The Reason GA's Arrows do 0.1% on chip, 1% on hit.

[Red Reaper]

You'd be surprised how much more effective savage blast can be.

Kan't Savage Blast away from interactables that go through you.

It was a serious post. The GA we have here never backdashes and it's the most annoying thing ever. Works extremely well for him in most backdashable situations.

It kan work depending on the match up. One prime example where Backdash is better than Savage Blast is the Nightwing Match up. Use it to avoid chip AND to escape D1 D1 D1 Frame Traps.

 

[Red Reaper]

This thread has too many people thinking Arrow is bad. I don't like it. See you all at NEC.

People thinking Arrow is bad only makes you look better! lol.

Stop downplaying the character you don't play (( Brb, making top 8 with pre patch bottom 3 characters ;D

But seriously. The character is solid. If you all think he's horrid, fine, so be it. I see his potential. He's fine the way he is, he needs to buffs. He can compete. He's not as great as the top tiers, but he can compete with them nevertheless.

He won't body them 6-4, 7-3, but he won't lose badly to them. Downplaying rant over, stay on the chip rant about his arrows people (which are also fine).

Stop Mid playing man! We need to get this character buffed!

All in all I think we should all be doing something productive. Like kollaborating on match ups more extensively. We've started that thanx to Jimmypotato but we need to kontinue. I was thinking we kould kreate a thread for each match up just so that everything is more organized but I wasn't sure if that would be allowed.

 

[RM Truth]

Kan't Savage Blast away from interactables that go through you.



It kan work depending on the match up. One prime example where Backdash is better than Savage Blast is the Nightwing Match up. Use it to avoid chip AND to escape D1 D1 D1 Frame Traps.

That's like the one instance where backdashing is better. Unless you're actually trying to use the invincibility frames, Savage Blast is much more appealing. It's basically an offensive backdash that has wake up invincibility and on block you can get a free arrow. AND it builds meter.

 

[Red Reaper]

That's like the one instance where backdashing is better. Unless you're actually trying to use the invincibility frames, Savage Blast is much more appealing. It's basically an offensive backdash that has wake up invincibility and on block you can get a free arrow. AND it builds meter.

Yup. But it also has more recovery frames so it depends on the move I'm expecting...

 

[RM Truth]

Yup. But it also has more recovery frames so it depends on the move I'm expecting...

Savage Blast has 23 frames of recovery. I don't know how many frames backdashes have, but I doubt there are that many moves that would stuff one and not the other.

 

[Lord Hollow]

Yup. But it also has more recovery frames so it depends on the move I'm expecting...

True, but very few non projectile attacks can actually catch him. With my Lobo, I can't Low Space Hook unless I do it early (backdashes get caught) and Space Hook wont reach at all. We have to avoid the blast as well as close the distance enough to punish that aforementioned recovery frames. Pretty character specific. A lot of the cast just can't stop him from waking up with it.

 

[Duck Nation]

A lot of the cast just can't stop him from waking up with it.

Deep j2 with Lobo.

 

[Lord Hollow]

Deep j2 with Lobo.

Lobo's combo enders don't leave GA right at his feet. Lobo's jump is not fast enough for him to catch GA at the recovery. I've tested this with Lobo's common enders (Hook Charge, Low Space Hook). Lobo actually lands on the Wake up Savage blast itself. I prefer Nuke Mid Pump shot: Timed right, it stops both and eventually, he will just block on wake up (No one wants to keep taking 11-26%). Then I just czar toss them...

 

[Duck Nation]

Lobo's combo enders don't leave GA right at his feet. Lobo's jump is not fast enough for him to catch GA at the recovery. I've tested this with Lobo's common enders (Hook Charge, Low Space Hook). Lobo actually lands on the Wake up Savage blast itself. I prefer Nuke Mid Pump shot: Timed right, it stops both and eventually, he will just block on wake up (No one wants to keep taking 11-26%). Then I just czar toss them...

Can you not just dash forward and jump, then? I don't remember what Cage Redfield did precisely to beat my savage blast, but I do recall getting kicked in the head.

 

[Cage Redfield]

you can hook charge and jump forward and hit him with 2, I'm 100% certain. But nuke shots/MB hook charge stuff it just as fine too.

 

[Scoot Magee]

I agree with 7L here. The character takes work and has hard match ups but he doesn't suck. Welcome to mid tier.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

They used to be advantage on block and do 20% on hit ;_; I miss old Frost!

Good god...I wonder if Ares had some dirty shit like this in the Beta...

 

[7L]

I agree with 7L here. The character takes work and has hard match ups but he doesn't suck. Welcome to mid tier.

Thank you. With all the characters who were nerfed and arrow only receiving buffs and silent buffs, he's better than people give him credit. He wins matches that people think he doesn't. The character is solid and he is going to continue to turn heads.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

I agree with 7L here. The character takes work and has hard match ups but he doesn't suck. Welcome to mid tier.

As an Ares player, I can relate to this.

 

[RYX]

Thank you. With all the characters who were nerfed and arrow only receiving buffs and silent buffs, he's better than people give him credit. He wins matches that people think he doesn't. The character is solid and he is going to continue to turn heads.

You're the best Arrow right now and I trust your judgementt but I thought Arrow was nerfed before? I don't think I noticed any buffs for him either, maybe I'm not paying attention.

I'd also like to know what MUs you think he wins that others don't.

 

[7L]

You're the best Arrow right now and I trust your judgementt but I thought Arrow was nerfed before? I don't think I noticed any buffs for him either, maybe I'm not paying attention.

I'd also like to know what MUs you think he wins that others don't.

First match he wins. Lantern. That's the big one in my opinion. Grundy is even or his favor.

He was nerfed but they were the necessary to take out infinites. F2d13 df2 in the corner was an infinte vs a few characters, you could hit confirm into a combo, reset with ice arrow, load ice, continue pressure that leads to +20.

The b23 nerf from +15 to +3, also in the corner it was an 'infinite' to an extent. You can repeat it with out being interrupted and could hit confirm an ice arrow if you had it.

The only thing that was bad about the f2d13 nerf was that it took out a guaranteed reset on hit or block... but he still has b13 on block, 111 on hit or block. Also ice arrow, wiff normal to super.

His buffs were the mb stinger and croutched arrow hitbox.

The croutched arrow hit box was huge in the lantern matchup. Before, it was a trade for an ice arrow to rocket for a punish, now it wiffs and he can punish it. The ice rocket can be punished by a timed standing ice arrow, leaving GL getting hit on his wat down, allowing 2 forward dashes to a punish.

Arrow's short backdash is nice for backdashing b13 too, it leaves you at perfect distance for f2d13, it can be backdashed in the corner too with no room to move back. You just have to read the b13 and backdash.

The grundy mu. I may be wrong, who knows. But I feel he has the tools to beat him. I'll try to get some matches with tyrant at nec if he would like to.

I have more gimmicks for nec. There's always new stuff with this character, it just needs to be discovered.

 

[Red Reaper]

True, but very few non projectile attacks can actually catch him. With my Lobo, I can't Low Space Hook unless I do it early (backdashes get caught) and Space Hook wont reach at all. We have to avoid the blast as well as close the distance enough to punish that aforementioned recovery frames. Pretty character specific. A lot of the cast just can't stop him from waking up with it.

It's not that invincible on wake up. If your timing is right you kan stuff it.

Savage Blast has 23 frames of recovery. I don't know how many frames backdashes have, but I doubt there are that many moves that would stuff one and not the other.

You'd be surprised. Sometimes even the slightest frames matter..

Well anyway, I'm not arguing that it's bad. I'm just saying that there are more uses for his backdash than it seems like you guys are implying.

 

[SimSim]

A nerf noone talks about is b2 on hit. It used to be so good when canceled! Before the b23 nerf, his b2 xx Super actually linked. Also, he could end combos with b2 xx load ice arrow, and do d1 before the opponent could do anything. Even b2 xx load ice arrow, b2 would catch jumpers.

 

[Duck Nation]

7L While I basically agree with what you're saying about the normal green arrows, I'd like know why you think it's okay for fire and electric arrows to be garbage. You've made it clear you don't want to zone, but the better characters in the game have more than one way to be played - why are Superman and Black Adam both great when they're standing on your head and at the other side of the screen? I think anyone would be hard pressed to say GA is a better character up close than either of them, too. Why shouldn't he have better options at a distance, especially for the investment, or have more tools than just ice arrow?

 

[7L]

7L While I basically agree with what you're saying about the normal green arrows, I'd like know why you think it's okay for fire and electric arrows to be garbage. You've made it clear you don't want to zone, but the better characters in the game have more than one way to be played - why are Superman and Black Adam both great when they're standing on your head and at the other side of the screen? I think anyone would be hard pressed to say GA is a better character up close than either of them, too. Why shouldn't he have better options at a distance, especially for the investment, or have more tools than just ice arrow?

They are situational. I use electric arrows if I need to end a match and they are on low health from a distance. I can use them to match jumps and punish dashes. Besides that, if you are using them for pressure, they have too much push back on hitsun to be useful, they will usually push the opponent outside of f2 range.

Fire arrows are good for corner mix ups. Landing a low fire arrow can combo into 111 which can lead to 40%.

Fire arrows are also decent if you need to trade projectiles and if that will come in your favor.

If you weren't limited to 2/3 of those arrows, I'd say they would be better but it's not worth hoping that your last one hits so you can get a safe load in on the next round of arrows. They are all useful, but they are situational. This character isn't a zoner and those arrows aren't meant to be used for that way. For as you said with superman, you can attempt to punish lasers with ice but you'll need to get it and make reads. Same with black adam, you won't win with fire arrows, you are going to have to get in eventually.

 

[Duck Nation]

But other characters who have an immensely strong up close game don't have distance options that people call "situational." That's the point. Their shit has to be respected or feared, Arrow's doesn't.

 

[7L]

But other characters who have an immensely strong up close game don't have distance options that people call "situational." That's the point. Their shit has to be respected or feared, Arrow's doesn't.

Are you saying it makes him bad?

 

[Duck Nation]

Are you saying it makes him bad?

No, I'm saying you need to actually justify why you think he's so good, when other characters have up-close games which are every bit as good as his, yet also have very viable fullscreen options. But I see you're more interested in blowing hot air.

 

[Scoot Magee]

Thank you. With all the characters who were nerfed and arrow only receiving buffs and silent buffs, he's better than people give him credit. He wins matches that people think he doesn't. The character is solid and he is going to continue to turn heads.

You have any details on what the silent buffs were?

 

[Scoot Magee]

No, I'm saying you need to actually justify why you think he's so good, when other characters have up-close games which are every bit as good as his, yet also have very viable fullscreen options. But I see you're more interested in blowing hot air.

I don't think he's saying arrow is so good. I think he's saying he's not as bad as people are saying. I feel the same way if that's the case.