General/Other - Mileena The Mileena General Discussion Thread (All Variations)

[MsMiharo]

It's just any time there is a situation where there is a low you can simply special cancel into the overhead throw. It can actually cause the opponent to create mashing situations to not deal with it or make it easier to get. Also the overhead throw is unbreakable that's why there is very good potential and really good on paper.

I found strings into the low throw to be really inconsistent on block so yeah good on paper but I can't find good setups for it in game. Will test further.

 

[JDE]

i think if telekick and low sai was plus on hit.
ex ethereal teleport actually did something
id have nothing to complain about.
(i still dont like f44 is a punish on block seeing as it can be f4~special cancel can be interupted so even f4~pounce unsafe to do)

come to live with d1 not working,
doubt the ex telekick whiffing on hit will be fixed but that makes the fact normal tele not good even worse.
im fine with ex roll being her only decent overhead starter, would be nice if standing 3 was overhead like kung jins but it isnt.

I would like 3 to hit as an overhead also. I also wished that she had string that goes from low to high (if she has no legit ovehead). I still use F3 when they are afraid of my high to low strings & if they block low from getting off the ground, out in space, or when I use the reset meter setup. Just don't use it often.

I'm not sure how I really feel about f4 & f44. I mean f4 does lead to solid damage & special cancels, but on the other hand, you'll have to either punish with it if they use something that's silly to use as an unsafe string, when they're not expecting a low, or if they're waking backwards. Yet, you can't follow up with a safe string. This is my only real assumption that I have for it being unsafe. I personally am used to using characters of this magnitude. Coming from playing DOA & SF as a Kasumi & Ryu main. Although Ryu "is" safer out of all of the characters that I've mentioned: Kasumi, Mileena, Scorpion, & him, it's just an example.

Hopefully, if they decide to make changes, NRS & Boon will listen.

 

[flawless]

Ive had lots of trouble with liu kang, dragons fire specifically. The pressure on knockdown with his f444 stuffed all wakeups, couldnt reverse if i delayed and blocked. Seemed everything he had, was faster than what i could pull off.

Then i got zoned out with his low fireball spam, tele and ex tele wasnt fast enough. D-bags on his mic saying"you know she got a tele right? ass,ass, ass". After he threw out 20 low fireballs in 6.3 seconds.

I dont think thered be anything wrong with her ball hitting low. Subs slide hits low. If they know its coming you get blown up anyway

 

[Law Hero]

Ive had lots of trouble with liu kang, dragons fire specifically. The pressure on knockdown with his f444 stuffed all wakeups, couldnt reverse if i delayed and blocked. Seemed everything he had, was faster than what i could pull off.

Then i got zoned out with his low fireball spam, tele and ex tele wasnt fast enough. D-bags on his mic saying"you know she got a tele right? ass,ass, ass". After he threw out 20 low fireballs in 6.3 seconds.

I dont think thered be anything wrong with her ball hitting low. Subs slide hits low. If they know its coming you get blown up anyway

In my experience, you can't wakeup against Liu Kang. Like, ever. He can always stuff Ball Roll and EX Ball Roll (even more easily) in the corner and midscreen. The fireball game definitely requires a good read into EX Telekick. If regular Telekick wasn't so shitty, it would be a good option too. Also getting hit out of teleports with low fireball, particularly online, is really annoying.

I think it can definitely be a rough matchup at times, and quite frustrating when you're getting out-zoned have to make really risky reads. And if you have no meter, even a good read puts right back on the defensive, just up close instead of far away. I don't think it's her hardest matchup, but it definitely feels like an uphill battle.

 

[Johnny San]

Liu Kang is definitely a fun matchup. F1 laughs at wakeups. Fireballs have great frames. A great counter.

You should play the AI Kang with Ethereal Mileena. Loads of fun.

 

[JDE]

Liu Kang is loaded with frame traps. His moves are either leaving him neutral or +1 on block for the most part, but you have no real reason to low block. He doesn't have an overhead. I haven't had a chance to play as much for being sick & no connection (but online sucks). I'm going to start going to local gatherings in the coming weeks.

 

[TakeAChance]

Some very basic Reptile Matchup notes courtest of the ol notebook.

F312~slash = Reversal punish with ball for a free 29% (ball~B3~teleport~sai B21~2+3)

Anytime we see a forceball, EX Telekick immediately for a full combo punish.

Reptile's B22~throw = Full combo punishable with ball for 29%

Dash = Full combo punishable.

21~roll B3~teleport~sai B21~2+3= 32%

Easy Punish (ie online punish) Roll punisher = 29% (see above)

Reptiles B2= Safe, but he has to respect a pressure string. (f4 vs ex roll)

B34=Safe But he has to respect a pressure string. (f4 vs ex roll)

 

[qspec]

This may be a dumb question, but is there any real way to play Mileena safe?

I'm finding the 'wait and punish' game to be fruitless since we end up just outside of our better strings (all of which seem stubby as hell), and nothing we have seems blazingly fast anyway (I'm legit nervous to touch a button on a combo that is +0).

So I end up getting more done by taking bigger risks like throwing out ex-ball and unpredictable but unsafe strings.

Then watching the big tourny today, I felt like the Mileena in the top 8 was doing roughly the same thing... but problems arose once Wong started accurately blocking the rolls.

I really dig her aesthetic, and I love that she can actually confirm combos unlike a lot of characters... but damnit if she isn't frustrating to play, and her frame data makes me sad.

 

[exflyingbooty]

You should play with Ethereal Mileena. Loads of fun.

ftfy

 

[Johnny San]

her frame data makes me sad

Her fastest string starter is 10 frames. Hits high.
Fastest mid-hitting string starter? 15 frames (Ravenous).
Fastest low-hitting string starter? 17 frames.

Truly sad.

 

[Endding]

Mileena v Erron is surprisingly fun.

 

[MsMiharo]

This may be a dumb question, but is there any real way to play Mileena safe?

I'm finding the 'wait and punish' game to be fruitless since we end up just outside of our better strings (all of which seem stubby as hell), and nothing we have seems blazingly fast anyway (I'm legit nervous to touch a button on a combo that is +0).

So I end up getting more done by taking bigger risks like throwing out ex-ball and unpredictable but unsafe strings.

Then watching the big tourny today, I felt like the Mileena in the top 8 was doing roughly the same thing... but problems arose once Wong started accurately blocking the rolls.

I really dig her aesthetic, and I love that she can actually confirm combos unlike a lot of characters... but damnit if she isn't frustrating to play, and her frame data makes me sad.

In piercing I try to zone a lot and make them get reckless. If you time the low sai correctly you'll duck their projectile and hit with yours. They'll eventually try to get in.

 

[1man3letters]

Some very basic Reptile Matchup notes courtest of the ol notebook.

F312~slash = Reversal punish with ball for a free 29% (ball~B3~teleport~sai B21~2+3)

Anytime we see a forceball, EX Telekick immediately for a full combo punish.

Reptile's B22~throw = Full combo punishable with ball for 29%

Dash = Full combo punishable.

21~roll B3~teleport~sai B21~2+3= 32%

Easy Punish (ie online punish) Roll punisher = 29% (see above)

Reptiles B2= Safe, but he has to respect a pressure string. (f4 vs ex roll)

B34=Safe But he has to respect a pressure string. (f4 vs ex roll)

post like this and your other mu musings should prop go in mu thread rather than general?
be easier to find when people are looking for mu stuff

 

[Gefen]

Any query on my OS post?

 

[MsMiharo]

Ok tried more corner stuff. The piercing setup is more of a 33/33/33. you can go for a hard read if they're jumping out a lot and just telekick them. But anyways for ravenous you can do this. This setup cannot be jumped. Only way to get out is to delay the wake up and some armored moves.

 

[Sultani]

How does everyone feel about Mileena being underrated? The biggest gripe I'm seeing about her is the 50/50. Yes, it is weak, but everyone should take a step back and really look at her strengths. We all know she has a low projectile that ducks under high projectiles, but no one is talking about her ball roll and strong it is. Her tools are blatantly for anti zoning and a defensive/punish play style. Lets touch on what her 7 frame ball roll can do;

1. It dodges projectiles and gives a easy 24% punish.
2. It's a great anti air
3. It can punish a lot of pokes
4. It's fast enough to punish strings with gaping holes

I believe it's one of the better specials in the game because of how it leads to easy damage. Of course its extremely punishable on block, but you can't just throw it out there. You have to wait and react. Bait someone to do something silly like throw a projectile or jump and punish accordingly. The more I get use to the game, the more I'm seeing how effective she is. B12 is a solid whiff punisher that can easily be cancelled. She has great tools imo. Thoughts?

50/50s aren't mixups. The biggest problem she has is that without meter, she doesn't have either one. Without meter, just block low and she can't hit you.

The really good characters have legitimate overheads that are literally three times faster than hers.

Roll is 8 frames, not 7. It's -30. There are characters with 5 frame punishes that are safe.

Her low projectile doesn't go under all projectiles because there are several that hit mid, and it's -8 on hit.

Regular teleport kick is full punishable on hit, and so is low sai from point blank range. cancelling into low sai from point blank range is her only option to cancel into a low up close besides F234.

Roll and EX roll are the only things that she really has going for her, and EX roll does in fact give her some 50/50s from 4 different strings which all can lead to good damage. She can excel wth meter, but the best scenario she can get with pressure is a coin flip. They guess right, you eat at least 35%. They guess wrong, you get about 35%. You have to spend a meter bar to risk that, and it's the best thing she has.

Her best variation is her best variation because it makes her footsies just slightly better from one string.

For a character that's so meter dependent, she should have ways to build meter more quickly.

She needs to be played as a wiff punish character which is a little different from her mk9 version and she has two good strings to do it with, but she has some frames and tools that really don't make alot of sense to me.

If there are other specials in this game that are punishable on hit, I'd like to know what they are. Mileena has two.

 

[x TeeJay o]

50/50s aren't mixups. The biggest problem she has is that without meter, she doesn't have either one. Without meter, just block low and she can't hit you.

The really good characters have legitimate overheads that are literally three times faster than hers.

Roll is 8 frames, not 7. It's -30. There are characters with 5 frame punishes that are safe.

Her low projectile doesn't go under all projectiles because there are several that hit mid, and it's -8 on hit.

Regular teleport kick is full punishable on hit, and so is low sai from point blank range. cancelling into low sai from point blank range is her only option to cancel into a low up close besides F234.

Roll and EX roll are the only things that she really has going for her, and EX roll does in fact give her some 50/50s from 4 different strings which all can lead to good damage. She can excel wth meter, but the best scenario she can get with pressure is a coin flip. They guess right, you eat at least 35%. They guess wrong, you get about 35%. You have to spend a meter bar to risk that, and it's the best thing she has.

Her best variation is her best variation because it makes her footsies just slightly better from one string.

For a character that's so meter dependent, she should have ways to build meter more quickly.

She needs to be played as a wiff punish character which is a little different from her mk9 version and she has two good strings to do it with, but she has some frames and tools that really don't make alot of sense to me.

If there are other specials in this game that are punishable on hit, I'd like to know what they are. Mileena has two.

THIS !!!

 

[Sultani]

Ok tried more corner stuff. The piercing setup is more of a 33/33/33. you can go for a hard read if they're jumping out a lot and just telekick them. But anyways for ravenous you can do this. This setup cannot be jumped. Only way to get out is to delay the wake up and some armored moves.

so basically the bite puts you in range for either F4 or EX roll.

This is just a meter dependent mixup. It's not a 50/50. 50/50 means the only options available are to GUESS high or low. This isn't a guess and those aren;t the only options.

tech roll backdash would work against the low. Armor might get stuffed by the EX roll.

If you chose to block,you could just crouch block and then stand up if Mileena started flashing.

This same type of thing exists anywhere on the screen from the hit advantage of a single poke.

If I was going to use a corner setup that depended on meter use to work, I'd use F1 starters to stuff the wakeup armor option and the backdash since it's 2 hits. With meter, F12 is a true 50/50 because it's either F12B4 (low) or F12 EX roll (overhead).

 

[MsMiharo]

so basically the bite puts you in range for either F4 or EX roll.

This is just a meter dependent mixup. It's not a 50/50. 50/50 means the only options available are to GUESS high or low. This isn't a guess and those aren;t the only options.

tech roll backdash would work against the low. Armor might get stuffed by the EX roll.

If you chose to block,you could just crouch block and then stand up if Mileena started flashing.

This same type of thing exists anywhere on the screen from the hit advantage of a single poke.

it's a hard knockdown and catches backdashes. And it being meter dependent is true for Mileena in general.

If you can react to the EX roll then you won't ever be put in the corner by Mileena to start with.

 

[EndofGameBoss]

50/50s aren't mixups. The biggest problem she has is that without meter, she doesn't have either one. Without meter, just block low and she can't hit you.

The really good characters have legitimate overheads that are literally three times faster than hers.

Roll is 8 frames, not 7. It's -30. There are characters with 5 frame punishes that are safe.

Her low projectile doesn't go under all projectiles because there are several that hit mid, and it's -8 on hit.

Regular teleport kick is full punishable on hit, and so is low sai from point blank range. cancelling into low sai from point blank range is her only option to cancel into a low up close besides F234.

Roll and EX roll are the only things that she really has going for her, and EX roll does in fact give her some 50/50s from 4 different strings which all can lead to good damage. She can excel wth meter, but the best scenario she can get with pressure is a coin flip. They guess right, you eat at least 35%. They guess wrong, you get about 35%. You have to spend a meter bar to risk that, and it's the best thing she has.

Her best variation is her best variation because it makes her footsies just slightly better from one string.

For a character that's so meter dependent, she should have ways to build meter more quickly.

She needs to be played as a wiff punish character which is a little different from her mk9 version and she has two good strings to do it with, but she has some frames and tools that really don't make alot of sense to me.

If there are other specials in this game that are punishable on hit, I'd like to know what they are. Mileena has two.

1. Ball Roll is 7 frames. If it is 8 frames then every 8 frame move listed in the game is 9 frames.
2. Her low projectile goes under high projectiles. Even if it's -8 frames you'd have to be pretty bad to throw it out up close. Also, her ball roll goes under mid projectiles for a easy 24% combo.
3. I've yet to find a legit use for tele kick since ball roll deals with all situations you would use it
4. I feel like you're getting mixups and 50/50's confused. F3 is a overhead and F4 is a low and both can be cancelled. They're terrible though.
5. I agree about the meter and being negative on hit though.

She is solid if played properly, but I still hope they fix a few things of hers.

EDIT; I just checked the frame data. When was ball roll changed to 8 frames? Has it been 8 frames all along? If so, then the frame data in this game is horribly inaccurate.

 

[Gefen]

f3 should be blocked on reaction by any half decent player

 

[Sultani]

F4 catches the backdash? Well thats cool then.

I'm not confused about the difference between a 50/50 and a mixup. At all. I'm one of the few people on here that actually seesm to know the difference. I dont count f3 or f4 (which is probably unfair) because you dont need to block f3. Ever.

I know low sai up close is bad. Thats kinda my point. Why is it so bad when it hits?

Its a variation specific projectile. How do you think kung lao players would react if low hat was -8?

 

[TheGabStandard]

EDIT; I just checked the frame data. When was ball roll changed to 8 frames? Has it been 8 frames all along? If so, then the frame data in this game is horribly inaccurate.

It happened in a patch, I believe there was an extra startup frame added to the movelist of every character.

 

[Sultani]

It happened in a patch, I believe there was an extra startup frame added to the movelist of every character.

Yep. But since everything got an extra frame, its basically the same as it was before.

I just cant get over some things that are so blatantly inconsistent though... already beat low sai and kls low hat into the ground..

But look at mileena and reptile. His f21 is just as good as mileenas b12 in piercing, but he can cancel into an overhead or a low without meter.

Both have overheads that are safe on block, but his is three times faster.

Mileena needs a low cancelling option that isnt so negative and plus frames on regular tk.

She needs her d1 and xray fixed as well. And ex telekick needs increased hitbox on the 2nd hit.

Then she'd be fine.

 

[qspec]

1. Ball Roll is 7 frames. If it is 8 frames then every 8 frame move listed in the game is 9 frames.
2. Her low projectile goes under high projectiles. Even if it's -8 frames you'd have to be pretty bad to throw it out up close. Also, her ball roll goes under mid projectiles for a easy 24% combo.
3. I've yet to find a legit use for tele kick since ball roll deals with all situations you would use it
4. I feel like you're getting mixups and 50/50's confused. F3 is a overhead and F4 is a low and both can be cancelled. They're terrible though.
5. I agree about the meter and being negative on hit though.

She is solid if played properly, but I still hope they fix a few things of hers.

EDIT; I just checked the frame data. When was ball roll changed to 8 frames? Has it been 8 frames all along? If so, then the frame data in this game is horribly inaccurate.

The problem with low sai is that at -8, you're guaranteeing that they are going to get closer to you. It is effectively a cap on our zoning. You may get a few % damage done, but they are coming.

Telekick works fairly well as an anti-air (except when it doesn't). I'd say I like it more than air sai which has enough recovery that people can run up and put pressure on from huge distances.

I just don't think she's 'solid' anymore than all of the characters are solid with enough time put into them. She seems low tier for sure. To make anything meaningful happen, she's got to take -30 risks and so her version of a 50/50 is less "guess right or get hit" and more "guess right, I take damage; guess wrong, you take damage".

Okay fair enough... so how about playing a strong neutral game. She's no Erron Black after all. Her range... her range! She doesn't have any. Even the abominable f3 has less range than it initially looks like. She's certainly not out competing the neutral monsters like D'vorah. She's scraping the bottom of the barrel here. Maybe this would be overcome-able were her moves fast... but they aren't. Out of all of the characters I've tried, her frame data is some of the worst I've seen. She has no reliable pokes. They are either slow or minus on block. Like I said before, I'm actually horrified to touch a button when I do something that is +0.

Once people reliably start blocking ex-roll... we're going to start getting reliably blown up.