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General/Other The Deathstroke Anti-Nerf Coalition

RYX

BIG PUSHER
If DS was garbage I would've dropped him after the 1st week. I didn't even like him in the beginning due to how negative and non-pushbacking the guns were 'cause of how I kept getting bodied by the Very Hard difficulty in Battles.

But no, I see that he's a solid character. Although I can tell that there are others that are far better than him.
I really think he's going to be top tier when instant air gunshots are perfected and his up-close/offensive hit and run style of taking damage off safe 50/50s is learned to be abused and switched through.

And that he can phase out the most of the cast with sheer burst power. I love that shit.
 

Jy0

Destroyer of Lazy
I don't think he'll be top tier but it's too early to tell... I definitely think he's solid though! Makes life for some other characters hell. I actually tried using him the other day and it's not too bad. I didn't feel like I was cheating lol... my Batman is waaaay better!
 
I really think he's going to be top tier when instant air gunshots are perfected and his up-close/offensive hit and run style of taking damage off safe 50/50s is learned to be abused and switched through.

And that he can phase out the most of the cast with sheer burst power. I love that shit.
I gotta say i don't think he's top tier all the top tier guys have r strong in both worlds....not just one.....plus DS's mobility is a serious issue. U get pinned in a corner u really only have a few ways out. Sword spin....or a good jump out read....maybe if the player doesn't know what's going on a sword flip but that is punishable and will put u right back in the corner receiving pressure.
 

RYX

BIG PUSHER
I gotta say i don't think he's top tier all the top tier guys have r strong in both worlds....not just one.....plus DS's mobility is a serious issue. U get pinned in a corner u really only have a few ways out. Sword spin....or a good jump out read....maybe if the player doesn't know what's going on a sword flip but that is punishable and will put u right back in the corner receiving pressure.
His mobility is fine and his forward dash is great. Almost everyone is fucked in the corner.

He has top notch zoning and a 50/50 up close that compliments it. He can not be out of the top 15, I'd say top 10 for sure.
 
This seemed to be as good of a place as any to post this. THTB and Zer0 Hundr3d were having some really good matches, and I realized it was a great example of not only intelligent DS zoning, but also of how to get through intelligent zoning.
The actual zoning starts at 0:34. GL gradually backs DS into a corner and manages to get in some solid damage before DS gets out and re-initiates the zoning war. Hopefully you can see that it's not impossible to get around a good DS player's zoning, even if it is difficult. Yeah, THTB lost that match, but he'd already won multiple matches against both Zer0's and my Deathstrokes using those exact strategies. I think dealing with Deathstroke's zoning is on par with dealing with Nightwing's or Flash's rushdown; it's just a difference of space. Anyway, hopefully this video will help a few pro-nerfers see the light. Thanks for watching!
GL does something that most players maybe don't see.....it's not just good reads but dictating where DS should shoot.....kinda of a baiting tactic. Most players i've played against crouch block all the time unless they r dashing in. By stand blocking and then crouch blocking unpredictably, and on reaction, DS is forced to choose to follow or predict. Generally u naturally will just follow...leaving openings for the opponent to dash in or even jump or a jumping counter zone.....but of coarse if he has full meter good luck. There is only a few of the cast members who can still get in.
 
His mobility is fine and his forward dash is great. Almost everyone is fucked in the corner.

He has top notch zoning and a 50/50 up close that compliments it. He can not be out of the top 15, I'd say top 10 for sure.
i would say right now, mid tier is likely gonna be his home. I can name many of the cast members that r better than he is....or give him a tough to even match up....even if he zones. Aquaman, Flash, Sinestro, GL, Superman, Raven, Killer frost, Ares, black adam, Ga and hawkgirl....all these guys from my experience r 5/5 mu wise or maybe 6/4 for guys like flash who really don't have zoning tools but if he gets in he can get a 40% plus ruthless juggle. Everyone else on that list can zone with him but has better mobility so they can also rush him down.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
I don't see how he can't be top tier when he has an answer to everything. He can't be outzoned, he threatens the entire screen, and he's got easy 30%+ combos off of 50/50's that send the opponent back to full-screen. He also has some ridiculous frame traps to work with, and his normals have very good range.
 
I don't see how he can't be top tier when he has an answer to everything. He can't be outzoned, he threatens the entire screen, and he's got easy 30%+ combos off of 50/50's that send the opponent back to full-screen. He also has some ridiculous frame traps to work with, and his normals have very good range.
Top tier would imply that he has many one sided match ups....which it's still really early to tell but i don't think he does. It's gonna be his lack of mobility that sets him apart and that 50/50 u speak of....a lot of other character have too....and while his normals have range (J3) they also have slow start ups. All he has for mobility is his dash....no flight....no air dash.....and his back dash is pretty weak and doesn't cover much space. To play his zoning game he has no choice but to back himself into the corner. Also most of the cast can contend zoning wise....but he can not contend with a good rush down. If u play rush down against a good batz....ur gonna get blowing up. He is not as all powerful as ppl think at all. Is he a good pick....of coarse, especially right now cause not many ppl can simply just cannot get in....but in a month from now i bet he's not even an issue anymore.
 

Jy0

Destroyer of Lazy
I don't see how he can't be top tier when he has an answer to everything. He can't be outzoned, he threatens the entire screen, and he's got easy 30%+ combos off of 50/50's that send the opponent back to full-screen. He also has some ridiculous frame traps to work with, and his normals have very good range.
he's not the best zoner though. and even matchup batman gets free get in with Bats as well. he's good for sure but I don't think he's top right now and don't see how he can rise. maybe top mid tier but it's too early to tell on that anyway.
 
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Deleted member 5032

Guest
he's not the best zoner though. and even matchup batman gets free get in with Bats as well. he's good for sure but I don't think he's top right now and don't see how he can rise. maybe top mid tier but it's too early to tell on that anyway.
Who would you say is a better zoner? It seems like Cyborg is the better zoner on paper, but I've yet to fight one so it's hard for me to say. I also need to get in some more MU experience against Batman. Right now he does get in free, but I think I might know a way around that. I will say that the Black Adam MU seems incredibly difficult for DS. BA gets in for free, his Dive Kick beats out Sword Flip about 90% of the time, and he can punish a blocked Sword Flip for around 45% damage every time. He can also counter-zone DS pretty effectively. I was not able to find a good strategy for this MU after about 15 games with Gruntypants BA.
Top tier would imply that he has many one sided match ups....which it's still really early to tell but i don't think he does. It's gonna be his lack of mobility that sets him apart and that 50/50 u speak of....a lot of other character have too....and while his normals have range (J3) they also have slow start ups. All he has for mobility is his dash....no flight....no air dash.....and his back dash is pretty weak and doesn't cover much space. To play his zoning game he has no choice but to back himself into the corner. Also most of the cast can contend zoning wise....but he can not contend with a good rush down. If u play rush down against a good batz....ur gonna get blowing up. He is not as all powerful as ppl think at all. Is he a good pick....of coarse, especially right now cause not many ppl can simply just cannot get in....but in a month from now i bet he's not even an issue anymore.
When I top tier, I'm talking around top 5. It's still super early to discuss specific positions, but I don't think his mobility is as big of a concern as you make it seem. The way his zoning is designed, the responsibility of mobility lies entirely upon his opponent. The only time DS has to back into a corner is when his opponent is making good reads and not getting knocked back by connected gunshots. It's true that most characters have good 50/50's, but a single mistake allows DS to deal around 34%-36% and send you back to full-screen. He also can't be rushed down due to Sword Spin having wake-up invincibility, though some cross-ups can still catch him or mess up his inputs.

As far as one-sided MU's go, it seems like he's got more than a few. Hawkwoman, Lex, Grundy, Bane, Joker, Sinestro; basically any character that doesn't have a good full-screen answer to his zoning. Some of those MU's might end up being closer to 5/5's once new tech starts being discovered, but right now most of them are 6/4's at best.

Overall, I'd say he has the tools necessary to secure a top 5 position on the charts. He's got his flaws, which every character has, but I feel like his strengths far outweigh his weaknesses.
 

Jy0

Destroyer of Lazy
i think Bats supes aqua GL Black adam are all better.. there's 5 right there... still early though and it's just my opinion.
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
No one ever said that he was not one of the better characters. He obviously is. But there are several characters who have a lot of powerful tactics.

- Aquaman's footsies and trait
- Ares's resets
- Batman's combos and trait
- Black Adam's dive kicks and damage output
- Doomsday's trait and up close game with d,f+2
- Superman's f+2,3 and damage output with trait

And so on. But people are not playing attention.

By the way, sword flip has very few wake up invincibility frames, according to REO and Tom.
 

Crathen

Death is my business
When will we stop pretending he has a good midrange game with his normal?Seriously find me a normal with more range than BA b2 and don't mention f3 because it's slow
 

Jy0

Destroyer of Lazy
Yeah DS is definitely good. right now he'd be in my top 8 or so. but that's about top mid tier to me. still early though.
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
When will we stop pretending he has a good midrange game with his normal?Seriously find me a normal with more range than BA b2 and don't mention f3 because it's slow
Superman's f+2 has slightly more range and is 8F. f+2,3 xx super breath is +1. Super breath MB leads to 50% combos if you activate trait after f+2,3.

Why was Death saying that this character sucks? Complete fool.
 

SquirtMcGirt

Purple balls covering the screen
Superman's f+2 has slightly more range and is 8F. f+2,3 xx super breath is +1. Super breath MB leads to 50% combos if you activate trait after f+2,3.

Why was Death saying that this character sucks? Complete fool.
Forgot decent zoning too lol

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Forgot decent zoning too lol

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
Yeah. Speaking of Superman's zoning game...

Some Scrub on that Facebook Page said:
You have to create a patch or something against Superman lazer spamming and Dearthstroke shoots spamming!!!!
The timing is too short between the lazer and an other one... then they are too Many spammer with them on the online mode...
Even if superman is the most "powerful" hero, there is no balance between characters...
( and don't Forget the Sinestro meteor too )
LOL.

Pathetic.
 

Gruntypants

THE MUFFINS ARE BEEFY
I don't think Black Adam can get in for free I usually got hit by your guns a shit ton before I was able to dash/jump my way in. Also Black Adam gets 31% off of a blocked sword flip, not 45%. When you were playing me it seemed your sword flip beat my divekick 90% of the time but maybe it's just because I do lower divekicks. I do agree that Deathstroke can get counter zoned well since BA gets like 25% off of an EX black magic from full screen.

Like I said before, Deathstroke is FINE THE WAY HE IS. He doesn't need nerfs.
 

GNG Iniquity

#bufftaquito #punchwalk #whiffycage
19 pages of this? Seriously?

Hey, guys, Sagat from 1991 called. He said you should stop bitching. Strong zoners have existed for 22 years now.
 

GGA HAN

Galloping Ghost Arcade
I don't think Black Adam can get in for free I usually got hit by your guns a shit ton before I was able to dash/jump my way in. Also Black Adam gets 31% off of a blocked sword flip, not 45%. When you were playing me it seemed your sword flip beat my divekick 90% of the time but maybe it's just because I do lower divekicks. I do agree that Deathstroke can get counter zoned well since BA gets like 25% off of an EX black magic from full screen.

Like I said before, Deathstroke is FINE THE WAY HE IS. He doesn't need nerfs.
Yo, I've got some new stuff to show you. If you get a full screen black magic (non MB), you can convert it to 33%. And I think you can get 40% meterless of the blocked sword flip. I'm going to make a video in a day or two showing all this stuff.

Sent from my phone, using the keypad.
 

SquirtMcGirt

Purple balls covering the screen
Yeah. Speaking of Superman's zoning game...



LOL.

Pathetic.
This is so sad. :( I decided to pick up superman because he was a badass up close but still has decent zoning...and cant the whole cast dash duck the heat zap lol?