Even if your 3 input is close to the dash input, tapping up will segment the bomb input and prevent you from accidentally doing a mid bomb.

Also, F B F 3 is the only alternative bomb input I can think of that wouldn't be either stupid, impractical or unconventional to a fault. This really needed to be said.
 
Ulturas

Ulturas

Mortal
Why don't they buff Kung Lao again whilst they're buffing characters that need no buffs whatsoever? Oh wait because that's stupid as hell if anything CSZ needs a nerf his mind games are way too powerful, slide is extremely fast, ex dive kick is an overhead and does 18% damage (no one elses specials do THAT much damage he can also put it into a combo as well) he has overhead and low mixups (why can't they give every character this?), list goes on people need to quit their bitching about a ridiculously good character which has little to no counters and 3-4 5-5 matchups how is that even balanced that nearly every character in MK9 can be beaten by CSZ? If someone picks up CSZ for next years Evo it's pretty much an instant win button kinda like how King Lao won this years prestigious award of being the most broken character in the game. The button mapping is fine as well, Cyrax has the exact same button setup for his bombs and people do bomb zoning/traps etc fine with him.

Edit: also forgot to mention nearly every string CSZ has is safe as well.
 
Killphil

Killphil

A prop on the stage of life.
Cyrax bombs are mapped to 4 and I don't recall people rushing in to do a combo that starts with 4. Don't claim that Csub is an instant win character. His divekick is unsafe from the waist up, and its harder to hit below the waist than just saying "aim lower". Thats besides the point. The only thing that grinds my gears is trying to teleport out of the way of a projectile. He'll disappear from view, the projectile will pass where he was, and then he'll rematerialize where he was standing and will be getting hit by said projectile. Cyrax teleport is invincible. Most Cyrax players I play will teleport on wakeup because they know this. Just a small thing that annoys me.
 
CaliJokerstyle

CaliJokerstyle

Dies A Lot
as a CSZ player i dont think he needs any buffs, but i also dont see any reason to nerf him. Yes he has strong pressure but 34 is slow and easy to fuzzy which limits him some plus his Iceball has ridiculous startup and his bombs have hit and miss properties. His slide while fast is extremely punishable on block. His dive kick on block is punishable and EX dive is a waste of meter so even though it does 18 its not worth it. remember parry only connects on high hits so you can low hit parry all day long. He is a high tier Character that is just fine the way he is. heck i hate KL but im with a lot of people lets leave the buff and nerf talk alone for all characters it is getting ridiculous.

edit: btw anyone who uses EX Bomb and EX ice as a trap needs to learn meter management bad.
 
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